Importing and modifying a new mini excavator from China

[dfkrug]

It has been a while since I posted a Big Project on TBN, so here we go again.

I have been on a quest for a mini-X, so I imported a new one from China. It has been
complicated and took a lot of time and energy, but it is here and working. Over the next week
or so, I will post about my search, the importation process, and the modifications I
made to get a decent usable machine.

I have 19 acres in the Santa Cruz Mountains of coastal California, and they are steep,
rugged, and some of my installations are difficult to access. So...I have a lot of
trails, some built with my trusty Kioti TLB, and some built with a pick and shovel. The
latter traverse 100% (45-degree) slopes to provide access to my septic system, pipelines,
and water tank.

Some of these hand-built trails are pretty steep and narrow, and tho driveable with my
4x4 ATV, they are dangerous, especially on the descent. My goal it to extend my trail network,
and to make the existing ones less steep, and wider (safer). Ideally, 36% grade or less, and
50" wide usable width. Also more switchbacks and landings.

To reduce my manual labor, a tracked machine no more than 3-feet wide is what I want. I
tried a non-tracked machine in the 90s (CADDigger 728), and that was too slow and difficult.

The archetype I covet is a machine like the Kubota K008 or Cat 300.9 one-ton units. I even went so
far as getting a quotation from my local Kubota dealer, and I was looking at about $23K out
the door. (Kubota would prob meet the lower price of the Cat.)

 

[dfkrug]

So last winter I started looking for a 1-ton class mini-X. I prowled the local Craigslist, the big monthly
auction in Sacramento, Machinery Trader Online, and eBay. No way was I gonna pay $23K.

The best I could find were in the $9-10K range for units with 2500-3500 hours, far from here. The
local auction has its usual crazy bidders driving prices up to insane levels. I did see a number of
candidates around the US that were made by Kobelco, IHI, Bobcat, Kubota, and Takeuchi.

By FEB, the best I could find is a couple of high-hour beaters, one near Seattle, and one near Dallas.
I started my "due-diligence" on the one in WA first: getting VIN, contacting maker to determine history,
and looking for a local mechanic to do an inspection. The salesman was helpful. Then, with no
warning, it was sold to someone locally. Glad I did not buy a plane ticket!

What this means is if you want something listed on the internet non-locally, you need a seller who will give you
time to do your inspections. That points to eBay as a better seller source, as the seller usually
expects to allow time for inspections, or is using an auction format that has a set ending date. I have
bought or sold 2 cars, one tractor, and my CADDigger on eBay, without problems. I am >20y eBay user.

Eventually, I gave up and decided to get a machine from China, new. What sealed it for me is that if I use
Alibaba, then they provide escrow ("Trade Assurance"), and free inspection at the vendor's place of
business. I asked around and talked to several people who have used Alibaba successfully.

I am not only an Alibaba noob, I am also a container-shipping noob. I have shipped domestically using
FTL and LTL (full- and less-than-truckload), but I have never handled international container-shipping, and
something else I have just discovered: LCL shipping. Less-than-container load shipping is pretty much like
LTL shipping, with some kind of consolidator combining your load with that of others.

I had to hire a "customs broker", as well as pay a "freight-forwarder", and deal with a "container freight station".
I tracked my container ship as it stopped at various ports on its way to Port of Oakland.

The Alibaba contractor-inspector sent me the attached report, with photos. After 10 weeks, I had my
shipment.

 

[downsizingnow48]

Interesting look forward to learning more. This morning I did a search for "mini excavator" on Alibaba, there were >50k entries. How did you decide which one to buy?

 

[Dadnatron]

I imported a ditch bank flail mower from China. It was worth it. The hardest part was understanding the shipping. Alibaba has a great system for 'Trade Assurance' and I was very pleasantly surprised.

I've looked at importing Rubber pavers for our horse barns, given that they are 30% of the local cost, and I know that my local guys get them from a China Importer.

Alibaba is a pretty good thing. Sometimes its hard to navigate because things are posted several times from the same manufacturer. But there are some pretty good options and safeguards via Alibaba and if you use Trade Assurance, I suspect you can get a pretty good deal.

The trick is you MUST BE ABSOLUTELY SPECIFIC on ALL important parts etc. Trade Assurance only covers what is in the exact contract... not on what you 'thought' you were getting. That means, electrical, paint, etc etc etc. So if you use it, just be sure that everything is in the contract exactly how you want it, including any 'options' which you might think are standard. It usually isn't an issue, but if you have a problem, it must be spelled out in the contract to get your money back.

 

[BLSXJ]

interesting.... I appreciate the details you've included.

 

[Industrial Toys]

One contractor around here had a walking type excavator for working in virtually any terrain. It looked like some kind of Bug.

I buy small stuff from China all the time, via E-Bay. It is absolutely and completely impossible to ask them the simplest of questions. I'm surprised buying equipment is that easy.

A few times I have made Alibaba inquiries and never heard a thing back.

 

[majorwager]

DFK Rug,

I am really interested in the mechanics involved w/ importing this machine. For example, did you work through a US Based dealer? Did you retain your own Customs broker? Did You have the requirement to PREPAY for the machine before shipment? What were the hassles in clearing US Customs? Did you arrange your own trucking from the bonded warehouse? I imported a piece of AG equipment from Italy last year and it was a hair pulling experience. I felt like I was on an island w/ no real control of the whole process. Lots and Lots of phone calls trying to assess where things stood. Probably would NOT do it again BUT now I am much wiser.


Please share some import experiences if you are willing? Very difficult for an individual to embark upon this process w/o an overseas agent, on the ground to assist.

 

[dfkrug]

How did you decide which one to buy?

I had been doing nationwide searches, and come upon the unit like the one I ended up buying (see photo).
It was in the PNW somewhere, on Craigslist, IIRC. Maybe eBay. I have seen a couple on eBay.

So, I did a search to find out more info, and saw that the makers were mostly using Alibaba. (Alibaba has
solicited me for at least 15 years with product offers. Some Chinese factories have solicited me
directly going back 20y. Usually, they are asking me to place a quantity order for some Ag or
construction equipment that they would make to order and ship by container.)

So, my search on Alibaba resulted in many hits for essentially the same machine. There a dozens
or more factories making this machine. I sent out RFQs to just 3 factories, so I did not get overwhelmed.
All were nearly the same in price, but the accessories and attachments varied a lot in price. Clearly,
the different factories started with the same design, but no one will tell me where it originated. There
are tiny differences, but very little technical info. There are no parts manuals, service manuals, or even
a unit-specific operator/maintenance manual.

The import process was as clear as mud, and the shipper (who handled the truck-ship to the Port of
Qingdao, and the freight-forwarding in China) was not very helpful. I hired my own US-based customs
broker, but I could have used the seller's broker, which has offices in LA. I did not know that I also
had to pay the seller's forwarder, too. There is a lot of paperwork involved, and none of the parties involved
were very helpful. I am near a Port, so I was able to haul my 2200# crate home in my trailer, from a
warehouse near the Port. That saved a bunch.

The unit I bought is from Shandong Landworld Machinery (Xiniu), and my cost was about $5100, which included
a ripper tooth, grapple, rake, 2 buckets, a toolkit, and some spares. Shipping to Port of Oakland ($190) was
included. BUT: I imported the unit without an engine. More on that later. Xiniu tells me they have shipped 5000
of these units, mostly to Europe, Latin America, Oz.

I figure that all my fees will amount to about $800 over what I paid the seller. Only $30 of that is a US tariff. The
wonderful State of CA will come after me later for the "use" tax, and that will be 9-9.5%, another 500 clams.

The seller did not get their money until I approved the shipment, via Alibaba. Communications with China was
all via Alibaba email (scores of those!). My salesperson was helpful, but not technical, and of limited English skills.
My Mandarin is non-existent.

 

[dfkrug]

At the risk of getting too deep in the weeds, here is a list of import procedures from my Customs Broker:


To assist you to clear the U.S. Customs in a timely manner, I have attached herein the following documents.

+ List of fees
+ Service Agreement
+ Power of Attorney (POA)
+ ISF Form

Please read the documents carefully and follow the step by step instructions to start the process.

Step 1: Fill out the Service Agreement and Power of Attorney. Sign each document.
If you do not know how to fill out Power of Attorney, here is a sample Power of Attorney. Please click the link to download.

Step 2: Copy your SSN card.
The U.S. Customs require customs broker to verify importer's identity. If you have lost your SSN card, you may go to the nearest Social Security Office to request a letter proving your SSN.

Step 3: Scan and email the above documents to us as soon as possible. Do NOT forget to sign the documents.

Step 4: Have your exporter complete the ISF form and send to us 72 hours before the shipment leaves from the foreign country.
US Customs begins enforcing the penalty for any late/no/incorrect ISF filing. To avoid the penalty, please get the ISF form and the above documents to us no later than 72 hours before the shipment leaves from the foreign country to allow us sufficient time to file ISF for you.


Step 5: Email us the following documents as soon as they become available:
+ Commercial Invoice. (This is the Invoice provided by your exporter.)
+ Bill Of Lading(or BOL). (If you don’t have the BOL now, you may ask for it from your shipper after the shipment is shipped.)
+ Arrival Notice (You should provide this notice to us 3-5 days before the shipment arrives in the US).
For your reference, I list the entire process to help you to understand what to look forward:
1) The importer signs the POA and other initial documents with the customs broker.
2) The customs broker purchases the customs bond on behalf of the importer.
3) The importer instructs the exporter to ship the product. And the exporter fill out and return the ISF form to the customs broker before the departure of the shipment
4) The importer collects the Bill of lading , Commercial Invoice and packing list from the exporter and passes to the customs broker as soon as available.
5) The product arrives at the U.S. port. The importer receives the Arrival Notice from the freight forwarder. The importer should immediately pass it to the customs broker.
6) The customs broker files the entry with the U.S. Customs.
7) The U.S. Customs may inspects the product. The U.S. Customs releases the entry. The customs broker pays the duty on behalf of the importer.
8) The importer pays the carrier (or the freight forwarder or their agent) any additional fees for local processing in the warehouse and other processing.
9) The importer arranges the pick-up and delivery from a warehouse.

For your convenience, we also provide service to help you find a local carrier and coordinate the pick-up and delivery. Please let us know if you need it.

Again please follow the above steps to provide us the required documents. Your timely response will ensure the entire process goes through in a timely manner.

 

[majorwager]

DFKRUG,

Brings back nightmares. I never did find out what else shared the shipping container. The firm that manufactured my equipment got my shipment completed, then went on vacation for a full month. The whole company.

Well it did end in a favorable result, but I had to rely on a ground trucking firm because I am 300 miles from the port. No one thought to tell the forwarder that a power tailgate was not necessary. Still wanted me to pay for this service in the event I was unable to unload the crate, that took two days to resolve. I had to rely on the trucking firm to instruct their driver to inspect the crate for damage before loading at the bonded warehouse. Really need good people skills for this process to work. Did not like sharing my SS#, but it is like this: No tickie, No washie. No #, No product.

It is amazing that someone actually knows what container houses your merchandise and where on the vast ocean the boat/ship is located at any point in time.

It was an experience not soon to be repeated but w/ a positive outcome, one forgets about all involved, UNTIL a member posts his experience w/ importing equipment from china!!


Still you paid the money as did I, you "approved" the shipment, but really, we have NO control over what they actually load in that container, unless you personally see it, it is all blind faith.

EDIT: Not sure what Dadnatron is referencing, I had 3 days to remove freight from storage in bonded warehouse, or huge storage fees applied.

 

[Dadnatron]

Don't be too concerned about 'Ports'. You don't have to be near a coast to get your purchase. In fact, I had mine sent to Cincinnati and could have had it in Louisville, had I recognized it. Mine was offloaded in New Jersey and trucked overland to the 'port' in Cincinnati, which was just a warehouse out in the suburbs.

Ports of Entry USA

There are ports all over the place, and it is likely that there is one close or at least 'closer' to you than you think. It will obviously cost more to haul it to Colorado (which has 4 POEs) but it isn't as crazy as you'd think.

If I do it again, I will set up with a US based importer who does this sort of thing and let them deal with everything. Make your purchase from the company FOB, or 'Free on Board' which basically means they are responsible for everything up to and including getting it loaded on the ship. Then, you, or your company, is responsible for getting it to you. If you do it BEFORE you actually are in the process of the shipping, it shouldn't be too difficult. Just be prepared for a hiccup and don't fret. There are many reputable importers who know what is required and have the connections to insure you get your shipment. And STILL, it is likely to be less expensive.

But, remember, Alibaba begins counting down the 14day Escrow period from when it hits the port/warehouse NOT from whenever you get your act together and go get it. IF it sits in the warehouse for 15days before you see that they sent you problem... well.... then its YOUR problem. Nothing that cannot be addressed with some planning and a little flexibility. But just recognize this is the case.

 

[dfkrug]

EDIT: Not sure what Dadnatron is referencing, I had 3 days to remove freight from
storage in bonded warehouse, or huge storage fees applied.

I was able to watch real-time online the status of everything in my container (13 items), and when they got their
release. I could see a lot of info on each shipment in there, surprisingly.

My CFS (Container Freight Station) gave me 5 days "free" in which to pick up my load, or have it shipped.
Storage fees beyond that were going to be something like $25/day.

Airports are often "ports of entry" as well as seaports, but container ships only use seaports. If you
are far from a seaport, the truck shipping can be spendy. Note that if you import via full container, it can
be shipped directly from the Port to your final destination, and they give you something like 3 hours to
unload before returning with the empty container.

I have spoken with 2 people who have had to pay for X-ray inspections of their container, prob brought on
by the Port spot-checking for contraband. This amounted to several hundred dollars that was not expected.
Thankfully, I did not have this "service".

These photos are at the CFS near the Port, showing the loading of my 2200# crate. Both ends had been
opened, I guess by some inspector(s). Maybe US customs?

 

[pmsmechanic]

Interesting thread. I'm curious as to why no engine and what you installed for an engine.

 

[ArlyA]

This importing of machines thread has been very interesting. I've looked at items sold on Alibaba but never purchased any. Thanks to all who have added to it.

 

[Dadnatron]

Interesting thread. I'm curious as to why no engine and what you installed for an engine.

I know that the complexity of importing an engine greatly expounds the difficulty in the importation process. A whole new BIG layer of regulations, etc must be met. Basically, the engine must be proven to meet US import standards, and given you are a 'one off' importer, this is immeasurably more difficult, than to be importing 1000 engines, all of the same make/model.

Actually, there are other 'levels' of importing equipment, that off hand, I don't remember. But different regulations exist for 'farm' equipment vs 'commercial' vs 'personal' etc. I don't remember the reason, but I do remember I had to 'prove' my flail was for farm use, although I don't remember that clearly. I know I had a discussion with the importer on the subject.

I suspect this was put into the OP's calculations.

 

[ruffdog]

Interesting....your crate seems to survive better than most small China shipments. Their cardboard is not near as strong as the stuff in the US.

 

[pmsmechanic]

I know that the complexity of importing an engine greatly expounds the difficulty in the importation process. A whole new BIG layer of regulations, etc must be met. Basically, the engine must be proven to meet US import standards, and given you are a 'one off' importer, this is immeasurably more difficult, than to be importing 1000 engines, all of the same make/model.

Actually, there are other 'levels' of importing equipment, that off hand, I don't remember. But different regulations exist for 'farm' equipment vs 'commercial' vs 'personal' etc. I don't remember the reason, but I do remember I had to 'prove' my flail was for farm use, although I don't remember that clearly. I know I had a discussion with the importer on the subject.

I suspect this was put into the OP's calculations.

At one time I looked into importing a 7 hp Listeroid diesel from India. Basically I could bring in 5 engines before I had to worry about emissions. I didn't pursue it too far as I didn't know who I could trust. I live in Canada and the regs are different here.

 

[dfkrug]

Interesting....your crate seems to survive better than most small China shipments.
Their cardboard is not near as strong as the stuff in the US.

The crate that my XN08 was shipped in was the most substantial crate I have ever received. It featured
1.5x3.5" U-channel on the bottom and rectangular tubing for the skeleton, all welded. That was covered by
1/4" plywood on all 6 sides, screwed on with self-drilling screws that had plastic and steel washers. Wow. Even
Kubota tractor crates (got them free from the dealer), and Kioti crates (2 of my tractors I bought crated) were not
this substantial. I reuse the channel steel for backhoe subframes. Tubing is far more desirable for reuse (IMO), vs. the
steel angle-iron that you usually get on tractor crates.

I had to cut off the tubing frame from around mini-X, since I could not drive it out of the crate. No engine. That is the
biggest part of this story. Good thing I had a plasma cutter, as this would sure have been tedious with a different
tool.

Next: the engine debacle.

 

[dfkrug]

So this whole engine project started out when I decided to pull the trigger, and import one of these
1-ton units. I fully planned to get it turn-key, with the original diesel engine and some
accessories and spares. I was going to explore getting a whole spare engine as part of the
shipment.

At about the same time, I heard of and contacted a guy in WV trying to make the same
deal and import one unit for himself, and possibly other units to sell. He had just run up against
a brick wall with his customs broker: how to fill out his EPA Form 3520 (attached)?

There is no EPA exemption for small diesel engines in the doc. When I contacted the seller, I
was told that they have successfully exported the XN08 to the US numerous times. I
contacted some of them, and it was true: they did not have to fill out any EPA form or
undergo EPA inspection. Not to give up easily, I even contacted the EPA, and heard back
(5 days later), that I could not import the non-EPA certified engine. I suspect that
EPA inspectors are upping their diligence in recent months.

I also talked to a buyer in OR who had imported one, sans engine, and installed his own.
Another buyer in UT had purchased one with diesel engine only 6 months prior, and it
had failed. He converted to gas just after I did, rather than repair his ChangChai.

This is a ChangChai 499cc 1-cyl diesel engine of about 10hp, commonly used in small
equipment. There is another maker, Koop, which makes a similar engine in these units.
My research finds only 2 EPA-certified 1-cyl diesels sold in the US (Hatz and Kohler), which
run about $3000. For reference, Cat and Kubota both use THREE-cyl 10hp 700cc diesels in their
1-ton units. One is a Yanmar; one is a Kubota, both are EPA- and CARB-approved.

There was/is no way around the EPA declaration and inspection for me. I also need CARB
certification for purchase in CA, but I know of no way that the state enforces compliance. It
seems to be up to the seller to not sell into CA unless there is a CARB sticker.

So, I made a deal to buy one unit without an engine, with the plan to install a CARB/EPA
gasoline engine. I knew I would need to make some serious changes to make it work, but
I like that kind of project anyway. Concerns about repairing a ChangChai engine would also
vanish. (Parts ARE available, but not widely, and not cheaply.)

Since I had already paid my money, I substituted a spare 8-spool stack valve for the deleted
engine. Now, I have some repair parts for the valve, too. There are all sorts of brands
of Chinese hydraulic components, and little data on them. That concerns me more than a
Chinese engine.

Next: my new engine

 

[ruffdog]

Only a 10hp? The unit must be pretty small. I would be thinking a Kubota or Yanmar in the 23hp range. Keep us updated with pics....interesting.