Advice on YM Purchase

[RUSSELL5000]

Good morning. New to forum. Looking for opinions, comments, ...

Intended use is brush-hogging, ditching, post-hole drilling, moving dirt/material around, and snow-blowing on my five acre property. Considering buying one of the following with FEL from Frederick's: YM2210D, YM2310D, YM2420D, YM2820D, YM3110D.


Question: From what I have read, Frederick's is good to deal with. Any concerns with my basic idea? Opinion on particular tractor.


Question: I would like backhoe as well; I have read that if considering then a subframe will have to be fabricated. Is there a backhoe commonly used with YM tractors? Is my understanding of subframe fabrication correct? What is a reasonable range of costs?


Question: Why is there not the same level of subframe concern with the front end loader? I would think that similar stress would apply to the bell housing area as well.

Thanks much!

 

[HoyeTractor]

My favorites on your list are the 2210D and the 3110D but all of them are nice tractors. Fredricks has been around a long time and I don't think I have seen any negative reviews about their tractors. You will want a subframe if you are adding a backhoe. Those typically have to be custom fabricated for your specific setup. I know several people here have made their own subframe and can probably post some options. A loader does not typically need a subframe because there is not usually a lot of weight on both the front and rear. If you overload the loader (with no backhoe) then the rear of the tractor will just come off the ground. The weight of the front loader combined with the weight (and leverage) of the backhoe really allows you to put a lot of force on that small-ish bellhousing area.

 

[RUSSELL5000]

Thanks, Aaron. Yes, please post some subframe options.

I like the 3110D best.

Appreciate the FEL/subframe explanation.

 

[fried1765]

My favorites on your list are the 2210D and the 3110D but all of them are nice tractors. Fredricks has been around a long time and I don't think I have seen any negative reviews about their tractors. You will want a subframe if you are adding a backhoe. Those typically have to be custom fabricated for your specific setup. I know several people here have made their own subframe and can probably post some options. A loader does not typically need a subframe because there is not usually a lot of weight on both the front and rear. If you overload the loader (with no backhoe) then the rear of the tractor will just come off the ground. The weight of the front loader combined with the weight (and leverage) of the backhoe really allows you to put a lot of force on that small-ish bellhousing area.

EXCELLENT post!
Everyone even thinking about a 3pt. backhoe needs to read this!

 

[California]

In addition to breaking the tractor at the bellhousing - not unusual - there is risk to the back of the tractor. I've read on here of Kubotas with aluminum transmission housing, where driving along and bouncing ripped the upper back out of the transmission casting.

My YM240 and the equivalent Kubota had the same 3-point backhoe listed as an OEM dealer option around 1980. I ran some 15 years before disaster - a 3 point hinge pin worked loose out of the side of the transmission, actually from the separate axle housing, and ripped out a chunk. It was a $500 project to replace the axle housing. My longwinded post about this repair.

In summary 3-point backhoes are hard on tractors. Expect added costs, clear up to possibly catastrophic. Research if others with the tractor you select, have had problems.

Just opinion - I think if your loader has a substructure clear back to the rear axle, then that resists the forces that would break the tractor at the bellhousing.

 

[bmaverick]

Good morning. New to forum. Looking for opinions, comments, ...

Intended use is brush-hogging, ditching, post-hole drilling, moving dirt/material around, and snow-blowing on my five acre property. Considering buying one of the following with FEL from Frederick's: YM2210D, YM2310D, YM2420D, YM2820D, YM3110D.

I love my YM2610 from Fredrick's. It does all of what you have mentioned and more. Get the YM2610D with a FEL. If Fredrick's is without a YM2610D, then I would pick either the popular YM2310D or the YM3110D.

Now, some of the YM machines come with OE power steering. Usually those are the models ending in 20. It's a bonus with a FEL.

The YM2210D, you would need ear plugs for that 2-cly diesel. And the 2T90 engine is very rare and not used in many machines. Looking 10 or more years out, how will parts be found? All the others in your list use the 3T84 variants, one of the most popular engines in the Yanmar lineup for the YM series.

The YM2610D has the same engine (3T80) as the John Deere 750, 850, 900HC, and Yanmar YM2500. So parts will be good to find way down the road too.

 

[bmaverick]

BTW, if you can't backhoe, then FRONTHOE.

Trenching with the Artillian Front-Hoe Bucket with a Yanmar painted GREEN.

 

[bmaverick]

CHEAPER than a back hoe, and just as functional.

 

[California]

some of the YM machines come with OE power steering. Usually those are the models ending in 20. It's a bonus with a FEL.

The YM2210D, you would need ear plugs for that 2-cyl diesel. And the 2T90 engine is very rare and not used in many machines. Looking 10 or more years out, how will parts be found?

It all depends on how much you want to pay. Power steering is a huge advantage and worth it if you can afford it. Powershift is an even greater advantage.

As for the 2210 - that 2T90 engine seems to be nothing more than an upgraded 2TR20 from the YM2000. Same bore, stroke, displacement, 26hp @ 2600 vs 24 hp @2400. Maybe they learned that tuning the injector pump for 2k more rpm didn't hurt anything. We've seen new owners here who discovered their VN-refurbished 2210 had a 2TR20 engine in place of what should be there. So I don't think a 2210 is destined to be an abandoned orphan, there will be plenty of YM2000 engines and parts indefinitely. 2TR20 variants appear in stationary generators, many many fishing boat engines, reefer trailer refrigeration units. Aaron (Hoye), any comments?

As for the earplugs, yes. Loud and crude. The two cylinder thumpers are cheaper than the more refined later models, for a reason. Just as competent but you need those earplugs.

And don't consider buying a tractor without loader. It's essential.

 

[bmaverick]

It all depends on how much you want to pay. Power steering is a huge advantage and worth it if you can afford it. Powershift is an even greater advantage.

As for the 2210 - that 2T90 engine seems to be nothing more than an upgraded 2TR20 from the YM2000. Same bore, stroke, displacement, 26hp @ 2600 vs 24 hp @2400. Maybe they learned that tuning the injector pump for 2k more rpm didn't hurt anything. We've seen new owners here who discovered their VN-refurbished 2210 had a 2TR20 engine in place of what should be there. So I don't think a 2210 is destined to be an abandoned orphan, there will be plenty of YM2000 engines and parts indefinitely. 2TR20 variants appear in stationary generators, many many fishing boat engines, reefer trailer refrigeration units. Aaron (Hoye), any comments?

As for the earplugs, yes. Loud and crude. The two cylinder thumpers are cheaper than the more refined later models, for a reason. Just as competent but you need those earplugs.

And don't consider buying a tractor without loader. It's essential.

The other difference of a 2-cly vs 3-cly is the loader up and down speed. My friend's JD650 with the 2T80 is slow. All the other 3-cly JD750, 850, 950 and 1050 do really well.

As for the 2TR20 engine, it's in a back-hoe and a TC2000 Harvester. Nothing else showed up on the Yanmar RePower list for land vehicles. It could be in boats.
There is nothing showing the 2TR20 is a 2T90 anywhere.

Per this website, the 2T90 and the 2TR20 do not share anything. But it seems they are direct swaps that will bolt up. hmmmm
Mismatched engine

They mention that the 2T90 has a longer stroke. There is a 2TR22 (YM2200) and 2TR27 (YM2700). more of that Yanmar mystery.

 

[bmaverick]

The other difference of a 2-cly vs 3-cly is the loader up and down speed. My friend's JD650 with the 2T80 is slow. All the other 3-cly JD750, 850, 950 and 1050 do really well.

As for the 2TR20 engine, it's in a back-hoe and a TC2000 Harvester. Nothing else showed up on the Yanmar RePower list for land vehicles. It could be in boats.
There is nothing showing the 2TR20 is a 2T90 anywhere.

Per this website, the 2T90 and the 2TR20 do not share anything. But it seems they are direct swaps that will bolt up. hmmmm
Mismatched engine

They mention that the 2T90 has a longer stroke. There is a 2TR22 (YM2200) and 2TR27 (YM2700). more of that Yanmar mystery.

Whew. Took a bunch of digging.

Here's the 2TR Series and the 2T90.

 

[California]

The other difference of a 2-cly vs 3-cly is the loader up and down speed. My friend's JD650 with the 2T80 is slow. All the other 3-cly JD750, 850, 950 and 1050 do really well.

As for the 2TR20 engine, it's in a back-hoe and a TC2000 Harvester. Nothing else showed up on the Yanmar RePower list for land vehicles. It could be in boats.
There is nothing showing the 2TR20 is a 2T90 anywhere.

Per this website, the 2T90 and the 2TR20 do not share anything. But it seems they are direct swaps that will bolt up. hmmmm
Mismatched engine

They mention that the 2T90 has a longer stroke. There is a 2TR22 (YM2200) and 2TR27 (YM2700). more of that Yanmar mystery.

That Mismatched thread is interesting. Looks like there are different 2TR20 versions and maybe the late one is what was beefed up to make 2T90. One post there says both engines take the same cylinder liner, another says bore is different. i thought I read displacement is identical but I'm not going to go look it up. It seems the only credible information is that either will bolt in, in place of the other. Wayne (LMTC). That's a name we haven't seen here for a decade or so.

2QM20 is the marine version of 2TR20. Hoye has some parts. I see they offer the same bare replacement cylinder head for YM2000, YM2210, and marine 2QM20. But different head gaskets!

My cousin heard the YM240 run and said that's the identical racket he heard all summer working on a salmon boat in Alaska. I've seen 2QM20 listed where later replacement boat engines are offered. Yanmar is primarily a marine engine company, tractors are a minor sideline, so I suspect there are a lot of those in small commercial fishing boats all over the world.

I bought a Thermostart module from the local ThermoKing (semitrailer reefer unit) dealer. He said the stationary version of 2TRT20 was widely used starting from the 70's and they were dead reliable for years in that application where they run unattended, up high on the front of a semitrailer.

 

[bmaverick]

2QM20 is the marine version of 2TR20. Hoye has some parts. I see they offer the same bare replacement cylinder head for YM2000, YM2210, and marine 2QM20. But different head gaskets!

WOW, that's the cleanest pixs I've seen on a Yanmar marine motor showing the back end of the engine. Yes, now it's understandable how the marine rear impeller shaft assy can be removed and a clutch used to fit this in a tractor. I had reservations about how well this could be done.

As for the thermostart, it seems to be a universal part for many of the Japan tractors like Mitsubishi-Satoh, Jima, Hinomoto, Isekie and others in that era. It's a really neat device.


Back to the OP's topic at hand, we sure wrangled out the YM2210 as being LOUD, parts are so-so to acquire for some items and not so good for others, takes a little longer to lift the FEL, Hp is much lower that would even limit a brush mower size & brand type, and limited lift capability on the 3PT arms.

For the OP's 5 acres, the YM2310D would be the minimum to consider. I have a post-hole auger. The ability to mount onto the 3PT with a taller tractor indeed helps a whole bunch. The front end weight of the tractor is a must, with added suitcase weights, will allow the 3PT to pull the auger out of the ground and not lift the front end up doing wheelies. So, the YM2210 would be out of the picture there too. Ideally, the YM2820D or YM3110D or YM2610D would work using the post-hole auger.

Here is how the auger rests before backing up and hooking up. No, I didn't come up with this scheme, but did make modifications so it's EZ to load and store.





As for ditch making, no need for a backhoe. I make 2 passes with the Cub Cadet rear tiller for the garden to bust up the soil. Then take the straight blade on the YM2610, offset the right 3PT arm that greatly tilts the blade, angle the blade via it's pin stop, then start cutting. The ditch turns out as nice as the highway dept does. And, if it's a simple French Drain, the tiller does all the work with passes, dirt removal and more passes. I've gone down 3FT with the tiller alone.

 

[CoyPatton]

CHEAPER than a back hoe, and just as functional.

Not intending to slam a stump bucket, but anyone that claims a stump bucket is as functional as a backhoe, has 1) never used a backhoe or 2) has been smoking too much of what he raises!

That said, I am not a fan of 3PH backhoes on compact and smaller tractors! Those build to attached directly to the tractor with supports tying into the FEL are better. However if you have a lot of digging work, consider a compact dedicated backhoe or a full-size one. You could offset some expense by not purchasing a FEL for the tractor and using the backhoe for projects need the FEL.

 

[fried1765]

Not intending to slam a stump bucket, but anyone that claims a stump bucket is as functional as a backhoe, has 1) never used a backhoe or 2) has been smoking too much of what he raises!

That said, I am not a fan of 3PH backhoes on compact and smaller tractors! Those build to attached directly to the tractor with supports tying into the FEL are better. However if you have a lot of digging work, consider a compact dedicated backhoe or a full-size one. You could offset some expense by not purchasing a FEL for the tractor and using the backhoe for projects need the FEL.

Agree........except, the part about not buying an FEL.

 

[bmaverick]

Agree........except, the part about not buying an FEL.

Or just simply rent a small excavator for the few times one ever needs to backhoe.

Yes, a FEL is ideal for many things!

 

[fried1765]

Or just simply rent a small excavator for the few times one ever needs to backhoe.

Yes, a FEL is ideal for many things!

To lift my well pump out of the pit?
I should rent an excavator?

To dig out a single stump next week?
I should rent an excavator?

To replace a failed yard hydrant?
I should rent an excavator?

 

[California]

Dunno if this clarifies anything. Original from Yanmar, and the box for the new one from the ThermoKing reefer dealer.

 

[California]

As for a FEL I think one is essential for any sort of rural life. Think of as a powered wheelbarrow, a lifting or unloading device, even a digging tool. Compare it to a shovel and wheelbarrow on a project and there's no comparison.

For a 2 wheel drive, drop it and use it as a toboggan to back out of mud that buried the front wheels. BTDT and I also had to do this once with the 4x4 YM186D.

And you can crab the bucket with the lip down to inch back up a slope that was too slippery to back up. BTDT, too.

It really extends the usefulness of a tractor. Don't spend your last dollar for a fancier tractor and expect to put on a loader later, price a tractor with FEL within your budget.

 

[bmaverick]

To lift my well pump out of the pit?
I should rent an excavator?

To dig out a single stump next week?
I should rent an excavator?

To replace a failed yard hydrant?
I should rent an excavator?

Only in reference to the OPs posting for doing ditches.

As for a well pump out of a pit or a yard hydrant, I would use my 3PT boom pole off the auger.