Electrical PVC verse Regular PVC

[sparkkky]

I think Sparkkky is trying to say that if you are planning on making your property open to the public, it would be is in your best intrest to follow the standards. One accident, electrical or not could turn in to big problems.

More so I am trying to warn him about doing wiring for money, especially since he is so adamant in regards to the code and the law!

Eddie, you just don't get it code is safety and you are thumbing you nose at safety.

How many here would at least try to follow codes and use proper materials for dependabilty and safety? Eddie you will be in the minority.

What if a city inspector saw this here in your area and inspected you work? Even though you say you are not governed by law are you saying you don't do illegal wiring in any city limits for money?

 

[sparkkky]

Sparky why are you against general home inspectors. When someone I sell real estate to wants a home inspector I encourage that. The cost of a home inspector is very minor comparted to the cost of a house. If you know noting about owning a home you get a licensed person to come and inspect it for you. The home inspector generally will look at things you did not think to. Did a home inspector not aprove one of your wireing jobs at some time in the past ?

In my area Generals are just glorified handy men with no training refer back to the pictures of what they have approved. Sellers want a general as they have no complete training or knowlege in the trades and they don't know what there looking for. Buyers always get cheated sometimes the service is not up to code or done by amatures a big one I see is 1950's houses with 60A meterbases and #6 feeding 200A panels. My best advice is to get tradesmen up on codes if your buying I see about four inspections a day about five to ten of them a year even get anything right, the one I see most is double tap breakers and thats not always a problem, and most don't even know how to wire a GFCI.


And no I do not have to answer to generals, I answer to the citys and state.

Joel Jones
Jones Electric Inc.
Lic. #29888

Edited becaused I missed you are a realtor. Be careful to make your clients chose there own inspectors, you do not want to look like you are in cahoots or steered them towards anyone. Realtors thier companys and general home inspectors all have in the past paid for repairs alot of them service upgrades.

 

[EddieWalker]

Sparkkky,

I think your the one who doesn't get it. I put in a light a hundred feet from my house. I used 12/2 direct burial line and sleeved it in thin wall purpe one inch pvc pipe. I also shot some expanding foam in the ends of the thinwall to trap and isolate water vapor.

I also said I do not do electrical work for a liveing and don't want to.

Where is the danger? What gives you the right to insult me with your wacky accusations?

If I'd just put the wire in the ground and not protected it with anything, than I'd be up to code. I added a sleeve over it to protect it from rodents and you'd think I'd cut the ground wires in somebodies bathroom. Get a grip and realize that it's not a big deal. Nobody is gonna get hurt, there will be no fire and nobody will die from it.

I've never said that I don't follow any code. I do when it's needed. This run was to code until I used purple pipe. Now I'm in violation of code. OK, so what? Really, what's the big deal?

You have crossed the line of silly and gone to the point rediculous.

If somebody else wants to run a line like I did, I highly recomend it. It's better than code and you know it. The color of the pipe is your only basis for making your accusations. Your comments that the wire will get hot in the pipe is silly and you know it.

As for an electrical inspector comeing out here, it will never happen. I live in an area that has no code. No permits, no code and no inspectors.

Eddie

 

[stumpfield]

I came into this thread late.... Here's my 2 cents. I'm an electrical engineer. I do know a little bit about the NEC. Some application I designed doesn't even covered by the NEC. There's nothing wrong or less safe with what Eddie did. He uses direct burial cable. It doesn't matter he buried the cable with dirt or some cheap pipe and foam then dirt over that. If he uses the correct wire size for his application and the correct depth for his area then there's nothing wrong. If he wants to pour concrete around the pipe to further protect the wires, then that's his business. That's with code or no code!
I would not do it the way he did. It's unnecessary and not a typcial installation method. I would use the proper conduit or no conduit at all if using direct burial cable. The jacket on the cable is the proper conduit.

 

[sparkkky]

Eddie I am not harping on what you do at your house the big picture and what you just addressed is I hope you are not wiring for money!

Know you are a handy man, am I wrong?

 

[sparkkky]

I came into this thread late.... Here's my 2 cents. I'm an electrical engineer. I do know a little bit about the NEC. Some application I designed doesn't even covered by the NEC. There's nothing wrong or less safe with what Eddie did. He uses direct burial cable. It doesn't matter he buried the cable with dirt or some cheap pipe and foam then dirt over that. If he uses the correct wire size for his application and the correct depth for his area then there's nothing wrong. If he wants to pour concrete around the pipe to further protect the wires, then that's his business. That's with code or no code!
I would not do it the way he did. It's unnecessary and not a typcial installation method. I would use the proper conduit or no conduit at all if using direct burial cable. The jacket on the cable is the proper conduit.

Then you should have some idea of how to figure condiut fill and how to derate conductors. You should know that packing any electrical pipe full of insulating foam would be a bad idea? Other than that you hit the nail right on the head.

 

[sparkkky]

Done, stick a sharp fork in me.

Merry Christmas!

 

[gemini5362]

.

Joel Jones
Jones Electric Inc.
Lic. #29888

Edited becaused I missed you are a realtor. Be careful to make your clients chose there own inspectors, you do not want to look like you are in cahoots or steered them towards anyone. Realtors thier companys and general home inspectors all have in the past paid for repairs alot of them service upgrades.

Thank you for the advice. I do have my real estate license and keep it active I am more of an investor than an agent. When I first got my license I went to work for a friend of mine in a century 21 office. I left there because they were getting too busy to suit my amount of time to spend in that buisness. While I was there we had a typed sheet with a list of all the licensed inspectors in the area, If someone came in that was not on the list and asked us to we included them even though some of them were from towns an hour away. When anyone said they wanted a home inspection done we handed them the list and said pick whoever you want to make your deal with them concerning priceing and have them call us to make an apointment for access to the house. The only service I provide in that arangement is to open the house. I dont make recomendations

 

[gemini5362]

Sparky are you in the Oklahoma City area. I am going to be in Norman the last two weeks of January going to a class.

 

[sparkkky]

Yukon, whats the class? My wife has her realty Lic. but she wire's with me most days.

 

[mudcat]

Well it looks like this one is winding down. Even though it was a whole lot about nothing, it was pretty darn entertaining.

 

[GaryBDavis]

When I graduated from college with my Electrical Engineering degree, I didn’t know jack squat about wiring a house. I had to learn the trade like anyone else. Knowing the theory behind it made it easier but also made me a bit cocky at times.

I’ve met electricians who knew code inside and out but their lack of electricity fundamentals was scary. But there are just as many electrical engineers who I wouldn’t trust to change a light bulb, much less wire my house.

Contributing to the hijacking of my own post…

 

[gemini5362]

Hmm dont tell Eddie but it is advanced computer networking.
I know where yukon is my son used to live in watonga while he was working at the prison.

 

[Farwell]

One of the first things I learned from reading the TBN threads, it is seldom a good idea to bring up electrical questions or to offer an answer because almost without fail a war of words and opinions begin. I have asked questions in the past and my threads were deleted, I had to go else where to get information.
David B

 

[sparkkky]

it is seldom a good idea to bring up electrical questions or to offer an answer because almost without fail a war of words and opinions begin.
David B

There is no room for opinions with electrical code!

 

[gemini5362]

sparkkky how does the code change if there is not room for opinions. If someone sees something that they think can be done safer that is an opinion and the code gets changed if the people that research it find that it is safer. I personally think that some of the wireing called for in the code is not heavy duty enough so I put in heavier wire. That is an opinion and it is not in violation of the code. Also in the buisness where I work we dont have to worry about the code because it is not applicable to us.

 

[EddieWalker]

There is no room for opinions with electrical code!

I've always wondered why code is different for residential homes, business's and hospitals? If it's safe for one place, why is it not ok for all?

Eddie

 

[grunewald]

I agree with Eddie, on his own property, not governed by code, it is his business how to does it, as long as it is safe. Cannot see anything he has done that is not safe. As far as heat build-up in the conduit, get real. If the wiring is sized correctly, there should be mininum heat build-up. I am not an electrician, I'm in the plumbers & pipefitters union, service end of HVAC, commercial & industrial. Been doing this for 33 years. I have seen some great electrical work by union & non-union electricians, in the commercial buildings, hospitals, plants. Understand the value of following code in places of this nature. As far as homes go, have seen plenty of romex rockets , wired by licensed electricians, that I consider a joke. I know I could do it better. If a person is so narrow-minded to think of code only, and not common sense, don't have a whole lot of time for them. Codes are created to protect people, usually people with no common sense or no experience with electricity, from themselves, thus the need for the codes. Have seen some work done by electricians, and have asked the question, is that safe? The answer is always, but is meets code. Dont consider these very few guys electricians, we have them in every trade, any form of job. Eddie seems to me to have a great amount of common sense. But Eddie probably could have stopped this ranting very easily if he just went out and bought a can of grey spray paint. I also have direct burial wiring from my meter loop to my house, did it myself, put it in grey conduit. Originally the wire ran to a mobile home, directly in the ground. When I transferred it to my new home, I ran it in conduit, to protect it from all the rock in the ground, think it makes sense, added protection. Hope I don't get arrested, I didn't follow code.

 

[sparkkky]

sparkkky how does the code change if there is not room for opinions. If someone sees something that they think can be done safer that is an opinion and the code gets changed if the people that research it find that it is safer. I personally think that some of the wireing called for in the code is not heavy duty enough so I put in heavier wire. That is an opinion and it is not in violation of the code. Also in the buisness where I work we dont have to worry about the code because it is not applicable to us.

You petition the N.E.C. if your qualified and they decide if your change is for the better.

Wiring size is covered by the code book you have to do a voltage drop calculation to find size required.

 

[gemini5362]

sparkky you are missing my point entirely. If I do a voltage drop calculation and it calls for #12 wire. I might decide that is not heavy enough and decide that I want #10 that is not against code and It would be my opinion that I needed heavier wire. Since you are on such a rant about electrical safety why is it that all the licensed electricians that i know are alcoholics and regularly go to work still drunk or hungover. How safe a job do they do ?