death of regular cab pickups

[Jstpssng]

Just for fun I specked out a new version of the truck I would buy if I could find a clean used for the right price; Regular cab F250 4x4. The only options I clicked on were the snow plow package, 10,000 GVRW and locking rear end. It was a bit over 50K. For comparison I had specked a similar truck in 2020 before buying my Colorado; a similar Ford or GM at the time was around 36K. That's around a 30% jump in under 3 years.

 

[deserteagle71]

Just for fun I specked out a new version of the truck I would buy if I could find a clean used for the right price; Regular cab F250 4x4. The only options I clicked on were the snow plow package, 10,000 GVRW and locking rear end. It was a bit over 50K. For comparison I had specked a similar truck in 2020 before buying my Colorado; a similar Ford or GM at the time was around 36K. That's around a 30% jump in under 3 years.

That's about right. It's called "making hay while the sun shines"...the auto manufacturers saw that the buying public were willing to buy no matter how high the price so they just kept raising the prices, and they will keep on doing so until the buying public stops buying.

For the past 3 years or so I'd been shopping for a new Jeep Wrangler to replace my 2006. The prices have soared in those 3 years. How's this for a Wrangler which essentially is just a toy?

A version of the Wrangler is now available with the 6.4l V8. Starting price is ~ $85,000 - but dealers are adding surcharges taking the price much higher. Yet Jeep can't make enough of them! THAT'S why the prices are so high - because people are willing to pay!

By the way...Jeep is now making the "Grand Wagoneer" model again. It starts around $110,000............

 

[blacktruck]

That's about right. It's called "making hay while the sun shines"...the auto manufacturers saw that the buying public were willing to buy no matter how high the price so they just kept raising the prices, and they will keep on doing so until the buying public stops buying.

For the past 3 years or so I'd been shopping for a new Jeep Wrangler to replace my 2006. The prices have soared in those 3 years. How's this for a Wrangler which essentially is just a toy?
View attachment 793873

A version of the Wrangler is now available with the 6.4l V8. Starting price is ~ $85,000 - but dealers are adding surcharges taking the price much higher. Yet Jeep can't make enough of them! THAT'S why the prices are so high - because people are willing to pay!

By the way...Jeep is now making the "Grand Wagoneer" model again. It starts around $110,000............

I can't say that I am shocked by all of this. Definitely surprised but not shocked. I haven't bought a new truck since 2007. I bought a new diesel just prior to the installation of the DPF. I cannot imagine buying a car or truck (non-commercial) that cost nearly as much as a decent home in this area. I don't know who is buying these and how they are paying for them. I think they have pretty much priced themselves out of the realm of reality for many people. Looking at the facilities owned by many car dealerships, someone is making money in this process along with the manufacturer. Yep, as much as I would like to get a new truck or car, I'm out of the market now.

 

[Big Barn]

here’s my special order F150 regular cab (6.5 foot) short box.

my dealer sells 500(+~-) F150s per year and was only allotted one regular cab last year and this one for 2023.

 

[Deleted member 371759]

I can't say that I am shocked by all of this. Definitely surprised but not shocked. I haven't bought a new truck since 2007. I bought a new diesel just prior to the installation of the DPF. I cannot imagine buying a car or truck (non-commercial) that cost nearly as much as a decent home in this area. I don't know who is buying these and how they are paying for them. I think they have pretty much priced themselves out of the realm of reality for many people. Looking at the facilities owned by many car dealerships, someone is making money in this process along with the manufacturer. Yep, as much as I would like to get a new truck or car, I'm out of the market now.

I will never buy a new vehicle again. I will drag a 1989 caviler out of the woods and fix it before I give these automakers another dime. I bought a 2016 Tacoma and it was a joke. Trans shifted like garbage dealer said it was normal. I went to the dealer and told them, I wanted to sell it back and buy a decked out Tundra. Greedy suckers couldnt wait to buy it back. Took the check and walked out the door. Bought my 2003 cat eye Duramax. Dropped S&S SAC injectors in it and have had it since.

 

[ovrszd]

That's about right. It's called "making hay while the sun shines"...the auto manufacturers saw that the buying public were willing to buy no matter how high the price so they just kept raising the prices, and they will keep on doing so until the buying public stops buying.

For the past 3 years or so I'd been shopping for a new Jeep Wrangler to replace my 2006. The prices have soared in those 3 years. How's this for a Wrangler which essentially is just a toy?
View attachment 793873

A version of the Wrangler is now available with the 6.4l V8. Starting price is ~ $85,000 - but dealers are adding surcharges taking the price much higher. Yet Jeep can't make enough of them! THAT'S why the prices are so high - because people are willing to pay!

By the way...Jeep is now making the "Grand Wagoneer" model again. It starts around $110,000............

I like ur spec sheet. How much for Rubicon or did you check?

 

[ovrszd]

I can't say that I am shocked by all of this. Definitely surprised but not shocked. I haven't bought a new truck since 2007. I bought a new diesel just prior to the installation of the DPF. I cannot imagine buying a car or truck (non-commercial) that cost nearly as much as a decent home in this area. I don't know who is buying these and how they are paying for them. I think they have pretty much priced themselves out of the realm of reality for many people. Looking at the facilities owned by many car dealerships, someone is making money in this process along with the manufacturer. Yep, as much as I would like to get a new truck or car, I'm out of the market now.

Had to think about it. Last new was 2004.

 

[ovrszd]

here’s my special order F150 regular cab (6.5 foot) short box.

my dealer sells 500(+~-) F150s per year and was only allotted one regular cab last year and this one for 2023.

View attachment 793908

Oh my friend, you an I would look very good cruisin that!!!

Trucks like this turn my head every time!!!! Not gonna meet yourself coming down the road in that!!!

 

[Hughman]

I like ur spec sheet. How much for Rubicon or did you check?

I've had one on order since Christmas. Still hasn't hit the production line and I'm not holding out much hope at this point because of the 100% recall on all manual JLs. Just north of 60k.

 

[OzarkChris]

A half-ton, crew cab truck is extremely versatile. It has more room inside for passengers than basically any car on the market barring none. The rear seats can be folded up to the back wall, allowing a flat floor that is large and can accommodate a lot. The seats are comfortable, the cab is as quiet as a sedan. You get the higher ride height most people seem to want. Acceleration is very quick with today's engines, be it V8 or turbo 6. Braking, handling, and ride quality is quite good...

This is NOT a slam on you - youve already stated your need for trucks, but I think this first paragraph is exactly why the price of trucks cost 3+x the cost of my first house. IMO "Big City Folk" (BCF) wouldn't be caught dead in a "Standard - No frills" vehicle. As I've mentioned many times (in numerous threads), we get these BCF (or what we also call "Weekenders") that come out here, buy a tiny lot - 5-10 acres - and then build a McMansion so they can park their decked out 4x4 350/3500 - usually non-dually - their Lexus or Porsche SUV and much more tractor than they really need. 90+% of these BCF appear to very rarely (if ever) used this much truck for what it was made for.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not faulting them for buying them, just making an observation. IMO, trucks like that were made for heavy hauling, trampsing through the slop on the farm, etc. The surly don't need auto wipers, headlights or autonomous (or what ever they call it) cruise controls. I also think that if a person can't backup a trailer (without the autonomous trailer backer option) they really shouldn't be hauling a trailer. I personally see so many folk that appear to be BCF hauling trailers that are more than just dangerous. I'm talking about idiotic loads that are running 3-4x the limit if their trailers. One recent example was a guy pulling a 10-12' trailer (single axle, of course) filled to at least 4' high (3 rows over the rails) front to back with cement block. The trailer looked really new, but I'm sure currently has either a busted or severely compromised axle. Beside that, he was going 50+ mph with out any lashings, just the back gate closed. Unless he packed it this way, it appeared he had already lost several blocks from the back corners.

Anyway that's my turn on the soapbox tonight.

 

[two_bit_score]

here’s my special order F150 regular cab (6.5 foot) short box.

my dealer sells 500(+~-) F150s per year and was only allotted one regular cab last year and this one for 2023.

View attachment 793908

Nice truck BB!

 

[sunandsand]

This is NOT a slam on you - youve already stated your need for trucks, but I think this first paragraph is exactly why the price of trucks cost 3+x the cost of my first house. IMO "Big City Folk" (BCF) wouldn't be caught dead in a "Standard - No frills" vehicle. As I've mentioned many times (in numerous threads), we get these BCF (or what we also call "Weekenders") that come out here, buy a tiny lot - 5-10 acres - and then build a McMansion so they can park their decked out 4x4 350/3500 - usually non-dually - their Lexus or Porsche SUV and much more tractor than they really need. 90+% of these BCF appear to very rarely (if ever) used this much truck for what it was made for.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not faulting them for buying them, just making an observation. IMO, trucks like that were made for heavy hauling, trampsing through the slop on the farm, etc. The surly don't need auto wipers, headlights or autonomous (or what ever they call it) cruise controls. I also think that if a person can't backup a trailer (without the autonomous trailer backer option) they really shouldn't be hauling a trailer. I personally see so many folk that appear to be BCF hauling trailers that are more than just dangerous. I'm talking about idiotic loads that are running 3-4x the limit if their trailers. One recent example was a guy pulling a 10-12' trailer (single axle, of course) filled to at least 4' high (3 rows over the rails) front to back with cement block. The trailer looked really new, but I'm sure currently has either a busted or severely compromised axle. Beside that, he was going 50+ mph with out any lashings, just the back gate closed. Unless he packed it this way, it appeared he had already lost several blocks from the back corners.

Anyway that's my turn on the soapbox tonight.

I see this a LOT around here. ("Around here" being east central Florida.) I was a mortgage broker for over 20 years and have had a RE license for over 35. The vast majority of buyers go for the biggest, fanciest house they can (just barely) afford, thinking their income is going to rise real soon now so it won't hurt quite so much in the very near future. They're invariably disappointed. I've seen homes in high-roller developments with zero furniture (!) but with first, second, third and even fourth mortgages. With both people working, if one of them has a cold and misses one day's work, they're in foreclosure. But they look successful while it lasts.

I was also in the local tourist development bureau. We collected and spent the bed taxes (about $2.5MM/yr) on advertising to bring in more tourists - sort of a financial perpetual motion machine, funded by other people's money. We got a new ad agency, and the guy's pitch was that nobody takes their super-duper $100K truck off road, but they want it to look like they can. (And in most cases, as off-road as these trucks get is parking on the lawn at somebody's yard sale.) He said 90% of ALL purchases is for image and nothing more. He holds that when most people get their hands on a little money, they promptly buy stuff which tries to show that they have a LOT of money instead of a little - keeping up with the Joneses is a very powerful motivator, and they often keep up with them right into bankruptcy court (my wife the lawyer filed more than a few cases for people like this). His ad agency is very successful - he's figured out what people think they want (as opposed to actually need) and sells it to them.

Why are there so few single cab pickup trucks? Because most pickup truck buyers are buying an image instead of a work vehicle or a tool, and the manufacturers are only too glad to provide these luxo-trucks which as we have noted, are really, really expensive and have high markups.

Those few of us who want single cab, no or few frills trucks because we plan to actually USE them as trucks are in the minority. And what? You want a manual transmission, too? Good luck . . .

I do suppose it is a mostly harmless way for people to spend their money, but personally, I'd rather stash my bucks in income producing assets instead of absurdly expensive, rapidly depreciating shiny new toys.

I guess we're just out of step here on TBN. So be it.

Best Regards,

Mike/Florida

 

[deserteagle71]

I like ur spec sheet. How much for Rubicon or did you check?

That IS a Rubicon list price I posted this morning, spec'd with a diesel engine. Over $70,000.

 

[Big Barn]

Nice truck BB!

thanks, tbs

 

[jyoutz]

I see this a LOT around here. ("Around here" being east central Florida.) I was a mortgage broker for over 20 years and have had a RE license for over 35. The vast majority of buyers go for the biggest, fanciest house they can (just barely) afford, thinking their income is going to rise real soon now so it won't hurt quite so much in the very near future. They're invariably disappointed. I've seen homes in high-roller developments with zero furniture (!) but with first, second, third and even fourth mortgages. With both people working, if one of them has a cold and misses one day's work, they're in foreclosure. But they look successful while it lasts.

I was also in the local tourist development bureau. We collected and spent the bed taxes (about $2.5MM/yr) on advertising to bring in more tourists - sort of a financial perpetual motion machine, funded by other people's money. We got a new ad agency, and the guy's pitch was that nobody takes their super-duper $100K truck off road, but they want it to look like they can. (And in most cases, as off-road as these trucks get is parking on the lawn at somebody's yard sale.) He said 90% of ALL purchases is for image and nothing more. He holds that when most people get their hands on a little money, they promptly buy stuff which tries to show that they have a LOT of money instead of a little - keeping up with the Joneses is a very powerful motivator, and they often keep up with them right into bankruptcy court (my wife the lawyer filed more than a few cases for people like this). His ad agency is very successful - he's figured out what people think they want (as opposed to actually need) and sells it to them.

Why are there so few single cab pickup trucks? Because most pickup truck buyers are buying an image instead of a work vehicle or a tool, and the manufacturers are only too glad to provide these luxo-trucks which as we have noted, are really, really expensive and have high markups.

Those few of us who want single cab, no or few frills trucks because we plan to actually USE them as trucks are in the minority. And what? You want a manual transmission, too? Good luck . . .

I do suppose it is a mostly harmless way for people to spend their money, but personally, I'd rather stash my bucks in income producing assets instead of absurdly expensive, rapidly depreciating shiny new toys.

I guess we're just out of step here on TBN. So be it.

Best Regards,

Mike/Florida

I have a long bed quad cab 4x4 truck with Cummins diesel. It has done lots of work hauling firewood, hay, cargo, and trailers. Lots of work trucks are 4 doors because they need to haul more than 2 or 3 people. A standard cab truck with manual transmission is basically a two person vehicle. Many loggers use quad cabs to haul crews in the woods and refer to them as “6 packs.” Having 2 or 4 doors has nothing to do with their use for work.

 

[Hay Dude]

I see this a LOT around here. ("Around here" being east central Florida.) I was a mortgage broker for over 20 years and have had a RE license for over 35. The vast majority of buyers go for the biggest, fanciest house they can (just barely) afford, thinking their income is going to rise real soon now so it won't hurt quite so much in the very near future. They're invariably disappointed. I've seen homes in high-roller developments with zero furniture (!) but with first, second, third and even fourth mortgages. With both people working, if one of them has a cold and misses one day's work, they're in foreclosure. But they look successful while it lasts.

I was also in the local tourist development bureau. We collected and spent the bed taxes (about $2.5MM/yr) on advertising to bring in more tourists - sort of a financial perpetual motion machine, funded by other people's money. We got a new ad agency, and the guy's pitch was that nobody takes their super-duper $100K truck off road, but they want it to look like they can. (And in most cases, as off-road as these trucks get is parking on the lawn at somebody's yard sale.) He said 90% of ALL purchases is for image and nothing more. He holds that when most people get their hands on a little money, they promptly buy stuff which tries to show that they have a LOT of money instead of a little - keeping up with the Joneses is a very powerful motivator, and they often keep up with them right into bankruptcy court (my wife the lawyer filed more than a few cases for people like this). His ad agency is very successful - he's figured out what people think they want (as opposed to actually need) and sells it to them.

Why are there so few single cab pickup trucks? Because most pickup truck buyers are buying an image instead of a work vehicle or a tool, and the manufacturers are only too glad to provide these luxo-trucks which as we have noted, are really, really expensive and have high markups.

Those few of us who want single cab, no or few frills trucks because we plan to actually USE them as trucks are in the minority. And what? You want a manual transmission, too? Good luck . . .

I do suppose it is a mostly harmless way for people to spend their money, but personally, I'd rather stash my bucks in income producing assets instead of absurdly expensive, rapidly depreciating shiny new toys.

I guess we're just out of step here on TBN. So be it.

Best Regards,

Mike/Florida

I have another take on this. I use my Ram 5500 purely for work. Period. It’s a Laramie.
I have heated & cooled seats-I love them. Nothing makes the day a little easier when it’s hot outside and you can turn them on to get some of the sweat off you. On cold days, they help keep you in the field a little longer by adding some warmth to my tired body when it’s 20* outside.
I have a crew cab- Its great with seats folded down for carrying my most valuable tools, like my hay baler monitor ($5,000) my moisture testers, my laser, equipment manuals, etc. Last thing I want is them bouncing around in metal tool boxes. With seats up, I can take extra help with me to work.
Automatic transmission- Love it for towing. Todays modern automatics are fantastic. They can be shifted manually, too. Not as effectively as the 8LL or the Spicer 7 speed I had in my previous dump trucks, but at least there’s some manual control. They also are safer for towing since you have your hands more available for the wheel. They down shift, too. And when coupled with a diesel engine, they have very effective exhaust braking. Mine will slow the truck & trailer without barely any use of the service brakes.
Cruise control- great for long hauling trips
LED lighting-brighter/safer at night. Easier to see deer. Longer lasting. Less battery draw.
Back up cameras-improve safety, prevent trailer/truck damage when backing.

While I DO agree stripped work trucks should always be available, I do not think “loaded” trucks indicate any measure of softness in the owner/operator. Yeah sure there’s keyboard warriors out there with money that must have the best of everything.
You try doing what I do for a living. It ain't easy. Having a truck that takes a little of the work out of the day and makes me a little more comfortable is a God send to me. I had vinyl stripped trucks. They were uncomfortable and I didn‘t look forward to driving them. A loaded truck makes me want to keep working longer.

 

[Hay Dude]

That IS a Rubicon list price I posted this morning, spec'd with a diesel engine. Over $70,000.

I would love to have a Gladiator diesel to replace my 2020 Rubicon 2 door. I didn’t know they still offered a diesel. Figured they dumped it by now.

 

[sunandsand]

Jyoutz,

Agree with you 100%.

Problem is that people often buy trucks (and all kinds of other things) for non-logical reasons.

4x4 Cummins dual cab long bed with big gnarly tires used for logging, hay, towing horse trailer, serious work = totally appropriate.

4x4 Cummins dual cab long bed with big gnarly tires parked in gated development = HOA Karens call in an air strike.

All options super duper big-buck shiny dual cab with 3' bed and flimsy brush guard in gated community = neighbors envy.

All options super duper big buck shiny dual cab with 3' bed and flimsy brush guard deep in the woods or in the desert or trying to cross the Darien Gap = missing persons report.

Single cab manual transmission basic pickup truck in gated development = HOA Karens check if any ammo remaining from previous air strike.

Single cab manual transmission basic pickup truck back and forth to Tractor Supply, Home Depot, actually used for light to moderate work = I want that. (But I do want A/C, it gets hot here in the summer.)

I don't happen to need a serious work truck, dual cab, 4x4, etc., but I absolutely understand that some people really do, and I have no issue at all with that. It is the right tool for their job.

People are going to do what they want to, our approval or disapproval doesn't matter.

Fortunately, we DO have choices, even if some of them are a bit tough to fulfill or don't make sense to other people.

Best Regards,

Mike/Florida

 

[ovrszd]

I've had one on order since Christmas. Still hasn't hit the production line and I'm not holding out much hope at this point because of the 100% recall on all manual JLs. Just north of 60k.

I paid $23.5K for a well equipped '04 Rubicon. When you think about it, that's not bad.

 

[jyoutz]

Jyoutz,

Agree with you 100%.

Problem is that people often buy trucks (and all kinds of other things) for non-logical reasons.

4x4 Cummins dual cab long bed with big gnarly tires used for logging, hay, towing horse trailer, serious work = totally appropriate.

4x4 Cummins dual cab long bed with big gnarly tires parked in gated development = HOA Karens call in an air strike.

All options super duper big-buck shiny dual cab with 3' bed and flimsy brush guard in gated community = neighbors envy.

All options super duper big buck shiny dual cab with 3' bed and flimsy brush guard deep in the woods or in the desert or trying to cross the Darien Gap = missing persons report.

Single cab manual transmission basic pickup truck in gated development = HOA Karens check if any ammo remaining from previous air strike.

Single cab manual transmission basic pickup truck back and forth to Tractor Supply, Home Depot, actually used for light to moderate work = I want that. (But I do want A/C, it gets hot here in the summer.)

I don't happen to need a serious work truck, dual cab, 4x4, etc., but I absolutely understand that some people really do, and I have no issue at all with that. It is the right tool for their job.

People are going to do what they want to, our approval or disapproval doesn't matter.

Fortunately, we DO have choices, even if some of them are a bit tough to fulfill or don't make sense to other people.

Best Regards,

Mike/Florida

Yeah, we all have lots of choices. Some spend their money wisely by buying what they need, and some buy what they want regardless of need. We are free to do that.