Third Function Needed to Run Grapple

[rmallaire]

Hello,

I'm new to the forum.

I recently purchased a grapple bucket for my 1998 John Deere 970. I do not have rear remotes on tractor; the only hydraulic outputs I have are running the lift and curl functions on my loader.

To add a third function, I have considered a Fasse valve multiplier. Here is a link to the Fasse valve I am looking at: Fasse John Deere Remote Master Hydraulic Doubler Valve Kit 7-1594

Has anyone had experience with these? Due to the price of nearly $500, I do not want to have regrets of finding out there was a better brand or solution.

Thank you,

Randy

 

[boggen]

TractorData.com John Deere 97 tractor information

Type: open center
Capacity: 5.5 gal [20.8 L]
Pressure: 2250 psi [155.1 bar]
Pump flow: 8.7 gpm [32.9 lpm]

shows you have open center hydrualics for tractor (do not get anything with "closed center" valve package)

check out Surplus Center to see some different options out there.

you might be able to add another valve to the stack if you have 2 levers to operate the FEL already

you might be able to get a solenoid valve (on/off) only, that connects into hydraulic lines, and then a little switch / (dip switch or button) that you flip back forth to use grapple

you could get a joystick with a 3rd function button on it. and replace your entire joystick and/or 2 levers you currently have. this more likely has a solenoid valve as well

you might be able to rig something up with some sort of custom bracket to include another valve directly by what ever you use to operate FEL currently.

============
you most likely will need a set of "hydraulic gauges" so you can properly set "pressure relief valve" on what ever new valve or valves you get.

there are different "ends" for hydraulic fittings. make sure you pay attention to this. more so quick connect ends. more than likely you may need to make a trip or 2 to local tractor dealer (does not matter who), in order for them to put ends on the hydraulic hoses.

toss a nozzle onto a garden hose and hook it up to a faucet. (to make garden hose harder to bend) might be a way to route hoses and find out how much length of hoses you need. there is a min bend radius for most hoses, bending past this point result in hose kinking.

stay with what ever size hose of what your FEL is using, no need to go bigger for the inside diameter. ((inside diameter, not outside diameter))

 

[kennyd]

The main issue I have with those "doubler" kits is the weight of the valve block and hoses hanging on the couplers, plus the four couplers on your machine are probably close together-you may have trouble connecting the lines for the lift/lower circuit.

I'd suggest plumbing in a diverter (it works the same way as the doubler you linked but it's more hard-plumbed), you can get them from the Surplus Center or we sell a kit with the electrics too.

A search of the term "diverter" here on TBN will turn up hours of reading.

 

[Todd727]

Does JD offer a third valve kit for your tractor?

 

[FatTire]

One advantage of a diverter valve over a true 3rd function for a grapple is that the diverter will allow you to feather the flow. With 3rd function it is on (full) or closed. Again, there are plenty of threads discussing this on TBN.

 

[rmallaire]

Hello,

Thanks for all of the input.

Kennyd, if I had a bracket fabricated to support the weight of the bracket, do you think the diverter valve would perform well?

Boggen, thank you for the options. I will check surplus center. An advantage I see of having the third function, is that I could still use the lift and curl functions on the loader. I would not want to eliminate the opinion of running lift and curl while I would want to operate the grapple function.

Todd727, I will call the dealer and ask about if the third function kit available.

 

[rmallaire]

Attached are some photos of the grapple bucket and the hoses on my tractor where the multiplier would connect

 

[kennyd]

Attached are some photos of the grapple bucket and the hoses on my tractor where the multiplier would connect

Wow how heavy is the grapple? That looks to big for your 970, and I assume you have the 440 loader? That's only spec'd at lifting about 900lbs.

 

[kennyd]

Hello,

Thanks for all of the input.

Kennyd, if I had a bracket fabricated to support the weight of the bracket, do you think the diverter valve would perform well?

Boggen, thank you for the options. I will check surplus center. An advantage I see of having the third function, is that I could still use the lift and curl functions on the loader. I would not want to eliminate the opinion of running lift and curl while I would want to operate the grapple function.

Todd727, I will call the dealer and ask about if the third function kit available.

You tractor was last made in 1998, so I doubt JD will still have anything for your machine-pretty sure they never offered anything but a Power Beyond kit anyway.

Sure, you can fab a bracket to support it, but you can also buy just the valve from us or the Surplus Center and remote mount in a safer place. Either way you will still need hoses and fittings to get everything working. I was just trying to give you some options that may fit your needs better and save you some money. Did you search like I mentioned above?

Adding a true 3rd function is not as easy on this machine as it is on some, you have to remove some hardlines and replace the banjo bolts and replace with ORB fittings to tap into the main hydraulic flow.

 

[rmallaire]

Kennyd,

Hi, thank you for the reply. The grapple is 66" wide, I am unsure of the weight but I would guess about 400 Lbs. Mounting the valve in a spot other than where the Fasse kit would be mounted does seem safer. Which valve would you recommend; and if possible, can you send me a link from your website or Surplus Center? Getting hoses and fittings isn't an issue. If I go the route of buying the valve separate and piecing everything together, I will also need to find a switch, preferably one that can mount on the side of my loader lever. Thank you, Randy

 

[kennyd]

Randy, find a way to weigh that thing-it looks well more than 400lbs. Can you easily lift it now with your loader?

Surplus Center has two diverters that would work:

12/24 VOLT DC 13.2 GPM SAE 8 SOLENOID OPERATED DOUBLE SELECTOR VALVE | Featured Items | www.surpluscenter.com

SAE 8 6 GPM DOUBLE SELECTOR VALVE 12 VDC P15544-2 | Selector Valves | Hydraulic Valves | Hydraulics | www.surpluscenter.com

Ours, it includes the switch and wiring harness:

Ken's Bolt on Grab Hooks <<Hydraulics>>


Again I'll suggest you do some searching here on GTT using the term "diverter". Hours of great reading.

 

[rmallaire]

I unloaded the grapple off my trailer with the loader and it lifted it fine. My loader is a 440.

If I installed one of the valves you linked, would it operate the same as the Fasse? Meaning, would I be able to operate lift, curl and grapple simultaneously?
I appreciate your help, as my hydraulic knowledge is limited.

 

[kennyd]

I'd still try to weight it...

The Fasse valve you linked, just like the three products I linked are all "diverters", they "divert" one function to another so there is no simultaneous operation of the two different functions. It's either dump/curl OR open/close on the grapple.

 

[EverythingAttachments]

Wow how heavy is the grapple? That looks to big for your 970, and I assume you have the 440 loader? That's only spec'd at lifting about 900lbs.

My findings indicate it's 600 pounds.
Travis

 

[kennyd]

My findings indicate it's 600 pounds.
Travis

Thanks Travis, adding a grapple that's 2/3rds the lift capacity would be a mistake IMHO.

 

[LD1]

I agree the grapple is too big.

The 970 is a smaller and lighter machine that needs a smaller and lighter grapple.

 

[rmallaire]

Thanks for the recommendation. Considering I already own the grapple, I would like to see it performs, if poorly I can sell it and buy a lighter one.

Is there a solution for adding a third function and being able to have all three functions at the same time: lift, curl, and grapple?

 

[kennyd]

Is there a solution for adding a third function and being able to have all three functions at the same time: lift, curl, and grapple?

Yes, what I mentioned above-called a true 3rd function valve, that involves tapping into the tractors main hydraulic system.

 

[Todd727]

One advantage of a diverter valve over a true 3rd function for a grapple is that the diverter will allow you to feather the flow. With 3rd function it is on (full) or closed. Again, there are plenty of threads discussing this on TBN.

I'm not sure why you say that. Every tractor I've ever owned, I could feather the remotes. I've added the third remote on two of them and they operate exactly like the original remotes. The levers are progressive until you get to the detent, at which time it is full on until it kicks out. Admittedly, all of my tractors have been full size ag equipment.

 

[kennyd]

I'm not sure why you say that. Every tractor I've ever owned, I could feather the remotes. I've added the third remote on two of them and they operate exactly like the original remotes. The levers are progressive until you get to the detent, at which time it is full on until it kicks out. Admittedly, all of my tractors have been full size ag equipment.

He is/was referring to the solenoid valves most often used for 3rd functions on loaders, they are either ON or OFF. They are plumbed into the main hydraulic lines (Power Beyond) and send the entire flow to the new function when the switch is activated.