Requesting advice on backup generator

[5030]

Vacuum operated? That would be odd.
I’m guessing you mean vacuum enclosed switches

You always nit pick...lol Yes, the transfer switch is a vacuum breaker type to reduce arching under load. I've never had the covers off the enclosures either. Both operate flawlessly and yes, I had a certified electrician do all the electrical hookups. All I did was set both of them on concrete pads. I don't fool with electricity. Good way to get dead and why I never fool with generator extension cords and the like. I prefer hard wired and wired by a competent electrician. When the power goes out, they do what they are supposed to do and if we have a brown out, they will isolate the utility power and also assume the load. Very seamless, all we hear is the transfer switch in the house engaging and disengaging. I presume the same way with the diesel unit as well but I've never been in the shop or the barns when it energized.

Best insurance policy I ever bought and 100% turn key.

Seems as though when we lose utility power, it's always inclement weather and I, for one, don't want to be outside min it and I don't have to be. The Generacs do what they are supposed to do, flawlessly.

Glad I purchased them when I did. I see the prices have really went up on them today, like everything else today.

I believe Generac builds their own NG and Propane fired engines. I will say the one liter V twin in the house unit is all assembled with socket head capscrews. SHCS is a sign of quality in my opinion.

This fall, I did have to replace the cabinet on the house unit. When I bought it, way back when, the only option was a powder coated steel enclosure that over the years being in the elements, started rusting away but Generac provided me with a new aluminum powder coated enclosure. I had to remove all the guts from the steel enclosure and install them in the aluminum enclosure and even being as old as it was, it was basically plug and play. Only issue was the new enclosure set me back almost 4 grand, but was still a lot less than a new 21 KW unit.

I believe all of them now come in aluminum enclosures however and they are much fancier than my old unit. I believe the new ones are Bluetooth compatible and you can control them (like set the exercise time and have a service reminder) on your cell phone. None of that was available when I bought my units.

In reality, I service both of them once a year, usually in October. Change the oil, new air filters, new fuel filter on the diesel and oil filters and the oil filters crosses over to WIX so I use WIX Platinum oil filters and WIX air filters and the fuel filter on the diesel unit is a Racor. Just put the owners manuals away a few days ago or I'd tell you when I bought them both but seems to me it was around 12 years ago.

 

[5030]

I might add that I have replaced the starting batteries in both a couple times. They both have onboard trickle chargers but batteries don't last a real long time up here in the frozen cold north. I believe you can get them with battery heating plates now as well.

 

[bdhsfz6]

My wife has told me, in no uncertain terms, that I will have a backup generator installed or she will find someone to install one.

Here's what I think are the key factors I have to consider:

• We both work from home much of the time, but no longer have phone service, and can't get a cellular signal. That means our only connection to the outside world is Starlink. I have UPSs on key components so that we have about 20 minutes to let people know the power has gone down.
• Work is the primary concern. It's no problem for us to deal with a day without power, but it's generally related to a big snow storm, which means we can't leave to go to the office, and can't even let people know why we aren't responding.
• I have installed a monitoring system in the main electrical panel and have been monitoring for a while. We never exceed about 11kW, and only hit that when the hot tub is running (about 4.5kW by itself).
• House is 200amp service, but we don't have air conditioning and use propane for range/oven and boiler (hot water/heat). Electic dryer, but no reason to run the dryer while on the generator. Jet pump for water pressure.
• We live in a very remote area, so outages are "common." I'd estimate an average of about once per month. Sometimes the outage only lasts a few minutes, but at least once or twice a year we'll go down for 6-8 hours, or even more.
• Because we're in such a remote area, getting someone out to handle any kind of service is a real problem.
• There's not really a place to put a propane tank anywhere near where power enters the house. Plus we're remote enough that if we did run out of propane, a delivery might take days or weeks to get here.
• We get lots of snow, so I must have plenty of diesel on hand for the tractor. We've never had a situation where I ran out of diesel and couldn't get out to get more.
• We plan to be here for at least another 20 years and expect the situation is more likely to get worse than to get better.

I have a new Kubota skid steer, so I have a dealer, and I trust Kubota engines, so I'm looking at the Kubota GL14000. I believe it's big enough for my needs, and I think a water-cooled Kubota diesel engine is likely to outlive me. I also really like the fact that I could just use the forks to pick it up and put it on a trailer to take it to the dealer if there was a problem, instead of having to get a service person out.

Problem is that the Kubota looks like it will be around double the cost of a more "normal" backup generator from Generac, etc. Would you try to talk me out of or into buying the Kubota?

The other issue is the transfer switch. My preference would actually be a manual interlock. Many outages are brief and/or overnight. If the power goes out for 10 minutes, overnight, I'd rather just sleep through it. Also, it seems very common for the power to go on and off serveral times before settling back down. I'd rather just start the generator when the power goes off and let it run until I can switch back to line power without interrupting anything. And if we're not here when the power goes out, everything will be fine until we get back.

Problem there is that I'm not always there, and I'm not entirely sure my wife even CAN be trained to start the generator and flip the switch. In the grand scheme of things, the cost of an automatic transfer switch isn't that big a deal, so do you think I'm over-estimating the advantages of being in control?

I'm in EXACTLY the same situation.

After my 12 KW PTO generator became too difficult to repeatedly set up at my age, I spent quite a bit of time deciding on the best replacement. Any backup generator is only as good as it's fuel supply you have on hand or can reliably get during an extended outage. I fuel my tractors with diesel and use fuel oil from my 1000 gal oil burner tank. It made perfect sense to stay with diesel.

My PTO generator was 12 KW, and I never had an issue with it being too small. I first looked at the Kubota GL14000, but decided on the smaller GL11000 to save some $$.

I installed it in the back of my barn and control it from the house. I elected to use manual start over an automatic transfer switch. My wife is definitely not mechanically inclined but I had little trouble teaching her how to use it. We test run it once a month and she starts it with my supervision.

Here is a link to a post I made on the project:

Your last generator Maintenance Run

Timely 90, as the cold-weather closes-in ! (y) Rgds, D.

www.tractorbynet.com

See post #7099

Since I presently fuel my tractors from a pump at the house, I'm currently working on a project to transport fuel to the generator in the barn.

Welcome to the forum and keep us posted with your decision.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

I'm in EXACTLY the same situation.

After my 12 KW PTO generator became too difficult to repeatedly set up at my age, I spent quite a bit of time deciding on the best replacement.

When I get to that point, I have an older small Kubota tractor that's no longer worth much, that I'll just leave hooked up to my pto generator and build an encloser around it.

Then I'll call it a cheaper way to have a very good whole house generator, and I already have everything bought plus it already has a proven perfect record of working great here!

SR

 

[Locoweed]

I think some of the automatic transfer switches can have the outage time that it takes to fire up the generator adjusted.

Diesel generators have been more expensive than home propane generators for a long time. A water cooled diesel engine costs more to build than the air cooled propane ones which are basically bigger lawnmower engines.

If there's no place for a propane tank, is there a place for a diesel tank? Diesel has more BTUS per gallon and is easier to store as its not under pressure but you'd still need a sizeable tank to get through an outage where you can't get out to get more fuel. You're less likely to be able to find someone to deliver diesel so you may have to buy a transfer tank and haul it into town to get fuel yourself.

We're in a steep mountainous area and everyone is on propane. They find some pretty inventive places to put the tanks. As long as the driver can get the truck close enough to haul the hose to the tank.

I've had a manual system for a long time and even with a printed checklist and periodic training my wife would rather not deal with it. If you can come up with an automated way to run it now, you'll be thankful later. I see utilities in other states following California utilities lead in practices like EPSS and PSPS that result in more outages but let them skimp on maintenance. I don't think that utility regulation will be anything but worse in the forseeable future. Outages will likely be more frequent and longer.

Solar and batteries can be a good backup system if you can afford them. If you get extended outages like we do then a way to top off batteries with a generator is a good idea. If you have an inclination to go solar, now is the time to do it. It is likely that tarriffs on components will increase and the tax rebate may go away.

Most of the power outages I experience are weather related. That generally translates to clouds & little to no solar.

 

[bdhsfz6]

When I get to that point, I have an older small Kubota tractor that's no longer worth much, that I'll just leave hooked up to my pto generator and build an encloser around it.

Then I'll call it a cheaper way to have a very good whole house generator, and I already have everything bought plus it already has a proven perfect record of working great here!

SR

I have two tractors and I did that for awhile. There always seems to be a reason to use both for tasks other than powering a PTO genny though. I suppose I could have bought another used tractor to dedicate to generator use but I decided to spend a bit more for a standalone unit.

I like the fact that it can be controlled from the comfort of the house, which would be difficult to do with a tractor.

Every situation is different, and what works for some, may not for all. YMMV.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

When/if the crapola hits the fan, those addicted to electricity will be some of the first to go, and that's not us.

If needed, I'm just fine walking out the back door of my home to start my tractor/generator or to check on it. Truth is, the way I'm set up here, I really don't have to run a generator. I made sure of that...

SR

 

[ericm979]

Most of the power outages I experience are weather related. That generally translates to clouds & little to no solar.

Same here in CA. One of our neighbors there has a solar and battery system that can use a generator to charge the batteries.

Even when it's raining and overcast they get some power from the solar panels but not enough to keep the batteries charged. So every couple days they run the generator for a few hours to top off the batteries. It beats running a generator full time (or most of the day like we do) when most of the time the generator's only putting out a fraction of it's capacity.