$1000 Coolant Change Part 2 The Answer

applepicker · Feb 27, 2014

A real possibility. Silicate drop out sounds exactly what happened to my coolant. What causes the drop out:

"These silicates under certain circumstances (coolant with a depleted additive package (worn out coolant), hard water (water mixed with coolant), high coolant temperature, over concentration of coolant (not enough water)) have a tendency towards ?polymerization?, which can cause silicate ?dropout? or ?precipitation? which can lead to gelation of the silicates in the coolant."

See this site for full info: Radiator Antifreeze Plugging

I am not sure why this happened in my case. The example from the above site describes my situation exactly. This is kind of disconcerting. I not sure what to do next coolant change? Different brand?

Applepicker

kuboman · Feb 27, 2014

applepicker said:
A real possibility. Silicate drop out sounds exactly what happened to my coolant. What causes the drop out:

"These silicates under certain circumstances (coolant with a depleted additive package (worn out coolant), hard water (water mixed with coolant), high coolant temperature, over concentration of coolant (not enough water)) have a tendency towards ?polymerization?, which can cause silicate ?dropout? or ?precipitation? which can lead to gelation of the silicates in the coolant."

See this site for full info: Radiator Antifreeze Plugging

I am not sure why this happened in my case. The example from the above site describes my situation exactly. This is kind of disconcerting. I not sure what to do next coolant change? Different brand?

Applepicker

The problem with that is the antifreeze you should be using is low silicate.

sandyc · Feb 28, 2014

IMHO a lab test of what is going on is needed. In chemistry, not everything could be what it seems. Verify what is happening that way you can fix the problem not the symptom. The separation was caused by a blown head gasket, just saying, and that needs to be fixed or the new A/F will separate just like the old.

thatguy · Feb 28, 2014

Have you contacted the anti-freeze mfg to see what they say? Id be curious if they would step up and help you out

b

applepicker · Feb 28, 2014

thatguy said:
Have you contacted the anti-freeze mfg to see what they say? Id be curious if they would step up and help you out

Peak(Old World Industries)makes this stuff(FLEET CHARGE), I have been emailing them back and forth and they have been most cooperative. They will analyze a sample I sent them yesterday for free. It seems they are willing to work on a cause and solution. I am dealing with their technical branch.

Applepicker

thatguy · Mar 1, 2014

applepicker said:
thatguy said:

Have you contacted the anti-freeze mfg to see what they say? Id be curious if they would step up and help you out

Peak(Old World Industries)makes this stuff(FLEET CHARGE), I have been emailing them back and forth and they have been most cooperative. They will analyze a sample I sent them yesterday for free. It seems they are willing to work on a cause and solution. I am dealing with their technical branch.

Applepicker

Click to expand...

I hope they help you out.. I am not a chemist/scientist - but its scary that this happened to you.. I cant comprehend that it happened - I could see it if you mixed brands of anti-freeze by mistake but not using the same brand..

good luck
Brian

applepicker · Mar 1, 2014

thatguy said:
applepicker said:

I hope they help you out.. I am not a chemist/scientist - but its scary that this happened to you.. I cant comprehend that it happened - I could see it if you mixed brands of anti-freeze by mistake but not using the same brand..

good luck
Brian

Click to expand...

The technical services reply to my silicate drop out theory was:

"Silicate drop out is a legitimate concern with fully formulated coolants.
The appearance of the drop out would be more of a slimy consistency.
Typically one gallon, even if all of the silicate dropped out shouldn't be
enough to clog a radiator. I would imagine that it would take several years
with several gallons of old fluid in it for that to occur"

My old coolant and system showed no deposites after 2 years in the Kubota. The Fleet Charge I put in should no visible contamination. After 5 hours run the whole system is coated and the radiator completely clogged.

The sample arrived at their corporate headquarters to day. I will convey results to forum.

Applepicker

CalG · Mar 6, 2014

Bump to follow to conclusion.

Silicate drop out? Why??

applepicker · Mar 6, 2014

CalG said:
Bump to follow to conclusion.

Silicate drop out? Why??

I am still waiting for lab. results. This is what the technical people told me when I brought the subject up:

"Silicate drop out is a legitimate concern with fully formulated coolants.
The appearance of the drop out would be more of a slimy consistency.
Typically one gallon, even if all of the silicate dropped out shouldn't be
enough to clog a radiator. I would imagine that it would take several years
with several gallons of old fluid in it for that to occur. Of course that
would also be visible in other parts of the cooling system as well."

I used their coolant from 12/11 to 12/13 without any issue and then installed new coolant on 12/19/14. They say their coolant has a shelf life of a least 2 years. I did not notice any contamination in the old coolant.

Tollster · Mar 6, 2014

Honestly, I have had over 20 vehicles, and combined... more than 40 liquid cooled engines of some sort and never heard nor experienced this. In the past I did not change out my coolant and ran some for a very, long time. I have also changed coolants at a 50/50 cut, but then I tend to "richen" it up for good measure.

BeezFun · Mar 14, 2014

applepicker said:
I am still waiting for lab. results.

Did you hear from these guys yet? Hope they don't discover your 2 year old put gummy bears in there.

Paystar · Mar 17, 2014

Operator error?? Thread got pretty quiet.

skyhook · Mar 18, 2014

I'm also curious about this.

Cherokee140 · Mar 18, 2014

Same here....might explain my JD650 problem.

HeLa · Mar 18, 2014

BeezFun said:
Did you hear from these guys yet? Hope they don't discover your 2 year old put gummy bears in there.

:laughing:

checking in to follow this thread as i'm also waiting to hear the results. the title is a bit of a tease.

buickanddeere · Mar 18, 2014

Anybody that uses tap water instead of distilled water in a coolant system . Is just out and out asking for trouble.

skyhook · Mar 18, 2014

buickanddeere said:
Anybody that uses tap water instead of distilled water in a coolant system . Is just out and out asking for trouble.

Funny you say that, when I was a younger teen, working at a garage,
we had that "special" filler to fill batteries (remember those) with distilled water.
We always filled them with tap water. I don't see any difference.

buickanddeere · Mar 18, 2014

skyhook said:
Funny you say that, when I was a younger teen, working at a garage,
we had that "special" filler to fill batteries (remember those) with distilled water.
We always filled them with tap water. I don't see any difference.

It is certainly evident that you would not know the difference.

grsthegreat · Mar 18, 2014

in the 40+ years ive been working on cars and engines in general, ive NEVER used anything but tap water in radiators. never have had a failure to date.

maybe its the water i use.

also, service stations, lube shops, etc all use tap water in those hoses.

buickanddeere · Mar 18, 2014

grsthegreat said:
in the 40+ years ive been working on cars and engines in general, ive NEVER used anything but tap water in radiators. never have had a failure to date.

maybe its the water i use.

also, service stations, lube shops, etc all use tap water in those hoses.

You have 40 yr old batteries in your vehicles?