Back up Generators - finally looking.

[FERLING]

Our local utility (PG&E) is offering rebates of up to $1,200 for back up generators, so I am looking into that. It looks like most brands qualify- the list is very long. I am considering a dual fuel whole house back up system - likely Generac. I will be making calls today to see what installation will cost, getting recommendations, or if DIY is an option. Running the well when we don't have power is a prime concern (1.5 HP down at 420'). I have a 5500 W Troybilt gas unit that has worked out well when needed to keep fridge and freezer, lights and such going. Likely that I can get information from a local electrician as to what I need and cost, but this is usually my initial go-to stop.
We have not, historically, lost power that often, but now they are shutting things down proactively for weather or fire issues. Suggestions?

Go here - should be free shipping and may have a discount coupon on their site.

JEGS 86068: Portable Generator [12,000 Starting Watts, 16 Horsepower, Electric Start] - JEGS High Performance

Shop for a 12000 watt generator online from JEGS High Performance. This 12000 watt portable generator features an electric start. The 12000 watt portable generator with an electric start boasts a 7-gallon tank and a 9 hour run time. Order your portable 12000 watt generator today!

www.jegs.com

This generator (gas with electric start) will do most of what you want done at a reasonable price. Good web site to order from. Had this one and 4 previous generators order in past. Received all promptly and no damage. This 12,000 watt is a ”hoss” and hasn’t failed crank in the 3 years I have had it. Compare this one to other web site because someone could have it cheaper in another state (not NC).

 

[check]

Go here - should be free shipping and may have a discount coupon on their site.

JEGS 86068: Portable Generator [12,000 Starting Watts, 16 Horsepower, Electric Start] - JEGS High Performance

Shop for a 12000 watt generator online from JEGS High Performance. This 12000 watt portable generator features an electric start. The 12000 watt portable generator with an electric start boasts a 7-gallon tank and a 9 hour run time. Order your portable 12000 watt generator today!

www.jegs.com

This generator (gas with electric start) will do most of what you want done at a reasonable price. Good web site to order from. Had this one and 4 previous generators order in past. Received all promptly and no damage. This 12,000 watt is a ”hoss” and hasn’t failed crank in the 3 years I have had it. Compare this one to other web site because someone could have it cheaper in another state (not NC).

Looks A LOT like my Westinghouse with the same specs.

 

[Doofy]

Price a Tesla Powerwall. 13 kWh for $10,000 for the first one, $7,000 for each thereafter to expand your capacity. The installer will want to sell PV solar too but that is optional. 26% Federal tax credit. Possibly more from California.

Will not only carry you though most outages but can be automatically configured to charge from the grid at night when T.O.U. is low to assist in daytime use.

I'm about ready to move someplace that is cheaper to live. With the long, nasty, seemingly endless winter, Electric rate has just went to $0.5378 per KWH. Ridiculous!

 

[orezok]

I'm about ready to move someplace that is cheaper to live. With the long, nasty, seemingly endless winter, Electric rate has just went to $0.5378 per KWH. Ridiculous!

BUT...BUT.. you have real snow as opposed to Beijing

 

[Doofy]

BUT...BUT.. you have real snow as opposed to Beijing

Only about 4 Feet!

 

[workinonit]

It was apparently a Winco product, though I don't see the name anywhere. I found a video of one with an identical cart under it, and pretty close to the same engine. The title says 1957, the voice says 1963. I suspect it was a 1963 model, purchased right after the 1962 Cat 5 that hit the PNW.

Mine has a 4000 watt generator rather than a 3500 watt, and a slightly later Briggs 23A engine. I looked inside the generator box - no fuses. The engine is good for 7 kw, so I hope the windings aren't fried. If they are, I will just scrap it. There's enough copper in it to get my $50 back, and the engine would be worth something too.

I'll probably redo the cart with space for a starter battery and a small distribution panel with breakers and a 15 amp GFI receptacle. I'm torn between keeping it original as an antique or sticking a dual fuel carb on it. That's a rainy day project.

The drought is back with a vengeance here in the PNW, so I'm cleaning up downed trees to prep for fire season. There's room for 9 cords in my woodshed, and I may get there. I'm working on cleaning out old firewood in the back of the woodshed. I'm burning wood I cut 20 years ago. It's like an archaeological dig.

Check the windings with a meter. Across the windings and to ground. That should give you a good indication without beingt able to run a megger on it.

 

[Fxfymn413]

I just picked up a backup generator today. It's probably about 50 years old, a 4000 watt 3600 rpm Dayton generator run by a 10 hp Briggs and Stratton. It's a rope pull motor, but does have an electric start. It has good compression, and the guy said it ran about a year and a half ago. He stored it with the gas tank empty, and the oil showed use but was fairly clean. $50.

If you look at almost any fire truck from the 50's and 60's they had a Winco generator on them. I don't know if they are still in business, but they were very popular at one time. I think they may have been supplied by the Civil Defense Agency to municipalities as well.

They are loud, but as simple as you can get. If it turns out the stator/rotor is bad you can probably find a non-running version at a flea market to scavenge for parts.

 

[grsthegreat]

winco is still in business.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

Check the windings with a meter. Across the windings and to ground. That should give you a good indication without beingt able to run a megger on it.

I've already done that, and it's looking good. I'm busy with firewood and landscaping right now, so won't get to the generator until spring. I have decided there is just enough room in my water system distribution shack, where the feeds for the well pump and the cistern pump split. I'll feed the exhaust through the wall, install an interlock, battery, and maintainer, and use it as a dedicated water system generator. It should be far enough from the house that the generator noise will not be audible, and the electric start will make it convenient enough. I have a collection of brass fuel valves and fittings, so think I will rig up an "exercise" fuel tank with about 8-12 oz. of gasoline that will let me avoid stored gas in the main tank. If it runs 20 minutes or so before running dry, that should be enough. I love that it uses a screen and sediment bowl instead of a fuel filter.

I'm also thinking about what motor oil to use in such an old engine. The cam lobe solid lifters require zinc in the oil to minimize wear. Not that the engine will likely get enough hours to make it an issue, but I've checked oil analysis, and it looks like Rotella-T is the best oil for engines built with the old mechanical lifters. It pleases me to think of using a 60 year old generator. It's the tech I grew up with, so nostalgia plays a big part. If I can find replacement brushes, it will be good for the next couple of generations. Pun intended.

 

[PILOON]

I've already done that, and it's looking good. I'm busy with firewood and landscaping right now, so won't get to the generator until spring. I have decided there is just enough room in my water system distribution shack, where the feeds for the well pump and the cistern pump split. I'll feed the exhaust through the wall, install an interlock, battery, and maintainer, and use it as a dedicated water system generator. It should be far enough from the house that the generator noise will not be audible, and the electric start will make it convenient enough. I have a collection of brass fuel valves and fittings, so think I will rig up an "exercise" fuel tank with about 8-12 oz. of gasoline that will let me avoid stored gas in the main tank. If it runs 20 minutes or so before running dry, that should be enough. I love that it uses a screen and sediment bowl instead of a fuel filter.

I'm also thinking about what motor oil to use in such an old engine. The cam lobe solid lifters require zinc in the oil to minimize wear. Not that the engine will likely get enough hours to make it an issue, but I've checked oil analysis, and it looks like Rotella-T is the best oil for engines built with the old mechanical lifters. It pleases me to think of using a 60 year old generator. It's the tech I grew up with, so nostalgia plays a big part. If I can find replacement brushes, it will be good for the next couple of generations. Pun intended.

Suggestion, re oil:
From a petroleum eng I understand that diesel oils contain an additive that will help minimize wear on those old mechanical lifters.
Brushes:
I have a few times been able to simply modify larger ones by hacksaw, sandpaper and or filing.

 

[orezok]

I've already done that, and it's looking good. I'm busy with firewood and landscaping right now, so won't get to the generator until spring. I have decided there is just enough room in my water system distribution shack, where the feeds for the well pump and the cistern pump split. I'll feed the exhaust through the wall, install an interlock, battery, and maintainer, and use it as a dedicated water system generator. It should be far enough from the house that the generator noise will not be audible, and the electric start will make it convenient enough. I have a collection of brass fuel valves and fittings, so think I will rig up an "exercise" fuel tank with about 8-12 oz. of gasoline that will let me avoid stored gas in the main tank. If it runs 20 minutes or so before running dry, that should be enough. I love that it uses a screen and sediment bowl instead of a fuel filter.

I'm also thinking about what motor oil to use in such an old engine. The cam lobe solid lifters require zinc in the oil to minimize wear. Not that the engine will likely get enough hours to make it an issue, but I've checked oil analysis, and it looks like Rotella-T is the best oil for engines built with the old mechanical lifters. It pleases me to think of using a 60 year old generator. It's the tech I grew up with, so nostalgia plays a big part. If I can find replacement brushes, it will be good for the next couple of generations. Pun intended.

Most “racing” oils are high in zinc

 

[Fxfymn413]

I used a portable unit with a manual transfer switch for years, but I worked 24 hour shifts and travelled a lot for my part-time gigs, so inevitably Mrs. Murphy's Law would kick in while I was gone. You know; If something can go wrong it will when Mr. Murphy is not around to fix it; and the portable would not start, etc. so we installed a 16Kw air cooled Generac unit.

It has been in for over 20 years and up until recently worked flawlessly. During a recent outage it quit under load due to an overspeed condition which turned out to be caused by the butterfly valve dropping off of the shaft and wedging into the venturi. All mechanical things break on occasion and it's just one of those things. Like others mine has never burned a drop of oil.

I put an hour meter on mine when I installed it and I just crossed 350 hours, so I think you will find it pretty hard to wear out.

I do not think the unit is noisy, but if you are concerned about the noise level spend a little more and install it further away from the house.

Suggestion, re oil:
From a petroleum eng I understand that diesel oils contain an additive that will help minimize wear on those old mechanical lifters.

I had the chance to listen to the guy who was the chief petroleum engineer for Ford talk about lubrication for antique vehicles. In a nut shell he recommended diesel oils such as Rotella for any antique vehicle. It's what I use in my antique Mack.

 

[not2old]

Brushes:
I have a few times been able to simply modify larger ones by hacksaw, sandpaper and or filing.

I've done the same thing numerous times when I was a kid because they wanted money for the brushes I needed and making my own from scrounged sources was free.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

Suggestion, re oil:
From a petroleum eng I understand that diesel oils contain an additive that will help minimize wear on those old mechanical lifters.
Brushes:
I have a few times been able to simply modify larger ones by hacksaw, sandpaper and or filing.

That's why I settled on Rotella-T, which as far as I can tell has the highest zinc concentration of modern motor oils. I have a friend who restores old cars, and he always adds a zinc additive to the oil of his old flatheads to minimize wear. My judgment is that he knows what he is talking about.

Good to know about the brushes. You may have presented me with a fine rationalization for buying a bench belt sander.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

Most “racing” oils are high in zinc

I think pulling zinc out of the motor oils (remember Pennzoil Z7?) had something to do with the catalytic converter. That would not be a factor for a race car.

 

[PILOON]

"Good to know about the brushes. You may have presented me with a fine rationalization for buying a bench belt sander."

Gee, you're not a real tool junky like I am, LOL, I don't need excuses as long as it looks handy and price is right.
But then I can't move in my shop and still looking for that tool that I know I have, but where is it ?

 

[Larry Caldwell]

An interesting video about Honda repairs. They make great engines. Electronics, not so much. Commercial for Champion at the end.

Taryl Dactyl is a half comedy fixit site.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

And yet, both of my Honda generators keep going and going and going...

SR

 

[Larry Caldwell]

And yet, both of my Honda generators keep going and going and going...

SR

Until the inverter fries. Then it's a boat anchor.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

Until the inverter fries. Then it's a boat anchor.

True story, but EVERYTHING dies, it's just a matter of when.

My Honda 2000 is OLD and it's still going with a lot of use, so if it dies, it's paid for itself. The 2800 is newer and still starts, runs and works perfectly too. I suspect I'll get my moneys worth out of it too.

SR