BX23 vs BX24?

[Northland]

I have been one of the people vacillating between buying a used B20/21 or a BX23/24 for some time. I have pretty much decided to buy the BX23 or 24 this week but wanted some advice as to what all you guys with experience would suggest.

I live in Northern Ontario, in a mountainous area, just north of Lake Superior and Michigan. My 16 acres of maple forest is hilly and rocky. I had an excavator put in some trails a few years ago and I need the TLB to pull wood out of the forest, plough snow (10+ feet each winter), dig holes, move some of the smaller rocks around and do general landscaping. My land is surrounding by 10000 acres of railway land that has just been selectively logged so I can easily hook up to the skidder trails to pull out the left-behind maple tree tops. Since moving here 4 years ago I have a had a guy with a plough truck come in and plough my 100 yard driveway for $400/season.

The Kubota dealer 40 miles east of me has a used B20 with 800 hours for CDN$19000, a new BX23 for CDN $19986 or a new BX24 for CDN $21236. I could also go down to Michigan and buy a new MFGC2310 for US$16000 (CDN$ 17920) or go south to Flint and buy a used GC2310 w/128 hours for US$13500 ($15120). As much as I would like to save $ there if I go with either MF I would have to buy a trailer (US $2250) and trailer the MF back to Canada. There are no MF dealers any where near me in Canada so I would have trailer it to the US for warranty work-crossing the border is a real pain at times.

So, I am leaning toward the Kubota's as the dealer is local and will deliver either unit to my door. He will also pick the unit up for servicing as he has parts being delivered in and around the area often. I would prefer to find a used 16" tandem trailer in the next few months and save myself a $1000 or so. Also I thought I use the loader to plough snow this winter and buy the front blower next winter. I have tried to think through the B20/21 vs BX series and I figure that the smaller units would be more versatile for me and I could hire a big backhoe (as I have done in the past) when I need some serious grunt work done. I do use a 65cc Husqvarna chainsaw, a 26cc JD chainsaw and a 36cc Husqvarna clearing saw for bucking firewood and keeping my trails clear so I am aware of the benefits of power.

For $1250 more the BX24 seems to offer the following benefits over the BX23 that appeal to me: higher departure angle on backhoe (good for my hills), 2" higher ground clearance - 8.7"?, curved backhoe, hidden hoses, more foot room and lever boots. The ground additional ground clearance and departure angle seem to be worth the extra cash.

I also want to buy the BX thumb and skidplates from Bro-tek who is on this forum. That and a tooth bar as well as a block heater.

Any suggestions or comments on my rationale for buying what I think I need would be appreciated. Sorry for the long story but I have been waiting too long to buy myself something and I want to get it right

 

[art]

The 1200 would be an instant gain just from resale value! That is not the main reason to buy a tractor but should be considered.

 

[TomKioti]

The 1200 would be an instant gain just from resale value! That is not the main reason to buy a tractor but should be considered.

I agree!

 

[Northland]

Thanks guys...I think I will go with the BX24 for the extra $1250 + tax

 

[Ken_CT]

Northland,
Do a search for the broken plastic fender problem on the BX24. The BX23 does not have this problem as they are metal. There are a few people here who are not happy with their BX24, but I don't recall anyone dissatisfied with the 23.

Ken

 

[IslandTractor]

You mention comparing the B21 to the BX TLBs but you forgot to consider the B7510 or B7610 TLB set ups. You can add a Kubota backhoe to either of those tractors and will have greater ground clearance than the BX24 as well as more weight (good for the types of things you are doing) and a more powerful FEL. I own a Kioti CK20 TLB which is heavier but the same basic size as the Kubota B series. It is a great tractor TLB and I am sure the Kubota equivalents are excellent too. There are remarkably few differences in performance between my CK20 TLB and the B21. The BX series is really not designed for the sort of backwoods work you are planning. The only advantage I can think of for the BX is it's lower center of gravity but that needs to be balanced against the other considerations. Do yourself a favor and go sit on and drive a 7510 or 7610 before making a decision. My CK20 TLB could be purchased for only a few dollars more than the BX24 quote you mentioned so I am sure the B7510 TLB would also be close.

 

[Henro]

Just my 2 cents but...

Comparing the B20/21 to the BX series is like comparing a tomato to a watermellon!

Ok I have a B2910 which is about the same size as the B20/21. I also have a BX2200 which is the size of the BX23/24.

You have 16 acres to deal with. Get the bigger tractor. The BX is a fine machine but if I had to have only one, my BX would be gone in a instant. The larger tractor is just so much more usefull and so much more harder of a worker.

That being said, the B21 is an industrial model, and has more loader/backhoe power and less PTO power, if I remember right. Also, I think the loader cannot be removed. Not that this is a major issue in some cases...I have not take the loader off my B2910 for several years...since I don't finish mow with it.

Frankly, if I had 10+ acres to deal with, I would NEVER consider buying a BX as my primary tractor...

Gee...that sounds like such a strong opinion...but my experience is speaking here...and I do have one tractor of each size to relate to...

 

[Northland]

Thanks for the good suggestions IslandTractor. I looked at a 2002 Kubota 7500 w/woods backhoe and only 98 hours for about CDN $21K but it would have cost CDN $800 more for the beefed up sub-frame. That and the warranty was over. Like many others I think I have the idea that a TLB is somehow better then a tractor w/aftermarket backhoe. It may be incorrect but it's the perception I had prior to redaing soe posts here...like yours.

I ordered brochures on the CK20 last year from Kiota and it looked perfect for my my needs but there are no dealers anywhere near me.

So, today I bought the BX23 with a 48" snow blower (Kubota Harvest days are on here). I got $1400 off the blower (CDN $2800 total) which has the hydralic motor for the snow chute control. I paid $19600 for the BX23 with the block heater as well as hooks welded to the top of the bucket. It has 0 zero hours and a 3 year warranty so I am happy. Once I see how this works for me I will either keep it or trade-up to a B21 if need be.

I am going to order that BX thumb and skidplates from Brotek (part of my rationale in not going with the BX24 for the extra $1250. Apparently the BX24 also lost the locking differential that the BX 23 has. Those broken plastic parts on the BX24 didn't thrill me either. It gets to be very cold up (-30 F)here and plastic cracks in the cold when it gets whacked

 

[Northland]

Thanks Henro...you are sure clear on your preferences! One of the reasons I bought the the BX23 was becuase of the major snow fall we get every winter (Dec to March). I have to clear the snow from around my house, garage and trails and there was no way I was going to do all that going backwards with a tractor with a rear mount blower.

I do apprecaite the advice

 

[IslandTractor]

Northland,

I don't think anyone has ever lost money on BX23s even if they end up trading up eventually. Those things hold their value very well so I would not fret. Your tasks seem split between around the house/driveway duties and the woods. Your BX will excel at the house/driveway stuff. Obviously a bigger machine would be better for the woods but if you are careful and take your time you can certainly accomplish most everything you are trying with the BX23. Just watch that ground clearance.

I am a grapple fan for working in brush and woods so you might consider adding a grapple to your bucket to help out there. I think that would be more useful than a backhoe thumb. You are likely to use your FEL more than the BH (almost everyone does) so I'd advise accessorizing the FEL before you worry about the BH.

By the way, with a subframe, the regular CUTs are just as solid for BH work as the BX23/24 so don't worry about that if you eventually upgrade. I don't think the work you are describing is a good match for a B21 (as Henro was hinting) as that is really a construction optomized machine (and a fine one). The B series (and the long anticipated update to it) would be my choice in the Kubota line as an upgrade to the BX. Mahindra, Kioti and TYM are all excellent tractors that compete directly with Kubota and should be considered too even though they obviously don't have the Kubota market share or dealer network. Each of those machines can be turned into a nice TLB.

Good luck with your new BX. I am sure you'll have a lot of fun.

 

[mscott]

You made a good choice. I have a 35hp tractor and a BX23 and use the BX23 for a lot more of the everyday jobs on my 20 acres. Everyone under estimates the BX23 because of its low ground clearance which i've not yet found to be a problem in the 2 years and 300 hours i've owed it. I live in WV where the terrain is pretty rugged. They will do just about anything a 40hp tractor can do just in smaller bites. I put in over a thousand feet of drain pipe 36" deep in about a week part time. Most of the bugs have been worked out of the BX23 except for the air cleaner brackets and safety switches. Heard of more teething pains with the BX24 since its intro the then BX22 and 23 have had combined.

 

[Volfandt]

Going w/the BX23 is a good start, no matter what you end up doing down the road.
It'll do an amazing amount of work all day long for you and it has a very good resale value.
I just went over 200 hrs on a BX23 and although there has been a few times I could have used a bigger machine, the BX23 still got the job done, albeit taking alittle more time.
And when it comes to finish mowing, it'll cut circles around the larger CUTS

Volfandt

 

[Northland]

Thanks for the words of comfort Island Tractor....it's easy to get buyer's remorse..especially when you are spending $20K on something.

Also, thanks for the thumb vs grapple advice. What make/model grapple would you reccomend for the BX23? The picture of your CK20 with grapple looks perfect for moving trees, logs and brush around. I can see using a loader/w grapple being easier to move stuff around more quickly then the backhoe w/thumb.

Do you think the skidplates are a good iade and worth me buying right away?

Quote:

I don't think anyone has ever lost money on BX23s even if they end up trading up eventually. Those things hold their value very well so I would not fret. Your tasks seem split between around the house/driveway duties and the woods. Your BX will excel at the house/driveway stuff. Obviously a bigger machine would be better for the woods but if you are careful and take your time you can certainly accomplish most everything you are trying with the BX23. Just watch that ground clearance.

I am a grapple fan for working in brush and woods so you might consider adding a grapple to your bucket to help out there. I think that would be more useful than a backhoe thumb. You are likely to use your FEL more than the BH (almost everyone does) so I'd advise accessorizing the FEL before you worry about the BH.

By the way, with a subframe, the regular CUTs are just as solid for BH work as the BX23/24 so don't worry about that if you eventually upgrade. I don't think the work you are describing is a good match for a B21 (as Henro was hinting) as that is really a construction optomized machine (and a fine one). The B series (and the long anticipated update to it) would be my choice in the Kubota line as an upgrade to the BX. Mahindra, Kioti and TYM are all excellent tractors that compete directly with Kubota and should be considered too even though they obviously don't have the Kubota market share or dealer network. Each of those machines can be turned into a nice TLB.

Good luck with your new BX. I am sure you'll have a lot of fun.[/QUOTE]

 

[IslandTractor]

Thanks for the words of comfort Island Tractor....it's easy to get buyer's remorse..especially when you are spending $20K on something.

Also, thanks for the thumb vs grapple advice. What make/model grapple would you reccomend for the BX23? The picture of your CK20 with grapple looks perfect for moving trees, logs and brush around. I can see using a loader/w grapple being easier to move stuff around more quickly then the backhoe w/thumb.

Do you think the skidplates are a good iade and worth me buying right away?

If I were the proud new owner of a BX23 I'd try to get a bucket grapple rigged up. I have a full grapple on my CK20 but my FEL lift capacity is several hundred pounds more than yours. A bucket grapple would be great on the BX23. There are several ways to do it and some of your fellow BX23 owners can probably provide more specific advice. It depends also on how handy you are with a wrench. At least one company sells a kit specifically for the BX23 which looks nice. There are grapple arms you can buy on ebay for 200-300 bucks and then you'd need a diverter valve set up. Post a question in the Kubota owning and operating section if you cannot find a good thread by searching on BX23 and grapple.

If I had a BX23 and was planning to work in the woods I would sure try to put on a skid plate. Again, your fellow BX23 owners can give better advice on how to do it.

 

[ByronBob]

Your scaring me with all the talk of rock. The BX has a low profile to the ground vs the B series.

I would seriously look at this closer. You break the transmission casing and you won't like it. Get the B.

Did I mention getting the B series yet??

 

[David_G]

ByronBob

The lowest point is the trailer hitch plate.
Nice and solid.
I have been going over rocks for 2 years or so, and apart from the occasional scrape of the Backhoe or hitch plate, have never had a problem.

So far I have moved about 1,000 ton of dirt and dug a mile of road up through some steep granite country.

That is not counting the countless hours using a slasher or digging up other peoples gardens.

The BX air filter bracket breaks due to harmonic vibration from the motor, Solution - Undo the nuts holding the bracket. Now there is no serious vibration.
Only problems I have had are punctures, a faulty flasher switch and worn out backhoe bucket teeth from digging hard granite rocks out.

Just done the 500hr service..

 

[Northland]

Thanks for all your comments guys. I think I will be happy with my purchase of BX23 for the next few years at least. I am going to go with the skidplates front and back right now so I don't have to worry about bottoming out.

I am also going to buy the American Solutions or ATI grapple next spring.

 

[Northland]

You mention comparing the B21 to the BX TLBs but you forgot to consider the B7510 or B7610 TLB set ups. You can add a Kubota backhoe to either of those tractors and will have greater ground clearance than the BX24 as well as more weight (good for the types of things you are doing) and a more powerful FEL. I own a Kioti CK20 TLB which is heavier but the same basic size as the Kubota B series. It is a great tractor TLB and I am sure the Kubota equivalents are excellent too. There are remarkably few differences in performance between my CK20 TLB and the B21. The BX series is really not designed for the sort of backwoods work you are planning. The only advantage I can think of for the BX is it's lower center of gravity but that needs to be balanced against the other considerations. Do yourself a favor and go sit on and drive a 7510 or 7610 before making a decision. My CK20 TLB could be purchased for only a few dollars more than the BX24 quote you mentioned so I am sure the B7510 TLB would also be close.

Island Tractor

My deal on the BX23 died as the dealer delivered it without the snowblower, no manuals, no demo and the unit was not in good shape maintenance wise....so, I refused delivery.

I am taking some of the advice from the tractor vets here and looking for a 7500/7610 type unit with a Woods BH6000.

What do you think of this deal?-KUBOTA B7610 2004 model. Just 49 hours use. The loader is a NEW Kubota LA 302 with 660lbs lift capacity. This is a 24hp diesel tractor with 4wd, Power Steering, Hydrostatic trans., 3pt, PTO, Industrial tires and folding rollbar. Extra Clean. Not a mark anywhere! I can buy that for CDN $15500 (US$13839) and CDN $5350 (US$4816) for a new Woods BH6000 backhoe. It'll cost me $700 for delivery.

 

[Northland]

Just my 2 cents but...

Comparing the B20/21 to the BX series is like comparing a tomato to a watermellon!

Ok I have a B2910 which is about the same size as the B20/21. I also have a BX2200 which is the size of the BX23/24.

You have 16 acres to deal with. Get the bigger tractor. The BX is a fine machine but if I had to have only one, my BX would be gone in a instant. The larger tractor is just so much more usefull and so much more harder of a worker.

That being said, the B21 is an industrial model, and has more loader/backhoe power and less PTO power, if I remember right. Also, I think the loader cannot be removed. Not that this is a major issue in some cases...I have not take the loader off my B2910 for several years...since I don't finish mow with it.

Frankly, if I had 10+ acres to deal with, I would NEVER consider buying a BX as my primary tractor...

Gee...that sounds like such a strong opinion...but my experience is speaking here...and I do have one tractor of each size to relate to...

My deal on the BX23 died as the dealer delivered it without the snowblower, no manuals, no demo and the unit was not in good shape maintenance wise....so, I refused delivery.

I am taking some of the advice from the tractor vets here and looking for a 7500/7610 type unit with a Woods BH6000.

What do you think of this deal?-KUBOTA B7610 2004 model. Just 49 hours use. The loader is a NEW Kubota LA 302 with 660lbs lift capacity. This is a 24hp diesel tractor with 4wd, Power Steering, Hydrostatic trans., 3pt, PTO, Industrial tires and folding rollbar. Extra Clean. Not a mark anywhere! I can buy that for CDN $15500 (US$13839) and CDN $5350 (US$4816) for a new Woods BH6000 backhoe. It'll cost me $700 for delivery.

 

[IslandTractor]

Island Tractor

I am taking some of the advice from the tractor vets here and looking for a 7500/7610 type unit with a Woods BH6000.

What do you think of this deal?-KUBOTA B7610 2004 model. Just 49 hours use. The loader is a NEW Kubota LA 302 with 660lbs lift capacity. This is a 24hp diesel tractor with 4wd, Power Steering, Hydrostatic trans., 3pt, PTO, Industrial tires and folding rollbar. Extra Clean. Not a mark anywhere! I can buy that for CDN $15500 (US$13839) and CDN $5350 (US$4816) for a new Woods BH6000 backhoe. It'll cost me $700 for delivery.

I think the B7610 is a bit over priced for a used tractor (no quibbling with the 49hrs, that is just nothing, but it is at least two years old and therefore has little if any warranty left so you should be able to get a better deal than that). Also, the B7610 can use the much preferred LA352 loader so especially if the loader is new you should get that loader and it's increased capacity. Finally, while the Woods BH is excellent, I would personnally look at their newer "X" series to see if the 70X would fit on the 7610 as it has some advantages (and unfortuantely probably costs more) compared to the BH6000. That is not knocking the BH6000, I'd just want to know what the upgrade would cost if I were buying it new.

Just as an example, the local classified ads here in Massachusetts has the following really nice tractor for sale: 2003 MODEL 7800 KUBOTA TRACTOR W/7-1/2' backhoe. Larger bucket w/quick connectors, less than 125 hrs. 30hp. Always garaged, in exc cond. $19,500; (Groveland) 978-372-3172

That is more tractor, probably the LA402 loader with quick attach and a bigger BH for about the same as you are being asked for the 7610.

Here is another current ad: 2003 KUBOTA B7500 4WD TRACTOR W/loader & backhoe. Only 256 hrs. Hydrostatic trans, 3-cyl diesel, 3-pt hitch. Delivery avail. $14,750; E-mail for pics: saraandej@comcast.net. (Fremont, NH) (cell) 603-303-5499

If I were you I think I'd keep looking a while longer.