Fireplace advice, Part 2

[Mousefield]

In the first house we built in 1980 we put in a wood stove. I did all the work on installing the stove and pipe. Went straight up through two floors. Put in single wall pipe to about 1 ft from the ceiling. In the pics of our current 11 year old house we had built for us the builder installed the wood stove. Same thing, single wall close to the ceiling and then it changed to double wall. I put in the same in my shop, I installed single pipe and then about 1 ft from the ceiling went to double wall. I made sure it was done to our code in case we ever had a fire, didn't want the insurance company to look for an out as far as paying a claim.

 

[inveresk]

We have five woodstoves on our property - 2 in our cottage, 1 in the main house, 1 in my office and another in my workshop. We have 2 Vermont Castings, 2 Pacific Energy and a Scan Andersen 8.

The Scan seems to burn better than the others, possibly because the flue is longer. Neither of the Pacific Energy stoves has a removable ash pan so cleaning them out is a pain. The Vermont Castings have smaller glass in the doors so less flame is visible.

The Scan is the stove that produces least ash, a sign of very efficient burning and also in my opinion looks the best. The Pacific Energy stoves were cheapest, probably because some of the casing is pressed metal whereas the other makes are all cast.

We burn around 4 cords a year which I invariably get from windfall. It takes me a weekend to buck, split and stack and it takes a little time each day to service and clean the stoves in winter. It's worth it because it's essentially free heat and the quality of that heat makes the effort worthwhile.

It's still nice when spring comes around and I can forget the daily grind of fire lighting. There are usually 2 - 3 stoves going at one time during the heating season.

 

[MossRoad]

A couple people have mentioned insurance. This is important stuff. All I had to do was give the insurance company a copy of the paid installation order from the professional installer. It added I think $25.00 a year to my premium. Pretty easy.
Be sure to check with your insurance company before you begin.

 

[charlz]

I think single wall inside the living space is a result of 'how it has always been done' with single wall being used all the way up. Later using double and triple wall for enclosed spaces such as attics became required due to all the house fires. Single wall is cheaper so that probably contributes largely to its continued use inside the living space.

I would be leery of getting too large a stove for your climate. They can and will run you right out of the house if you get a big hot fire going. A little dinky fire inside a big stove just doesn't look right so you tend to add more wood

An ash pan is very handy but you could also invest in an ash vacuum if it turns out the stove you want doesn't have an ash vacuum. I have a fairly small stove with no ash pan in my shop and have to clean the ashes out every few days which is a pain when they are still hot and not to mention very, very messy.

 

[MossRoad]

On my Napoleon 1400 I can burn continuous 24/7 for 10-14 days before I have to push the ashes through the floor opening into the ash pan. I can do that 2-3 times before I have to empty the ash pan.

I'm talking dead of winter, load the stove completely 3 times a day and maybe more.

The stove is very efficient, in my opinion.

 

[MossRoad]

Eddie,
One more thing to mention about the Napoleon 1400 stove.... log length.

The literature used to say it would take 22" logs. However, that was on a diagonal and quite deceiving. It would actually only take 18" logs side to side. The current literature is much more accurate saying max log length is 18" with 16" being ideal.

I cut all my wood 16" and it works perfect at that length. I can load them left/right or front/back depending on how I want to burn.

Loading it front to back you can put in more wood, so you would think it will burn longer. However, it seems to burn more efficiently if I load the wood left right. The problem with left to right is the wood can roll forward, against the glass door. If wood touches the glass when it burns, you get stained glass as the air wash cannot come down across the glass. Once that happens, you get to look at the stain until you shut down the stove and let the glass cool to a point where you can clean it. That will probably not be a problem for you in your climate. When I burn continuous, it can be 2 weeks between shutdowns so I can let the stove cool down for ash removal and window glass cleaning.

The stove really has a neat air wash system to keep the glass clean. It is very interesting to watch the smoke circulate on light up and then once it gets going to watch th flame patterns.

 

[scoutcub]

This has been an excellent thread/discussion on wood stoves, very informative. I have nothing to contribute, but lurking and gathering information as I'm contemplating burning wood in the future. I do remember a friend of mine years ago installed a huge "eagle" wood stove in his log cabin, and tied in his hot water lines for the house....seemed to work very well. Never heard of anyone else doing that yet......
so thanks to Eddie for the thread!

 

[Egon]

However, it seems to burn more efficiently if I load the wood left right

Moss, what happens if you reverse the procedure to loading right left??

"eagle" wood stove in his log cabin, and tied in his hot water lines for the house....seemed to work very well. Never heard of anyone else doing that yet......

There was a time many of the kitchen wood stoves had a cast iron water heating manifold in the fire box. Then a large hot water tank sitting behind the stove.

Presently you can get water heating coils placed in a wood burning stove. It must be properly installed and receive the correct certification stamp of approval.

 

[keegs]

Here's my idea from about 10 years ago Eddie....a little arched recess. The room is about 400 sq. ft. The stove (Jotul 602) might otherwise be too much for the room but there's stairs that take the heat to the floors above. We also just keep it burning at night and on the weekends. It's great!!

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz215/keegsbucket/-062208_1816b.jpg

 

[charlz]

Presently you can get water heating coils placed in a wood burning stove. It must be properly installed and receive the correct certification stamp of approval.

For very good reason. There was a lady back home who had such a system _removed_. The guy cut the lines near the back of the wood stove and capped them off. The next time she used the stove the resulting steam explosion blew the wood stove out through the wall and I think through the roll-up garage door as well. The guy never thought about removing the water from the heating coil inside the stove.

 

[Egon]

Steam can make a bang!:thumbsup:

 

[swmich42]

We have a Hearthstone Heritage. This is our primary heat source for our cottage. (1400 Sq Ft) Does an excellent job. The structure has not been insulated properly, and we have stayed comfortable for days in below zero temps. We load it up, and can leave it for 8 - 10 hours. Wood is our fuel of choice. Only takes some muscle to process it. The Stove has two main doors, front and side. The side door is very convienient to the load wood without opening the front of the stove. I would suggest a non-catalytic stove, due to maintenance and cost to replace. You can still get close to the catalytic efficiency. Craigslist is great. Hope you find what you are looking for.

Stove Details | Hearthstone Stoves

 

[EddieWalker]

The hard part is over. I made a decision and bought the used Napolean 1400. It's a pedistal style with an ash pan in it. The guy bought it two years ago to heat his moble home in Wisconsin. When he moved here six months ago, he brought it with him. He loved it so much that he said he couldn't leave it behind. The house he bought has a soapstove stove in it already and his wife likes it better. He doesn't, but she made the decission.

It's in excellent condition, and to my eye, it's beautiful. I really like it and I'm looking forward to installing it in my house and burning some wood this winter.

I'm going to take out part of my wood floor and install tile. I'm going to leave the walls alone and mount it 12 inches away from the walls, which is what they recomend. I might even go more, but won't know until I do some measuring and thinking. I don't want to do anything on the walls. In the pictures that I've seen, I like this look the best.

I'm going to go with a straight pipe up into the ceiling and out the roof like you guys recomended. It came with an extendable, doule wall, black pipe that I wil use on the inside. I need to get the rest. Does anybody have a good online source?

My brother has a ranch with all sorts of massive oak trees that have droped branches that are a foot to two feet thick. He also has a 27 ton, Troy Bilt, log splitter that I'm going to use. I'll go split a couple cords at his place and be all set for winter. Since I don't have a clue how much wood I will need, I'm going to probably end up with too much, if there is such a thing.

16 inches sounds perfect. Thank you.

And thank you to everyone for your advice. I'm sure I'll be back with more questions, and for sure, will post updates on the install. I have an idea that might turn out pretty nice, or be a disaster. The only way to know for sure is to give it a try.

Eddie

 

[keegs]

looking forward to some pics

 

[/pine]

just curious...does a stove like that have a way of using outside (combustion) air?

 

[PILOON]

A stone mason once warned me against drawing outside air for steel lined fireplace boxes.
He claimed that the outside air, which is generally humid will rot out the fire box.
He had to rebuild many firplaces due to that.
Makes sense to me.
He suggested better to crack open the closest window.

 

[Mousefield]

Will look forward to pics as you get it installed. Oak will burn well and you can never have enough split wood. Ideally you should dry the wood for at least 6 months if not more. This helps it burn better and also less chance of creosote in the chimney. Just keep it under cover and it lasts for many years just waiting for your wood stove.

 

[/pine]

A stone mason once warned me against drawing outside air for steel lined fireplace boxes.
He claimed that the outside air, which is generally humid will rot out the fire box.
He had to rebuild many firplaces due to that.
Makes sense to me.
He suggested better to crack open the closest window.

Interesting...Although I would think that when outside air is drafting through the box when it's not in use would tend to be more damaging (has time to condense) than when the box is at working temperatures...seems like a cut off damper on the cumbustion air vent would prevent the drafting and condensation when the box is not in use??

We have a "pre-fab" fireplace with a masonry lined steel box that uses outside air for combustion and it is still in good shape after 30 years...there is a cut off for the air but I have never bothered to close it...

 

[/pine]

...Just keep it under cover and it lasts for many years just waiting for your wood stove...

I have found that is also best to keep it stacked off the ground if it is going to be stored for more than one season...to prevent worms and termites from eating it up...pallets work OK...

 

[Mousefield]

...Just keep it under cover and it lasts for many years just waiting for your wood stove...

I have found that is also best to keep it stacked off the ground if it is going to be stored for more than one season...to prevent worms and termites from eating it up...pallets work OK...

Mine has either plastic or old plastic tarps under it just for that reason. Pallets work well as you mentioned, I would still put plastic or tarp under the pallets as they will start to rot as well if the ground gets wet. I have about a 5 year supply and sure don't want it to start rotting.