Welding D rings to rear frame member of 18 + 2 14,000 PJ equipment trailer

[BWSwede]

Hello,

I have run into something that I couldn't be the first to encounter so I am looking to see what others have done.

My equipment trailer has welded D rings and stake pocket D rings down each side. With one of the implement setups on my tractor I need to have 2 D rings welded to the rear frame member of the trailer to anchor the 12,500 pound tractor. The side frame of the trailer is is a very sturdy steel channel that accepts welded D rings easily. The rear frame member is a bent plate (or bent sheet metal depending on the definition) and doesn't appear thick enough to have D rings welded to it with any sort of serious load applied. Granted the rear frame does have 2 horizontal steel straps welded to the outside rear of it to support the ramps, but just looking at the thickness of the steel it seems that if I welded a D ring to the top of it and really torqued on it with my ratchet binders it seems like it would bend upward.

What have others done in this situation?

TIA,
Blane

 

[bdog]

A picture of what you are describing would help a lot. I can’t really picture what you talking about. I have had some situations where there wasn’t a good place to anchor whatever it was I was hauling and I had to put new anchor points on the machine.

 

[3Ts]

My trailer is only 7000# but have encountered a similar situation. Mine is 5" channel on the side with a light angle iron on the back. I also have ramp brackets and a 1" rod as a hinge pin for the ramps where the brackets are welded to the angle iron. I've used the 1" rod as an anchor point on occasion.

For your situation if the next frame member forward would be suitable you could weld something like this to it and have a recessed anchor point.
G7 3/8" Floor Tie Down Weld On

 

[fried1765]

Hello,

I have run into something that I couldn't be the first to encounter so I am looking to see what others have done.

My equipment trailer has welded D rings and stake pocket D rings down each side. With one of the implement setups on my tractor I need to have 2 D rings welded to the rear frame member of the trailer to anchor the 12,500 pound tractor. The side frame of the trailer is is a very sturdy steel channel that accepts welded D rings easily. The rear frame member is a bent plate (or bent sheet metal depending on the definition) and doesn't appear thick enough to have D rings welded to it with any sort of serious load applied. Granted the rear frame does have 2 horizontal steel straps welded to the outside rear of it to support the ramps, but just looking at the thickness of the steel it seems that if I welded a D ring to the top of it and really torqued on it with my ratchet binders it seems like it would bend upward.

What have others done in this situation?

TIA,
Blane

You are hauling a 12,500 lb tractor on a 14K rated trailer?

 

[BWSwede]

Thanks for the replies guys.

I have attached two photos showing the end piece of the trailer. You can see it is a piece of steel bent in two locations to wrap around the trailer's side frame channels. The thickness of the steel is 3/16".

I have looked at adding additional attachment points to the tractor but there doesn't seem to be a good location.

3Ts - I thought about attaching something to the steel bars that support the ramps but with the angle I am pulling I was worried about bending the bar in its weak direction. I could weld additional intermediate supports between the steel bar and the rear frame of the trailer but then my ramps won't be able to hook over the bar. The link you provided is interesting but unfortunately I don't have access to next forward steel cross member under the wood as the rear implement on the tractor is a butt plate for logs and it extends within a couple inches of the back of the trailer.

fried1765- I hope it is okay to haul this heavy of tractor and implement on the trailer. I weighed the loaded truck and trailer and got 13,900 pounds on the trailer axles which I think puts about 2000 pounds on the tongue. My hitch is rated at 2400 pounds. If I am missing something please let me know.

Thanks again,
Blane

 

[bdog]

Thanks for the pictures. Can you not put the d rings right above the round clearance lights? I would maybe place them on top of the rear member at at 45 degree angle pointing towards the center of the trailer. In this location they would be directly above the heavy channel iron frame.

 

[bdog]

Maybe something like this? The green outline is a plate you could weld in to make the things level with the rear frame member. Pink would be the D ring.

 

[fried1765]

Thanks for the replies guys.

I have attached two photos showing the end piece of the trailer. You can see it is a piece of steel bent in two locations to wrap around the trailer's side frame channels. The thickness of the steel is 3/16".

I have looked at adding additional attachment points to the tractor but there doesn't seem to be a good location.

3Ts - I thought about attaching something to the steel bars that support the ramps but with the angle I am pulling I was worried about bending the bar in its weak direction. I could weld additional intermediate supports between the steel bar and the rear frame of the trailer but then my ramps won't be able to hook over the bar. The link you provided is interesting but unfortunately I don't have access to next forward steel cross member under the wood as the rear implement on the tractor is a butt plate for logs and it extends within a couple inches of the back of the trailer.

fried1765- I hope it is okay to haul this heavy of tractor and implement on the trailer. I weighed the loaded truck and trailer and got 13,900 pounds on the trailer axles which I think puts about 2000 pounds on the tongue. My hitch is rated at 2400 pounds. If I am missing something please let me know.

Thanks again,
Blane

It would seem to be within limits, unless you add a heavier implement at some point.
If your tractor really did weigh 12,500 lbs. though, your 14K bare trailer would seem to weigh about 3,000 lbs, totaling 15,500 lbs.
What sort of truck are you using to tow with?

 

[4570Man]

It would seem to be within limits, unless you add a heavier implement at some point.
If your tractor really did weigh 12,500 lbs. though, your 14K bare trailer would seem to weigh about 3,000 lbs, totaling 15,500 lbs.
What sort of truck are you using to tow with?

I’d hate to put 12,500 on my 14k trailer but then again I have no need to. It should handle it without any damage. I’ve put 19,000 on my 10 ton pintle trailer but the pintle trailer is built for a beating. Most of the regular trailers aren’t. The 10 ton weighs 5500 pounds and the 14 is about 3,000 so there’s a lot more steel in the heavier trailer.

 

[BWSwede]

bdog - I have a D ring on the side rail about 9" from the corner from which I connect to now. If I can't get a D ring on the steel at the end of the trailer that might have to be my fall back position. The reason why I don't really want it there is that it would not be very far behind the attachment point on the tractor and as such would not be great at preventing the tractor from moving forward during a hard stop. I would rather have the D rings behind the tractor to better resist any forward movement.

fried1765 - The weight of the tractor with implements would not be any heavier than it is now. Often times it is about 1200 pounds lighter when I remove the forestry blade and install the finish mower. I pull the trailer with a 1 ton single cab, SRW, 4wd, diesel pickup. I have had the transmission rebuilt twice and finally now have a rock solid transmission and large cooler that seem to handle the 600 foot steep climb up to the neighborhood where I live just fine.

Thanks again for the great replies.

Blane

 

[Gem99ultra]

Not quite the same load as you're hauling, but with my 20' PJ I added removable D-rings to use in the rear stake pockets. I had bought regular D-rings to weld in place as you are wanting to do, but discovered there just wasn't anything solid enough on the rear flooring retainer.

I'm hoping that I never have to find out for sure if the stake pockets are strong enough!

 

[BWSwede]

I too am using stake pocket D rings in the rear most stake pockets but they just are not far enough rearward. I was hoping to hear that you had come up with a solution to welding rings to the rear piece of steel on the trailer.

I use a second set of tie-downs when hauling my tractor. If anything happens to the primary chain tie-downs I also install a set of nylon straps that has two straps from the frame straight forward to the front of the trailer and two straps from the frame to the rear of the trailer. The idea with the straps is just to keep the tractor from rolling forward or rearward long enough for me to notice the primary set of chains have been compromised.

Thanks for the reply.

Blane

 

[3Ts]

I too am using stake pocket D rings in the rear most stake pockets but they just are not far enough rearward. I was hoping to hear that you had come up with a solution to welding rings to the rear piece of steel on the trailer.

My trailer as delivered only had 1 stake pocket behind the rear axle so I cut it off and moved it and added another stake pocket so I now have one as far to the rear as it will go. For that matter a flat bar with a hole in it welded to the frame at the rear will probably be the best that can be done.

 

[3Ts]

I can't upload a picture, but in your 2nd picture, I'm assuming the flat bar at the back is for your ramps. If they are supported only there, it should be strong enough to use as a tie down point and you should be able to weld the D-ring to that.

 

[ovrszd]

View attachment 668038

Maybe something like this? The green outline is a plate you could weld in to make the things level with the rear frame member. Pink would be the D ring.

Nice!!! I really like that solution!!!

 

[Reb954]

Is there a reason you can't run your chain as shown in the picture? Just hook under the main frame, behind the bracket for your stiff leg and on up to the tractor? There isn't much difference between doing that and welding a D-ring on top of the frame.

 

[BWSwede]

Thanks for all the ideas guys.

"I can't upload a picture, but in your 2nd picture, I'm assuming the flat bar at the back is for your ramps. If they are supported only there, it should be strong enough to use as a tie down point and you should be able to weld the D-ring to that."

This idea, or a form of this idea, has crossed my mind. I am wondering in lieu of welding a D ring to the ramp support bar that I might be able to find a flat hook with a piece of chain attached to it that I can attach my load binder to. If it looks like that load could twist the end metal I could weld a strut from it across the top of the wood decking to the heavy piece of steel where the dovetail connects to the flat part of the trailer. That would not only help prevent rotation of the steel but would also help from pulling the metal at the rear of the trailer forward.


"Is there a reason you can't run your chain as shown in the picture? Just hook under the main frame, behind the bracket for your stiff leg and on up to the tractor? There isn't much difference between doing that and welding a D-ring on top of the frame."

I would like the attachment point to be further behind the tractor. You wouldn't have known this unless I had posted a picture, but the rear of the tractor is very close to the rear of the trailer. I have to do this to put the weight over the trailer axles and to keep the tongue weight under 2400 pounds.



As a side note, I was concerned about the weight on the axles so when I arrived at my destination after a 75 minute (most highway) drive I checked the temperature of the hubs they were only 98 degrees plus or minus a couple (70 degree day).

Thanks again,
Blane

 

[dstig1]

Back the tractor on. It will move your balance point forward, in many cases. This may reposition it for better access to points of securing it.

 

[4570Man]

Back the tractor on. It will move your balance point forward, in many cases. This may reposition it for better access to points of securing it.

Unless your trailer is like 30 feet it’s probably too short to not load it too tongue heavy.

 

[dstig1]

Unless your trailer is like 30 feet it’s probably too short to not load it too tongue heavy.

Mine was 16', which is too short for a Gran L with loader, but it worked well for me for the time I had it. I think 22-24' would be an optimal length for tractors my size.