If it's cold where you live, what are you heating with and what is it costing?

[ovrszd]

When I say bias it wasn't personal. Firewood is a wildcard. Because there are so many variables.

A gallon of propane in California is a gallon of propane in Maine. A kwh is the same in Texas ad it is in PA.

Wood.....totally different. We can only estimate btu per cord and furnace efficiency. Variables like moisture content, wood species, etc.

Then costs vary widely. So inserting your numbers and think they are accurate for someone a few states away is the bias I refer to.

And in the great state of Missouri there are trees that won't generate enough BTUs to replace the fuel used to process them.

 

[lman]

And in the great state of Missouri there are trees that won't generate enough BTUs to replace the fuel used to process them.

Pine or Cottonwood?

 

[ovrszd]

Pine or Cottonwood?

Or Elm or Walnut.

 

[lman]

I remember when I was a kid, we used a lot of elm trees that had died from Dutch elm disease. My dad gave us the job of splitting it with a sledge and wedges(not many hydraulic splitters back then). Not much elm around now.
Maybe that's why I use geothermal, plus I don't have any kids to do the grunt work.

 

[MossRoad]

Unless you plan on butchering the deer yourself, you won't save money

Yes, I plan on doing it myself. Paying for deer processing is costly.

 

[ovrszd]

I remember when I was a kid, we used a lot of elm trees that had died from Dutch elm disease. My dad gave us the job of splitting it with a sledge and wedges(not many hydraulic splitters back then). Not much elm around now.
Maybe that's why I use geothermal, plus I don't have any kids to do the grunt work.

I have a dozen or so Elm trees scattered in my yard. They were isolated from timber so elm disease didn't get to them. Rare to find an older elm in the timber. I know them as Chinese Elm. Horrible firewood. Green it won't burn. Cured it burns like paper. Same with Walnut.

Here Maple is worthless as firewood also.

 

[jjeff]

I have a dozen or so Elm trees scattered in my yard. They were isolated from timber so elm disease didn't get to them. Rare to find an older elm in the timber. I know them as Chinese Elm. Horrible firewood. Green it won't burn. Cured it burns like paper. Same with Walnut.

Here Maple is worthless as firewood also.

Curious as to why maple is worthless? I like burning it, I usually drop a dying one, yellow birch, or beech trees, to burn, seasoned maple seems to burn best though. The key I've found is seasoning the wood. In any case I burn what's available on my property, always trying to find diseased or dying trees.

 

[ovrszd]

Curious as to why maple is worthless? I like burning it, I usually drop a dying one, yellow birch, or beech trees, to burn, seasoned maple seems to burn best though. The key I've found is seasoning the wood. In any case I burn what's available on my property, always trying to find diseased or dying trees.

I'm sure there are many varieties of maple trees. I'm not sure what variety is prevalent here. They are a soft wood, sappy when fresh cut, light weight and heatless when cured.

I'm very Blessed with excellent choices here so maple, elm, cottonwood, walnut, go to the bottom of the list.

An example of choices, my good friend lives in Colorado. His choices are pine or aspen. I wouldn't even bother to cut them here. More than once he has hauled a pickup load of good firewood home when he visits here.

 

[Oaktree]

I was surprised by the price difference between CT and NH which are relatively close together geographically and share the same forested topography.

It seems a bit odd to me as well, 'most everything is more expensive in Conn. You seem to be getting an exceptionally good deal.

I can't tell you how much money i've saved on meat when i was hunting.

Most game meat is an acquired taste. I've had venison a couple times and didn't particularly care for it.
Then you have to take into account the amount of time you spend traipsing around the woods lugging a gun, the cost of the license and the hassle of getting your catch out. Fine if you enjoy that, but to me it doesn't sound like fun at all.

 

[ovrszd]

It seems a bit odd to me as well, 'most everything is more expensive in Conn. You seem to be getting an exceptionally good deal.

Most game meat is an acquired taste. I've had venison a couple times and didn't particularly care for it.
Then you have to take into account the amount of time you spend traipsing around the woods lugging a gun, the cost of the license and the hassle of getting your catch out. Fine if you enjoy that, but to me it doesn't sound like fun at all.

I grew up hunting. Hunted into middle age. Never got to the point of buying expensive gear including a "stand" to sit in with heat going....

My youngest Son (43) hunts. He really enjoys it. He hunts here on the farm. I can look out my living room window and see the location of one of his favorite spots. Couple weeks ago I texted him and said "hey I just saw a nice 8 point buck and a doe come from the direction of your spot aren't you there?" He replied "yeah I'm here, I just didn't think it was fair to shoot a horny buck, I'll let him get some".

So he's calls and watches way more game than he kills. Last year he was in a tree stand using antlers to try to call bucks. Had a Bobcat come up in the tree with him investigating what that noise was??? Might be something to eat!!!

 

[Oaktree]

I have a dozen or so Elm trees scattered in my yard. They were isolated from timber so elm disease didn't get to them. Rare to find an older elm in the timber. I know them as Chinese Elm. Horrible firewood. Green it won't burn. Cured it burns like paper. Same with Walnut.

Here Maple is worthless as firewood also.

You must have a very different variety of maple than we have in New England. I'd say 80% of what I burn is sugar maple, and it burns very well. Red & swamp maple aren't as good.
Likewise for elm. The large elms of years gone by are now all gone, killed by Dutch Elm disease, but we do still have some elms. They don't live long, but the wood is OK firewood.
Oak (at least red & white...not familiar with other varieties...those are the only 2 I've ever seen) is good firewood too, but we're just about at the northern limit as to where it grows, and it's not as common.

I'm sure there are many varieties of maple trees. I'm not sure what variety is prevalent here. They are a soft wood, sappy when fresh cut, light weight and heatless when cured.

I'm very Blessed with excellent choices here so maple, elm, cottonwood, walnut, go to the bottom of the list.

An example of choices, my good friend lives in Colorado. His choices are pine or aspen. I wouldn't even bother to cut them here. More than once he has hauled a pickup load of good firewood home when he visits here.

Yeah, I don't envy people in western states who heat with wood. Doesn't sound like there are many good choices there.
Curiously, what grows in your area that makes good firewood? I've looked at firewood heat value charts and there are quite a few types that I've never heard of. Osage orange is one that comes to mind.

 

[jjeff]

It seems a bit odd to me as well, 'most everything is more expensive in Conn. You seem to be getting an exceptionally good deal.

Most game meat is an acquired taste. I've had venison a couple times and didn't particularly care for it.
Then you have to take into account the amount of time you spend traipsing around the woods lugging a gun, the cost of the license and the hassle of getting your catch out. Fine if you enjoy that, but to me it doesn't sound like fun at all.

I don't deer hunt anymore but when I did there is a distinctive taste difference in terms of what deer ate up north mostly evergreen boughs, and southern deer that ate mostly field corn. U.P. deer definitely tasted gamier in my experience.

 

[ovrszd]

You must have a very different variety of maple than we have in New England. I'd say 80% of what I burn is sugar maple, and it burns very well. Red & swamp maple aren't as good.
Likewise for elm. The large elms of years gone by are now all gone, killed by Dutch Elm disease, but we do still have some elms. They don't live long, but the wood is OK firewood.
Oak (at least red & white...not familiar with other varieties...those are the only 2 I've ever seen) is good firewood too, but we're just about at the northern limit as to where it grows, and it's not as common.

Yeah, I don't envy people in western states who heat with wood. Doesn't sound like there are many good choices there.
Curiously, what grows in your area that makes good firewood? I've looked at firewood heat value charts and there are quite a few types that I've never heard of. Osage orange is one that comes to mind.

My preference. #1 shell bark hickory. #2 honey locust. #3 mulberry. #4 orange hedge. #5 oak.

There are 10 varieties of oak in Missouri. I don't know them by name. I have 5 varieties that I know of in my timbers. I only harvest oak when they die or storm damaged. I've never tried to count them. So I'll guess I have 60 oak trees that are 100+ years old, trunk diameter 30" or more.

 

[LouNY]

LD1, as for bias, when is simple math bias? I'm an accountant, and math does not lie... it just may come up with an answer that does not fit you personal opinion and preferences. That said, I get that some people don't want the hassle of firewood, the explosive tendencies of natural gas and propane etc, so different methods of heating are better that others depending on what you characteristic you are looking for.

I was surprised by the price difference between CT and NH which are relatively close together geographically and share the same forested topography.

"Math does not lie"

Which just brings us back to the saying;
Figures don't lie, but liars can figure.

or from an 1889 article,
"It has been said that figures will not lie. It is equally true that liars will figure. It is our duty to prevent liars from figuring in the interest of any theory, by presenting original data fairly."

 

[ovrszd]

I don't deer hunt anymore but when I did there is a distinctive taste difference in terms of what deer ate up north mostly evergreen boughs, and southern deer that ate mostly field corn. U.P. deer definitely tasted gamier in my experience.

Talking to the Game Warden the other day. He said 82% of the Deer tagged in my county this year were tag holders with out of State addresses. We grow some very nice white tail deer here. Mostly due to the excellent food sources. People pay stupid money to come here and hunt. Outfitters charge $2000 just to let you hunt. Then they charge if you kill and the amount depends on the size of rack. It's not uncommon for hunters to pay $10,000 by the time they leave. Stupid money.

Out of State hunting clubs have started buying tracts of timber land here.....

 

[jjeff]

Talking to the Game Warden the other day. He said 82% of the Deer tagged in my county this year were tag holders with out of State addresses. We grow some very nice white tail deer here. Mostly due to the excellent food sources. People pay stupid money to come here and hunt. Outfitters charge $2000 just to let you hunt. Then they charge if you kill and the amount depends on the size of rack. It's not uncommon for hunters to pay $10,000 by the time they leave. Stupid money.

Out of State hunting clubs have started buying tracts of timber land here.....

"Drifting" I still have freinds that travel to hunt and spend enormous amounts of money. Imho I'd rather buy tools, equipment for making wood and tractor implements, for my adrenaline fix .

 

[LouNY]

There is a lot of firewood burnt around here and a huge variety of wood to choose from.
Growing up when the large Elm were dying it was a major source of firewood. Standing dead Elm
was kind of self seasoning when the bark started falling off it could be dropped, split (sometimes with great effort)
and burnt and provided good heat. Dry seasoned Maple was good, the various fruit trees had high heat content but a
bunch of work because of all the small brush crap to trim out. White Birch, Poplar, Pines and Hemlock were kindling and
small quick hot fires.
Standing dead Elm that has lost the bark is still a good quick source of firewood, all seasoned and ready to go.
That was growing up with just wood heat and it lucky a load of coal for cold nights.

In recent years Poplar has enjoyed a resurrection as a firewood form small land owners looking for a renewable heat source.
I don't recall the exact acreage required but I believe it was less then 5 acres of Poplar could provide perpetual firewood
for a homeowner. If Poplar is planted and managed allowed to reach 8-12 stumpage cut split and dryed although it is a light wood when dried the btu's per ton are the same as any wood. After the first cut has been done the tree is allowed to repopulate from the stumps triming
out all the suckers except one that come up the resulting tree grows quite rapidly as it is feeding from the root structure already in place
and succeeding cuttings can be harvested much faster then waiting for new production.

 

[jjeff]

There is a lot of firewood burnt around here and a huge variety of wood to choose from.
Growing up when the large Elm were dying it was a major source of firewood. Standing dead Elm
was kind of self seasoning when the bark started falling off it could be dropped, split (sometimes with great effort)
and burnt and provided good heat. Dry seasoned Maple was good, the various fruit trees had high heat content but a
bunch of work because of all the small brush crap to trim out. White Birch, Poplar, Pines and Hemlock were kindling and
small quick hot fires.
Standing dead Elm that has lost the bark is still a good quick source of firewood, all seasoned and ready to go.
That was growing up with just wood heat and it lucky a load of coal for cold nights.

In recent years Poplar has enjoyed a resurrection as a firewood form small land owners looking for a renewable heat source.
I don't recall the exact acreage required but I believe it was less then 5 acres of Poplar could provide perpetual firewood
for a homeowner. If Poplar is planted and managed allowed to reach 8-12 stumpage cut split and dryed although it is a light wood when dried the btu's per ton are the same as any wood. After the first cut has been done the tree is allowed to repopulate from the stumps triming
out all the suckers except one that come up the resulting tree grows quite rapidly as it is feeding from the root structure already in place
and succeeding cuttings can be harvested much faster then waiting for new production.

I've seen a few roadside firewood stands that sell mostly poplar for firewood or I believe it was pople. Also interesting is Usually the first trees to start regrowing a clear cut in my area is poplar

 

[5030]

Popple is miserable to split and burns pretty quick with a ton of ash as well.

 

[LouNY]

Popple is miserable to split and burns pretty quick with a ton of ash as well.

Most of our poplar is straight grained and splits nicely when dried, it does burn quickly I hadn't noticed the ash amount as I don't heat with wood.
I grew up heating multiple houses with wood, so I do not do so.