M59 Discussion Thread

[Chuck K.]

Does anyone use their backhoe bucket to sidesweep dirt and rocks into position with a closed bucket? I've tried it and the M59 has a lot of power to sidesweep with. It does it easily but I have to wonder if making that motion is hard on the machine? Seems like it would loosen up the pins and pivots.

BTW, I got some moly high pressure grease and greased the nipples for the lower backhoe pivots with it. That cured the squeaking I had been getting before in spite of regular greasing. The black moly grease is nasty stuff though.
rScotty

I do it pretty regularly Scotty if I try to sweep too much and it stalls the hoe I just reduce the load and go at it again. With practice I am getting much better leaving the back of the bucket flat making for a nice finish..

I dont think it would have any more chance loosening the pins as the sweeping power is considerably less then the digging force but maybe I am thinking of it all wrong..
I too found some black moly type grease and she seems to like it much better...

 

[mike69440]

Sweeping is definitly tough on the pins. I sweep some with my L39 and all the time with my Komatsu PC75 excavator. In fact I wack stones and such with the excavator building walls, etc. to get things into place. Bear in mind this is an old machine with old pins and heavy strong yoke castings, and I would fire any operator treating my machine the way I do.

If I had a new machine, I would try to keep it new.

 

[rScotty]

Hey,

I thought I'd try to start one thread where those of us who own an M59 can discuss what we like and don't like about the tractor, how we use it, how we've modified it, etc. (and those who are thinking of one can learn). This is inspired by some of the really great threads on here, like the box blade thread & etc..

Our M59 is still working well, but I notice an oddness that has just begun to happen I'm using the thumb. Specifically when I'm gripping something and need to curl the bucket to overpower the thumb I'm getting a jerkiness in the thumb movement when the thumb cylinder when it is forced back by the bucket curl. I've checked for any bent components and re-lubed every joint, but the jerk persists. I'm convinced that it didn't used to do that...that the thumb moved smoothly when overpowered. I want to check with the rest of the M59 owners before I tear into things. How about it? Does any of this sound familiar?
thanks, rScotty

 

[TWD]

Our M59 is still working well, but I notice an oddness that has just begun to happen I'm using the thumb. Specifically when I'm gripping something and need to curl the bucket to overpower the thumb I'm getting a jerkiness in the thumb movement when the thumb cylinder when it is forced back by the bucket curl. I've checked for any bent components and re-lubed every joint, but the jerk persists. I'm convinced that it didn't used to do that...that the thumb moved smoothly when overpowered. I want to check with the rest of the M59 owners before I tear into things. How about it? Does any of this sound familiar?
thanks, rScotty

WHen my thumb is over powered it does not make jerky movements it pushes back in. Most of the time when I try to squeeze something tighter that would over power the thumb I crush whatever i`m gripping :laughing:

As far as side-sweeping... I do this too to level dirt, and push my piles back. It should be fine I would imagine the only time issues may appear when you are smacking something hard but that's probably obviousl

 

[Charlesaf3]

Nope, no jerking for me that I've noticed, and I'm pretty sure that I would notice. Tough for me to figure out what it could be - stuck relief?

 

[rScotty]

Nope, no jerking for me that I've noticed, and I'm pretty sure that I would notice. Tough for me to figure out what it could be - stuck relief?

Yep, you'd notice. It isn't subtle. For a diagnostic I reduced the relief valve pop off pressure adjustments for the thumb and that changed the intensity of the jerking. That was enough evidence for me to order replacement relief valves. I'll keep everyone posted.
Before it started doing that the only problem with the thumb was crushing things. I'm sort of operating on the theory that I crushed something and the sudden jump sent a hydraulic shock down the line that damaged one of the thumb's relief valves (they come in pairs, of course). Could have just taken one out and had a look, They are easy access. But thought I'd have a spare handy just in case. It's an interesting valve because internally it also has to have a path for fluid to the sump as well as an anti-cavitation path to feed fluid to the other side of the ram.
Like I said, I'll keep the group posted.
rScotty

 

[BandDcabinet]

Charles,

Did you ever get the McMillen drive mounted on you hoe?

B & D

 

[Charlesaf3]

Charles,

Did you ever get the McMillen drive mounted on you hoe?

B & D

Yep. Like it. I have a thread with pics here - search under my name.

Rscotty - seems to me that should be a warranty repair... but your knowledge of hydraulics is clearly way up from me

 

[rScotty]

Hello All,
Thought I'd add a note to this long M59 thread because it seems a good way to reach the most M59 owners. Ours just had a problem with the boom cylinder not fully retracting. It can happen. More details about the problem and resolution on the thread: Boom cylinder won't retract all the way. The upshot was it was resolved OK with the only damage being a small dent in my checkbook and getting a bit behind on pre-winter projects.....just thought I'd let the rest of the group know.
rScotty


rScotty

 

[ManAtArms]

I'll chime in on an update too.

-I blew the "Key stop" fuse (5 amp under the steering wheel), which obviously resulted an immediate engine stop....and inability to restart the machine. The LCD display flashed several massages if you tried to start it, and the PTO light was illuminated...the messages where similar to trying to start the machine with the PTO engaged (such as displaying a message to depress the clutch), however it included several other messages about the brake, parking brake, neutral, etc. Anyway, it had nothing to do with the PTO. A new fuse fixed it. I'm not sure why it happened.

-Over the last few months I developed a bit too much play in the joint between the boom and dipperstick, resulting in a nice sloppy over-swing when using the hoe. I had the dealer put some additional shims in there. Now it's nice and tight again. When they were working on that they noticed my thumb cylinder was leaking and so they had to repack it. I never saw any evidence of a leak, but in any event that's fixed now.

I'm about to replace the oil in the front axle. I believe it's UDT from the factory. I've been told to switch it over to 90 weight. Any opinions here?

-Mark

 

[rScotty]

Thanks for the info on the fuse. Hope you didn't get too much of headache learning it. But knowing is bound to help the rest of us. And I bet you were sure relieved to find that's what it was.

On the front axle oil I've been thinking the same thing: that is, I'm wondering about changing over to a gear oil for the front axles come oil change time. In their operator's manual, Kubota seemingly cannot make up their mind of whether to recommend a very low viscosity, low pour point hydraulic oil like UDT or SUDT....or a much more viscous and higher pour point gear oil such as the SAE 80-90. They are very different, but Kubota actually ends up saying you can use either one!! Either it the system is so robust it doesn't matter, or else they couldn't get a concensus amoung the engineers. Hopefully #1....how likely is it to be #2?

Greatly simplifying, the hydraulic oil is designed to be moved around via positive displacement pumps and for reducing sliding friction on smooth surfaces at high velocity. The gear oil way different, it is not designed to go through an oil pump, and protects against impact and heavily loaded shear of rougher surfaces at lower velocity. After looking at the components in the parts book and doing some thinking about oils and motion, I come up with the conclusion that a gear oil is more suitable as long as the weather is warm enough to keep it from troughing. So I'll take a look when I'm in town next and see what oils are available and what ratings they have with an eye to adding more shear and load protection to the front axle lube while keeping low temperature performance and seal compatibility. Right now mine still has less than 400 hours so it has whatever came in it from the factory. Probably UDT?

Shucks, I'm no better at making up my mind than Kubota! .... rScotty

 

[ManAtArms]

The dealer told me that 90 weight would be better....and that kubota put UDT in there at the factory (it smells like it to me.) . I'm using it almost exclusively in 4WD, so I suspect I will be better off with 90 to combat wear. I've only got 225 hours on it now...but I'm gonna change it anyway.

mark

Thanks for the info on the fuse. Hope you didn't get too much of headache learning it. But knowing is bound to help the rest of us. And I bet you were sure relieved to find that's what it was.

On the front axle oil I've been thinking the same thing: that is, I'm wondering about changing over to a gear oil for the front axles come oil change time. In their operator's manual, Kubota seemingly cannot make up their mind of whether to recommend a very low viscosity, low pour point hydraulic oil like UDT or SUDT....or a much more viscous and higher pour point gear oil such as the SAE 80-90. They are very different, but Kubota actually ends up saying you can use either one!! Either it the system is so robust it doesn't matter, or else they couldn't get a concensus amoung the engineers. Hopefully #1....how likely is it to be #2?

Greatly simplifying, the hydraulic oil is designed to be moved around via positive displacement pumps and for reducing sliding friction on smooth surfaces at high velocity. The gear oil way different, it is not designed to go through an oil pump, and protects against impact and heavily loaded shear of rougher surfaces at lower velocity. After looking at the components in the parts book and doing some thinking about oils and motion, I come up with the conclusion that a gear oil is more suitable as long as the weather is warm enough to keep it from troughing. So I'll take a look when I'm in town next and see what oils are available and what ratings they have with an eye to adding more shear and load protection to the front axle lube while keeping low temperature performance and seal compatibility. Right now mine still has less than 400 hours so it has whatever came in it from the factory. Probably UDT?

Shucks, I'm no better at making up my mind than Kubota! .... rScotty

 

[BandDcabinet]

I had the same thing happen (fuse failure)... I'm reasonibly certain I bumped the pto lever when I turned the seat from the rear at the same time I stepped on the forward HST pedal. Not certain what the connection is but the same failure symptoms you described and solution.

The dealer assisted on a late Saturday afternoon with resolving the problem

Another failure today. I reached for the FEL joystick and the top of it snapped off in my hand. Part replaced without question but I am surprised by the ease of the failure. I have the fornt aux hyd.

Despite the issues it is an extraordinary machine. highly regarded by many that visit the farm

B&D

 

[Chuck K.]

Scotty keep us posted what route you take and results. I am approaching 200hrs and am considering stepping up to diff. fluid, may even go synthetic. I am also bumfuzzled on Kubotas advice on what fluid to use in the front diff.


Sorry bout not getting back to you after observing my B/H thumb jerkiness been working 7/12's.. At this point my thumb still retacts smoothly when being pushed in by the bucket.
Chuck.

 

[rScotty]

Scotty keep us posted what route you take and results. I am approaching 200hrs and am considering stepping up to diff. fluid, may even go synthetic. I am also bumfuzzled on Kubotas advice on what fluid to use in the front diff.


Sorry bout not getting back to you after observing my B/H thumb jerkiness been working 7/12's.. At this point my thumb still retacts smoothly when being pushed in by the bucket.
Chuck.

Hmm....OK, on the fluids.... Transmission first....I'm now pushing 300 hours and I tend to run a tractor conservatively. I'll work it hard, but usually not at high RPM. Not much roading or 3 pt work, but a lot of BH and pushing the bucket through dirt or snow.
Have now used UDT - if that's what came in it.... for 50 hours, then New Holland Multi G 134 for 200 hours, and then SUDT for another 50 hours. Each time was a complete oil and filter change. If I were to choose one for shifting it would be the SUDT, for smooth operating BH it would be the New Holland. My choice overall would be the New Holland Multi G 134.

For the front axle right now I'll stay with what came in there - it's probably UDT because it looks like and smells like that. At least until I finish some testing to see if there is a gear oil I like that will mix ok with what is already in there. If so, I may mix some heavier oil in there.
rScotty.

 

[rScotty]

Way back in November of 2008, Charles (Charlesaf3) wrote:

""Hey, I haven't had time to post here lately, but I wanted to explain the easy way to reverse the thumb pedal. On the boom, where it says Kubota, above the K on the right side (or A on the left as its reversed) There is a union with all the thumb hoses - right above the "A" in Kubota....By just unscrewing the tractor side ends of the hoses and switching them the pedal is reversed. Convenient, and no issues with slack in the hoses."
quote: Charlesaf3"

Well, Charles....it's embarrassing that I'm just now getting around to doing that, but thanks! That sure is one clever and easy mod. After the changeover now when I push the pedal forward the thumb closes and rocking it back opens the thumb - which means the pedal now has an intuitively correct movement for me. Much, much, better. It took all of 10 minutes and spilt less than half a cup of fluid - if that much. BTW, before cracking the hose joint it only makes sense to rest the bucket on the ground with the thumb supported by the bucket and all pressure off the system. And don't be surprised as I was when those hydraulic joints turn out to be imperial rather than metric. Sizes 7/8 and 1+1/16 if I remember right.

A while back I promised myself I'd write an update on the SUDT after I'd put some hours on it.

So after running changing to SUDT along with new filters and running it for a few months I can now say definitely that the SUDT has eased the range shifting. Noticibly less force on the hand lever is required to go between L,M,H. That was what I hoping for, but that's not all.

I've had some odd hydraulic system issues crop up starting about two weeks after changing to SUDT and in fairness they ought to get some mention too. Nothing real serious, and nothing I can definitely point to and say that it is caused - or even related - specifically to the SUDT. But nothing else was changed, the problems are real, and the timing of the onset is enough to make me at least a little suspicious about the SUDT having some part in it all. Plus I just went down to buy a spare container of SUDT and found that it isn't being sold anymore because - or so the grapevine says - that Kubota is now in the process of changing the SUDT oil formulation. Wonder why?

My recommendation would be to stick with what is known to work for now. One known good oil for us for years has been the New Holland GL134. Our M59 didn't have any problem while using that oil and it's also what the local Kubota dealer uses.

no snow in the Colorado front range yet@!
season's best to you all,
rScotty

 

[ecoscaper]

I'd love an M59 but the no cab option kills the deal, an aftermarket cab is out of the budget. Anyone miss the cab? How's the exhaust smell?

 

[ManAtArms]

rScotty,

What kind of problems have cropped up? I'm not certain, but I was told the that Kubota put Super UDT in the M59 at the factory....so it probably came loaded that way....at least that's what I was told. Did you switch it out during your first change and then go back?

-Mark

Way back in November of 2008, Charles (Charlesaf3) wrote:

""Hey, I haven't had time to post here lately, but I wanted to explain the easy way to reverse the thumb pedal. On the boom, where it says Kubota, above the K on the right side (or A on the left as its reversed) There is a union with all the thumb hoses - right above the "A" in Kubota....By just unscrewing the tractor side ends of the hoses and switching them the pedal is reversed. Convenient, and no issues with slack in the hoses."
quote: Charlesaf3"

Well, Charles....it's embarrassing that I'm just now getting around to doing that, but thanks! That sure is one clever and easy mod. After the changeover now when I push the pedal forward the thumb closes and rocking it back opens the thumb - which means the pedal now has an intuitively correct movement for me. Much, much, better. It took all of 10 minutes and spilt less than half a cup of fluid - if that much. BTW, before cracking the hose joint it only makes sense to rest the bucket on the ground with the thumb supported by the bucket and all pressure off the system. And don't be surprised as I was when those hydraulic joints turn out to be imperial rather than metric. Sizes 7/8 and 1+1/16 if I remember right.

A while back I promised myself I'd write an update on the SUDT after I'd put some hours on it.

So after running changing to SUDT along with new filters and running it for a few months I can now say definitely that the SUDT has eased the range shifting. Noticibly less force on the hand lever is required to go between L,M,H. That was what I hoping for, but that's not all.

I've had some odd hydraulic system issues crop up starting about two weeks after changing to SUDT and in fairness they ought to get some mention too. Nothing real serious, and nothing I can definitely point to and say that it is caused - or even related - specifically to the SUDT. But nothing else was changed, the problems are real, and the timing of the onset is enough to make me at least a little suspicious about the SUDT having some part in it all. Plus I just went down to buy a spare container of SUDT and found that it isn't being sold anymore because - or so the grapevine says - that Kubota is now in the process of changing the SUDT oil formulation. Wonder why?

My recommendation would be to stick with what is known to work for now. One known good oil for us for years has been the New Holland GL134. Our M59 didn't have any problem while using that oil and it's also what the local Kubota dealer uses.

no snow in the Colorado front range yet@!
season's best to you all,
rScotty

 

[ManAtArms]

Sometimes I wish I had a cab, buy the Laurin cab is 10k and the Curtis cab is something like 6 or 7k...so no cab for me now. Plus I'm always jumping in and out of the machine so a cab might get in the way. The exhaust smell only hits me sometimes...95% of the time I don't have any issues with it.

I'd love an M59 but the no cab option kills the deal, an aftermarket cab is out of the budget. Anyone miss the cab? How's the exhaust smell?

 

[Chuck K.]

FEL bushings gone at 200hrs??
I dont claim to be as dilligent as I should and grease every ten hours but I do hit the zerks regularly.. Going to dealer next friday and order both FEL curl boom bushings the one on the left side is completely gone figured I replace the both of them while I at it..