Are we in the USA really this far behind?

[ArtMech]

I don’t think anyone in Western technology is far ahead or far behind. Simply, every design bureau gets the technical tasks and works the way as required. In this case, if the task were to create a tractor with a low center of gravity, maneuverable on narrow and winding roads, having good traction and sufficient power, (...), the offices of all well-known manufacturers in the West would create a tractor no worse then those in a video.
That's my thought.

 

[Dale Mercer]

Most all US manufacturers at onetime or another built some kind of specialty tractor or packages that were used for power for other machines. Most of the specialty tractors were of a European design, some were changes made to standard production tractors. Even some were designed and built by people who thought they could sell their tractor. (Steiner for one). Most of the European designs were usually designed for vineyard, orchard or close area work. Yes there are some very useful builds that would could be used here but until they are imported the price is unreasonable.
US manufacturers used to make some very nice small tractors, but due to labor and material costs they found they could import Asian built tractors cheaper. After other Asian manufacturers found what the US manufacturers were doing they started sending their units here to. Some made out well some not so. Even the Russian's got in on it.
Now some people have a chunk of iron that has established dealers and kept there brand going, some had established dealers and folded, some found a marketing firm to sell and have no support. As I call the a "one time use" use it until it breaks.
Some of the specialty tractors were only marketed in certain areas and were not advertised out of that area, so most people were not aware they were ever built.
Packages include JD 50 for Barber Greene, MM packages 78, 79, 80, 81 for West Corporation on the Sky Trak, Oliver made 770 and 880 series for Lull Corporation for their brick lifts, I know the are others I don't know about.
Specialty tractors were as I said before were often made for vineyard or orchard work. Versatile made a bidirectional tractor that Ford got a hold of.
Just remember most of the European designs are good for the use they were designed but we Americans often want to do more with them than what they were designed to do.

Most all US manufacturers at onetime or another built some kind of specialty tractor or packages that were used for power for other machines. Most of the specialty tractors were of a European design, some were changes made to standard production tractors. Even some were designed and built by people who thought they could sell their tractor. (Steiner for one). Most of the European designs were usually designed for vineyard, orchard or close area work. Yes there are some very useful builds that would could be used here but until they are imported the price is unreasonable.
US manufacturers used to make some very nice small tractors, but due to labor and material costs they found they could import Asian built tractors cheaper. After other Asian manufacturers found what the US manufacturers were doing they started sending their units here to. Some made out well some not so. Even the Russian's got in on it.
Now some people have a chunk of iron that has established dealers and kept there brand going, some had established dealers and folded, some found a marketing firm to sell and have no support. As I call the a "one time use" use it until it breaks.
Some of the specialty tractors were only marketed in certain areas and were not advertised out of that area, so most people were not aware they were ever built.
Packages include JD 50 for Barber Greene, MM packages 78, 79, 80, 81 for West Corporation on the Sky Trak, Oliver made 770 and 880 series for Lull Corporation for their brick lifts, I know the are others I don't know about.
Specialty tractors were as I said before were often made for vineyard or orchard work. Versatile made a bidirectional tractor that Ford got a hold of.
Just remember most of the European designs are good for the use they were designed but we Americans often want to do more with them than what they were designed to do.

I have a Italian vineyard but mine does not articulate. Mine has 4 wheel steering, 4 wheel drive and you drive forward or backward just rotate the seat. Step on a pedal and lock both front and back axel and it petty hard to stop it. A very handy tractor.

 

[ptsg]

This is the only Goldoni I've ever saw. It was in Baghdad Iraq.

View attachment 728684

And here is the green version of that very same tractor, well, it's actually the 50HP one, but you get the idea. These things had front diff lock along with a very sophisticated, for that era, electronic 3 pt hitch position and draft control. I believe some had a 16x16 transmission and maybe some with a 24x24 transmission. Hydraulic brake valve for trailers were also a common feature.

 

[Agvg]

I think the difference in tractor designs and ingenuity is driven by farming mentality. The US is a fairly young country that had plenty of land to expand to, while other countries may have limited open/flat land to chose from. The only option they have is to come up with inventive ideas (thinking outside the box) to be able to farm on hills or in tight spaces. They don't have room to build a giant shed to house every type of tractor. They would rather design a tractor that will do about every job so a big shed doesn't cover valuable property.

Here in Norway only 3% of the land are farmland, and historical almost all area that could be used was used.

 

[CalG]

This is the American Version.

Even produced in Fargo North Dakota for a spell.

"You want Articulated?, You can't handle articulated" ;-)

 

[BackRoad]

This thread may highlight more of a marketing challenge than technology issue in the USA.

I have a 60 year old made in the US - Massey Ferguson 35 that still runs great and gets some use...and I can get parts for.

BUT - not many >100HP tractors are made in the states now. So it is not really US technology that is behind. We are not even in the SCUT/CUT/MINI game at this point!

Two years ago, I added a Kubota 60hp with a FEL, which I believe will last 25 years and still have parts available, though it's not high fashion nor a trend setter.

For many, the key decision is long-term reliability and support...

.

I think fundamentally it is simply marketing of European style tractors that is behind in the USA.

Kubota, Deere, LS, Kioti, MF, New Holland, are generally paint and dealer differences, not really technology differences. It is ASIA/PAC that is behind on the tractor fashion and technology curve.

Americans would kick the tires and eventually buy Euro style tractors if they were proven to be useful, supported and reliable (not intending to imply they aren't).

It would be interesting to see someone open up a European tractor distribution channel...but it would take a trusted supplier with a long-term $$ commitment to be successful.

..//TJ

 

[ovrszd]

And here is the green version of that very same tractor, well, it's actually the 50HP one, but you get the idea. These things had front diff lock along with a very sophisticated, for that era, electronic 3 pt hitch position and draft control. I believe some had a 16x16 transmission and maybe some with a 24x24 transmission. Hydraulic brake valve for trailers were also a common feature.

Good stuff Pedro!!!! Thanks!!!

 

[ovrszd]

Americans would kick the tires and eventually buy Euro style tractors if they were proven to be useful, supported and reliable (not intending to imply they aren't).


..//TJ

A couple decades ago JD moved away from the old American standard design of long wheel base, cab rearward tractors that we knew from the era of the JD 4020 or IH 806.

The change brought short wheel based, cab forward design. The design that had been used in Europe for quite awhile

 

[ruffdog]

View attachment 728692

This is the American Version.

Even produced in Fargo North Dakota for a spell.

"You want Articulated?, You can't handle articulated" ;-)

Yeah, American's go bigger while other countries must design better for land and conditions other than what is behind the big green Panther. All the while america is losing small farms at a record pace.

 

[Buggs67]

America is not Portugal, or Sweden, or Italy. American products are developed for our needs and market. And for our wallet. You won't see too many Dodge Rams with Hemis or Cummins parked in shopping centers in Europe. And you won't see those specialized little tractors harvesting hundreds and thousands of acres in the mid-west. We have specialized vehicles, but sometimes it's not economical to develop them. it's better to import them from those who specialize in producing them.

I get very tired of Europeans telling us what is wrong with us. Few have ever been here and cannot consieve of the great distances and huge farms in this country.

Even more, I'm tired of Americans bashing America. We are not like Sweden, or Portugal, et al. We are like America.

 

[geoffleach]

That is exactly where these tractors are used.

These tractors are specialized tractors meant to be used in orchard, vineyards, greenhouses and hilly ground. They have to be very low to clear branches and with a really low center of gravity for hills and such.

While there are loaders for these tractors, the arms have to be very long to clear the nose and makes for a cumbersome loader and very little capacity. Plus, a loader it's an easy and fast way to destroy the pivot point and even break castings.

I have an Antonio Carraro 9800 with a Bonatti loader mounted on the front. They are also mountable on the rear. One needs to be extra careful not to tip forward, but with that in mind I have had no problems.

 

[ptsg]

Antonio Carraro tractors at work in the good ol'USA.

 

[ovrszd]

Few have ever been here and cannot consieve of the great distances and huge farms in this country.

Was gonna mention this earlier and got side tracked. Europeans have been using tractors with road gear speeds of 30 mph or so for decades. Reason being their tractors get used on the roads a LOT. Way more than here. Their farms might be smaller and their fields most certainly smaller. But their tractors are used in a way we are not accustomed to here.

First time I saw a high speed tractor was in Germany. I think it was a Fendt. But because I met it so quickly I might be wrong. It was hauling butt pulling a large 4 wheel wagon. Easily 30 mph. Looked gigantic coming at me.

 

[ljjhouser]

I don't it means we are behind or it is just not needed here. I don't see a very market for it here. But there is no question that the last 20 years have put us behind in manufacturing.

 

[Hay Dude]

Was gonna mention this earlier and got side tracked. Europeans have been using tractors with road gear speeds of 30 mph or so for decades. Reason being their tractors get used on the roads a LOT. Way more than here. Their farms might be smaller and their fields most certainly smaller. But their tractors are used in a way we are not accustomed to here.

First time I saw a high speed tractor was in Germany. I think it was a Fendt. But because I met it so quickly I might be wrong. It was hauling butt pulling a large 4 wheel wagon. Easily 30 mph. Looked gigantic coming at me.

Man are you living in the past. Lol
I have been running 30+Mph tractors for 10-12 years.
Other farmers around here even longer-back to the early 2000’s

 

[ovrszd]

Man are you living in the past. Lol
I have been running 30+Mph tractors for 10-12 years.
Other farmers around here even longer-back to the early 2000’s

Well Sir,,,, Europeans have been using them for 40 years. The incident I quoted happened in 1987 or 1988, can't remember for sure....

 

[Agvg]

In the US you have a very large market for small hobby tractors, and you buy new tractors, here there is a hobby market but it's in the 50 to 110hp area and of course few buy new. Foton/Lovol is the only brand that has any sales in the 50hp market, and Lovol outsells Kubota in the overall market. Those articulated Italian tractors is for sale here but it's specialist machines, very expensive and small.

And farming in a small scale is really just a expensive hobby here, witch is a pity.

 

[Jstpssng]

And farming in a small scale is really just a expensive hobby here, witch is a pity.

Unless you are organic or some other specialty market, the same can be said here in the US.

 

[Agvg]

Unless you are organic or some other specialty market, the same can be said here in the US.

Have a small farm, I just sell the gras, exchanging bills and hopes to earn a few hundred dollars. Have to farm it my self so this bill exchange is to obey the law, the alternative is to rent out the land for minimum 10 years in a locked deal, a arrangement I do not like.

 

[npalen]

I have a Italian vineyard but mine does not articulate. Mine has 4 wheel steering, 4 wheel drive and you drive forward or backward just rotate the seat. Step on a pedal and lock both front and back axel and it petty hard to stop it. A very handy tractor.

Does this "Italian vineyard" have a make or model?