Electrical PVC verse Regular PVC

[tommu56]

for every one the best thing to do is use buried pipe tapes over what ever pipe you are using put them 6" below grade then when diging tape comes up and pipe stays intact.UNDERGROUND MARKERS


tommu56

 

[sparkkky]

sparkky you are missing my point entirely. If I do a voltage drop calculation and it calls for #12 wire. I might decide that is not heavy enough and decide that I want #10 that is not against code and It would be my opinion that I needed heavier wire. Since you are on such a rant about electrical safety why is it that all the licensed electricians that i know are alcoholics and regularly go to work still drunk or hungover. How safe a job do they do ?

No Sir, you are missing the point of the N.E.C. if you correctly do the calculation and you use bigger wire it overkill and you wasted money!

And your stereotyping of people (except handymen and general home inspectors) is uncalled for!

 

[tnau664]

Wow! I guess I'll have to dig up that 12/2 with ground I buried 15 years ago.

Merry Christmas, couldn't resist.

 

[gemini5362]

No Sir, you are missing the point of the N.E.C. if you correctly do the calculation and you use bigger wire it overkill and you wasted money!

And your stereotyping of people (except handymen and general home inspectors) is uncalled for!

You are probably 100 per cent right it might be overkill and it might waste my money but it is not a violation of the code and it would be my opinion. As to stereotyping people I am not stereotyping anyone I am just saying that the people that I know that are in that field drink a lot as do a lot of other people in other fields. Are you saying that you do not know anyone that is an electrician that does not drink ?

 

[gemini5362]

Obviously you hang out at the bars way too much......

Nope i dont ever go to bars I am a teetotaller. Something to do with my being in the navy and having way too many bottles of $1.00 per litre wine in portugal.

 

[stumpfield]

No Sir, you are missing the point of the N.E.C. if you correctly do the calculation and you use bigger wire it overkill and you wasted money!

QUOTE]

I just want to point out that using a bigger wire size than NEC recommends is NOT neccessary wasted money. The voltage drop on a long run may be within the N.E.C. limit, but you are wasting electricity. NEC allows up to 5% drop. It's fine if electricity is cheap. If you are off-grid where every watt counts, that's a lot of money going into the wire. If you do the math in how much you save in electricity cost vs. the extra cost for larger wire size, in some cases, it's a pretty good investment to go with the larger wire size.

 

[turbo36]

No Sir, you are missing the point of the N.E.C. if you correctly do the calculation and you use bigger wire it overkill and you wasted money!

This is not entirely true, NEC code refers to the safety of the wire only and has nothing to do with how the voltage loss affects the attached device. When I do wire size calculations I start with the minimum code requirements and then do a voltage drop calculation to see what the actual voltage will be at the device I'm powering then I compare that to the manufacturers recommendations. There are many times I will use larger size wire then code minimum because the device requires a more narrow voltage operating range for longer life and more stable performance.

 

[turbo36]

No Sir, you are missing the point of the N.E.C. if you correctly do the calculation and you use bigger wire it overkill and you wasted money!

QUOTE]

I just want to point out that using a bigger wire size than NEC recommends is NOT neccessary wasted money. The voltage drop on a long run may be within the N.E.C. limit, but you are wasting electricity. NEC allows up to 5% drop. It's fine if electricity is cheap. If you are off-grid where every watt counts, that's a lot of money going into the wire. If you do the math in how much you save in electricity cost vs. the extra cost for larger wire size, in some cases, it's a pretty good investment to go with the larger wire size.

You beat me by 1 minute!

 

[stumpfield]

You beat me by 1 minute!

You got a better example!

 

[sparkkky]

Guys, my whole point I have been trying to make is for the do it yourselfers is that they should at least try to learn and do the minimum's required by code. Heck most are a real long ways from understanding how to better them!

 

[Farwell]

A suggestion for anyone wanting to get informed on the N.E.C., subscribing to the Mike Holt newsletter may help a great deal
David B

 

[BXRICK]

Overall, most building codes make sense.
But, you can't just learn the codes, you have to know WHY the code exists. And, when I run across someone who knows the code well, but can't explain the purpose of the code, I have some doubts about that person.

The answer to "Why should I do it that way?" is never "because it's code." Rather, it's code because it's the minimally safe way you should do it.

As an over-builder myself, I see no reason not to use bigger wire gauges, a few more studs, etc. It's only money.

 

[keeney]

Actually, I have found some cases where something that seems like over-building turns out not to be code.

Wiring my Kitchen island, I ran 10-gauge wire on a 30-amp circuit breaker so as to be sure and have enough current to run the trash compactor, garbage disposal, and dish washer (if all on simultaneously, the plate ratings added up to 21.5 amps). Inspector made me add another cable and split the appliances onto seperate circuits; both with 20 amp breakers. It turns out that many appliances have a maximum circuit size they are rated to be connected to. They are only failure-tested (UL certified) with that amount of current. A garbage disposal that has a failure and shorts out safely below 20 amps might burn down your house if it happens to short out and draw 30 amps on a 30 amp circuit.

- Rick

 

[gemini5362]

Actually, I have found some cases where something that seems like over-building turns out not to be code.

Wiring my Kitchen island, I ran 10-gauge wire on a 30-amp circuit breaker so as to be sure and have enough current to run the trash compactor, garbage disposal, and dish washer (if all on simultaneously, the plate ratings added up to 21.5 amps). Inspector made me add another cable and split the appliances onto seperate circuits; both with 20 amp breakers. It turns out that many appliances have a maximum circuit size they are rated to be connected to. They are only failure-tested (UL certified) with that amount of current. A garbage disposal that has a failure and shorts out safely below 20 amps might burn down your house if it happens to short out and draw 30 amps on a 30 amp circuit.

- Rick

to my opinion putting a 115 volt small appliance on a 30 amp breaker might or might not be code but it is not a good idea. However my point was that you could run a 10 gauge wire between that 20 amp breaker and the appliances and not be out of code or hurt anything. Other than maybe your pocket book

 

[midlf]

to my opinion putting a 115 volt small appliance on a 30 amp breaker might or might not be code but it is not a good idea. However my point was that you could run a 10 gauge wire between that 20 amp breaker and the appliances and not be out of code or hurt anything. Other than maybe your pocket book

It's not code. 20 amp for general utilization circuits.

 

[turbo36]

Actually, I have found some cases where something that seems like over-building turns out not to be code.

Wiring my Kitchen island, I ran 10-gauge wire on a 30-amp circuit breaker so as to be sure and have enough current to run the trash compactor, garbage disposal, and dish washer (if all on simultaneously, the plate ratings added up to 21.5 amps). Inspector made me add another cable and split the appliances onto seperate circuits; both with 20 amp breakers. It turns out that many appliances have a maximum circuit size they are rated to be connected to. They are only failure-tested (UL certified) with that amount of current. A garbage disposal that has a failure and shorts out safely below 20 amps might burn down your house if it happens to short out and draw 30 amps on a 30 amp circuit.

- Rick

This is not an example of "over building" it is simply an example of code violation. If you had put in 10 gage wire with 20 amp breakers then that would be "over building". The NEC is very specific about kitchen appliance circuit wiring.