Diesel Fuel & Storage Questions

Dargo · Sep 10, 2004

My delivery guy laughed at me when I inquired about off road diesel being different than on road diesel. He was out of "off road" diesel when he got to my barn. He pops out this bottle of red dye and, like magic, he turns what is left of his on road diesel to "off road" diesel. The ONLY difference is the added dye to signify that road taxes were not paid on the product.

KiotiJohn · Sep 10, 2004

( The ONLY difference is the added dye to signify that road taxes were not paid on the product. )
For that dealer that may be the truth, but as my fuel oil dealer pointed out, there is also high sulfur and low sulfur, and the high sulfur is not supposed be used for on road.
He went out of his way to make sure I understood that I would be buying high sulfur fuel for use in my tractor.
Some dealers only carry the one type, low sulfur and add red dye because of storage limitations etc. The dealer I buy from is a very large concern and carries #1, #2 low and high sulfur and other fuels. John

MadReferee · Sep 10, 2004

Looking back over the replies it appears that dealers/distributors are selling different grades of diesel as "off-road". Depending on you location and from whom you purchase, it would be wise for everyone to ask before you pump.

Junkman · Sep 11, 2004

I think that some might be selling snake oyl also when they say that there is a difference. They have to rely on what their supplier tells them, and how truthful the supplier to the oil dealer is, is hard to tell without having a sample tested.

JerryG · Sep 11, 2004

If your building were to catch on fire and the tank fall to the ground, that would clinch the fire raging beyond control. 
I don't know anyone with that type of over-head tank inside of a building.

cp1969 · Sep 11, 2004

( My delivery guy laughed at me when I inquired about off road diesel being different than on road diesel. He was out of "off road" diesel when he got to my barn. He pops out this bottle of red dye and, like magic, he turns what is left of his on road diesel to "off road" diesel. The ONLY difference is the added dye to signify that road taxes were not paid on the product. )

That's strange, since it's a Federal requirement that the dye be added at the refinery or distribution terminal (i.e, long before your guy ever got his hands on it). That would mean that he paid the tax on the fuel when he got it (since it's undyed; he can't get undyed, untaxed fuel) and now, upon putting dye in it and selling to you as untaxed, would have to try to get a refund on the tax he already paid.

KiotiJohn · Sep 12, 2004

( That's strange, since it's a Federal requirement that the dye be added at the refinery or distribution terminal (i.e, long before your guy ever got his hands on it). That would mean that he paid the tax on the fuel when he got it (since it's undyed; he can't get undyed, untaxed fuel) and now, upon putting dye in it and selling to you as untaxed, would have to try to get a refund on the tax he already paid. )
That's something I just asked about, and was told that it's dyed at the terminal before the dealer gets it. John

Steve_Miller · Sep 12, 2004

I've whizzed thru these posts and haven't seen anyone bring anything up about insurance. In my province, just about all if not all insurance companies have begun to enforce strict rules on furnace oil tanks inside and out. Inside, distance from ignition sources must be met and age of tank no more than 15 years old, if older must be replaced or insurance is voided. Outside, proper platforms, vents and filler pipes to code and age not more than 10 years or replace. Proof of tank provided to insurance company is serial number. In case of fire, if ser # doesn't match, guess what. Just some more things to think about.

Steve

Junkman · Sep 12, 2004

Some dealers are also distributors and have large (100,000 total) storage tanks, so they would have the dye and install the dye as required. They are also responsible for keeping the records of what fuel is sold as taxed fuel and which is untaxed fuel. The government keeps them honest by doing spot audits.

KiotiJohn · Sep 13, 2004

( The government keeps them honest by doing spot audits. )
I think we have easily surpassed every other country in the world when it comes to regulation!! /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif John

cp1969 · Sep 13, 2004

The size of the dealer doesn't matter. It (the dye; which is a special dye, btw) goes in at the refinery or distribution terminal. There is a big difference between a distributor and a distribution terminal , i.e., a loading rack. A distribution terminal is where fuel is received from a pipeline and stored in huge tanks, typically millions of gallons, to be loaded on trucks and hauled to distributors. Unless they are a refinery or distribution terminal, they are not the ones injecting dye regardless of how big a wholesale or retail seller they are.

Holzster · Sep 15, 2004

Does anyone know what the price difference would be if the diesel was delivered? I am in the N Texas area. New to the forum - sorry if it has been covered before.

JerryG · Sep 15, 2004

Holzster,
Dealers around here, don't charge extra, but they do have a minimum delivery amount.

PineRidge · Sep 15, 2004

Dealers around here, don't charge extra, but they do have a minimum delivery amount.


It's the same here in Ohio and I believe the minimum was 125 gallons of diesel. My tank holds 275 gallons and the current price here is $1.33 per gallon delivered for off road diesel. Compare that to $1.98 a gallon at the gas pump just down the road and you can see the savings do add up pretty quickly.

BTW Welcome to the TBN site! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

KiotiJohn · Sep 16, 2004

( Does anyone know what the price difference would be if the diesel was delivered? I am in the N Texas area. New to the forum - sorry if it has been covered before. )
My dealer wanted $.25/gal more for delivery, and it had to be a 100 gal. minimum. John

Junkman · Sep 16, 2004

Ask how much to deliver home heating oil .... cash upon delivery price...

PineRidge · Sep 16, 2004

John there should be more than one supplier in your area. Let your fingers do the walking and call around a bit. I'm sure you can do better. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

KiotiJohn · Sep 16, 2004

( John there should be more than one supplier in your area. Let your fingers do the walking and call around a bit. I'm sure you can do better. )
I just pick it up myself in 55 gal drums. Piece o cake!

PineRidge · Sep 16, 2004

One of the main reasons that I am currently going to a 275 gallon tank is that I got tired of always transporting diesel fuel. An added benefit is that it is much cheaper than a pump price at the gas station. If diesel costs the same delivered, I say why bother messing with transporting 55 gallon 440 pound barrels yourself?

However if it does cost you more delivered then I fully understand your point.

BTW Are you counting moving diesel as a good work out for the day maybe? /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

KiotiJohn · Sep 16, 2004

( BTW Are you counting moving diesel as a good work out for the day maybe? )
Not much of an exercise. I put the pallet forks on the bucket and the drum is on a pallet. Of course, the first time I did this, I had two drums on one pallet and I couldn't lift the combination with bucket forks. One pallet/drum works just fine though. I saved $27.50 by picking it up myself and the dealer is only about a 10 minute drive from my home. He did say that I could get the same delivered price if I bought 500 gallons at a time, and he would provide the tank. No thanks. John