Tires Why not fill front tires?

digger2 · Jan 18, 2009

Hey guys,
I know theres been ALOT of talk on here about filling rear tires for extra traction,stability,and on and on.But what about the fronts.Would'nt it make sense?Not only for lower center of gravity,but a little more traction too.Even when your not in 4x4,what harm would it do?
Even my operators manual says "do not fill the front wheels (tires) with liquid to maintain steering control".....hmmmmm.

I don't know.I would think you would have more steering control if the tires were filled.Unless because of the tires smaller size and higher RPM"s(compared to the larger rears) centrifugal force would take over,slinging the liquid fill around the inside of the tire causing a "steering control" problem.
Of course this would happen prob. only at "road speed" and not "work speed".You know-high gear,top rpm's or thereabouts.Maybe this is what they mean by "maintaining steering control".Somebody here has had to have tried this.Any problems???
90% of the time when i have to take my tractor anywhere,i trailer it.And as far as when i get to where i'm going,well.....how often would i be going a speed that is going to cause "loss of steering control"?Oh,front tires on my tractor(B26) are 23x8.50 14's.If filled (with wwf) they would hold a little over 100# each.

thanks for any responses,Digger2

ultrarunner · Jan 18, 2009

It was explained to me by the Tire Dealer that filled the rear tires on my BX like this:

The benefit of a slightly lower center of gravity from filling my tractors very small tires is negated by the increased chance of damage to the front axle. Filled Tires don't have as much give and as a result shock loads are more easily transmitted to the front Axle which is inherently weaker than the non-articulated rear Axle.

neucam · Jan 18, 2009

I don't have a direct answer, but 100lbs is a high figure for a front tire, my 38"tall X 8.3 x 22" rears only hold about 100+lbs. That would be about 12 gallons liquid each. So you maybe are talking about 2-3 gallons in that front tire. If you don't have a FEL then putting a weight box on the extreme front would do more for traction with rear implements than liquid in the tires. You could add liquid but you will not gain much and then have to deal with potential rust problems. Stability, I don't know if it would be a problem. But why try it.

Reg · Jan 18, 2009

For LOADER work there is chance/risk of front axle damage due to reduced cushion.
For non-loader work, it might help a bit in 4WD, although my guess is that if you do the arithmetic you will find it to be a negligible increase to the tractor's weight.
In round numbers Rimguard in the rear tires can add about 25% to the tractor's weight, OK a bit under 20% if the tractor already has a loader on it.

LBrown59 · Jan 18, 2009

Reg said:
For LOADER work there is chance/risk of front axle damage due to reduced cushion.
For non-loader work, it might help a bit in 4WD, although my guess is that if you do the arithmetic you will find it to be a negligible increase to the tractor's weight.
In round numbers Rimguard in the rear tires can add about 25% to the tractor's weight, OK a bit under 20% if the tractor already has a loader on it.

The load in the loader bucket is all the weight you need.

SFish · Jan 18, 2009

I fill the front tires because, on a previous tractor, I rolled a tire off the rim on a turn a couple of times with a heavy load in the bucket, even with the recommended air pressure in the tires. They don't compress as much with the smaller amount of air on top of the water. I don't slam it around with weight in the loader and I don't drive fast on the road. I use plain water in the tires because it is easier to dump and easier to load, and I live in California (no freezing).

Steve

CharlieKtractor · Jan 18, 2009

I foam filled my front tires 6 years ago when I bought the tractor--have never had a flat-never rolled a tire and drive as fast as it will go-to each his own--lol

Bedlam · Jan 19, 2009

One advantage of tubes is that the tire doesn't roll off the rim as easily.
On mine, I didn't see how that little extra weight would help.I don't think it would be worth the effort and the problems when I get a flat etc.
Id consider front weights if that was my concern.

art · Jan 19, 2009

Let's see loaded front tires, wear out ball joint end faster as they need more leverage to turn the wheels.

It will wear out the front drive pieces faster because of the added weight.
It will take more fuel to move the unit.
If a gear drive will require the clutch to be slipped more to get started.

Just2quickz28 · Jan 19, 2009

use Soft foam fill and dont worry about it

jddotson · Jan 19, 2009

I found out (so I thought) that my front tires were loaded shortly after I bought my used JD4510 when checking tire pressures. After reading this thread I decided to unload the front tires and see how it worked out. Tonight I discovered that I had one loaded front tire and one that was not!

I also realized that there was a slight tread difference in the front tires so I'll assume that the imbalance probably occurred during a tire change.

firemanpat2910 · Jan 20, 2009

I had the fronts filled on my 2 wheel drive ford 2910. It kept the front end down when loading on trailer, and when I had the big disc harrow on the back. I never had any trouble with front end wear, or issues when "roading it" from the farm to the house in town.

TechJ · Jan 20, 2009

Got a Bota 2600 and after many flats (clearing up after the Californai Cedar fire) finally foam filled front & rear -- probbaly one of the best things I've done. After 4 yrs no problems, better traction, lower center of gravity, etc. Only downside is that the ride is pretty rough on paved srufaces but I don't spend much time on those.

jcmseven · Jan 20, 2009

I had a JD 4520 which I filled the rears and the fronts with Rim Guard. I could tell a difference in uphill pulling of my box blade with the fronts filled. I think the primary reason the fronts do not get filled is they just do not hold very much, so it is not worth it. One has to have a larger tractor with larger tires to make it justifiable. I recall my 4520 held about 5 gallons of ballast in each front, so almost 50# per tire. I noticed this also when plowing snow with my 7' boom mounted blade. It seemed the front would steer a bit better. They will also track better in slick mud with fluid ballast in them, especially with R4's. I never had trouble, and honestly 50# worth of weight in this sized tractor places very little additional wear on the front axle. This might not hold true on smaller machines.

John M

Gary Fowler · Jan 20, 2009

I would say it is totally personal preference. You will get a few pounds of extra weight with ballasted front tires. We always put ballast in the fronts on the large farm tractors which had 11 or 12 Inch wide tires that were nearly waist high so they held a lot of water, probalbly as much as the little compact tractor hold in the rear. We never had any problems with steering or with front end wear, but those were much larger tractors and built to carry much more weight.
I just widened my tires out on the front and when I get some time, I plan to fill them with antifreeze/water mixture both front and rear. I need the extra traction that it will provide for about what 2 cast iron weights will cost, I can ballast all the tires.
The best answer is what ever you want to do and if if makes you feel more comfortable, go for it. I personally dont think there is an issue with steering or with compression because you still have air in at least 1/4th of the tire so you still have the necessary give and flex and we never had any problems with any of our tractors with ballasted tires. My Dad ran ballast in all his tractors from 8N -9000 Fords and never had an issue with steering or wearing of front end.

RobJ · Jan 20, 2009

art said:
Let's see loaded front tires, wear out ball joint end faster as they need more leverage to turn the wheels.

It will wear out the front drive pieces faster because of the added weight.
It will take more fuel to move the unit.
If a gear drive will require the clutch to be slipped more to get started.

I don't think it'll do any of the above.

It'll add little weight if you have a small tractor.
The ground surface contact is still small so not that much friction is added (if any).
No additional weight is added to the wheel bearings, unless you start bouncing the front end.
Again the rolling friction might go up a nano amount unless you travel up hill both ways.

...ever rolled a wood floor with one of those 6" diameter solid steel rollers, about 150#. They roll pretty easy, harder up hill, easy down hill, hard as heck to pick up!

IMO you add more stress to the front end by adding weights, loaders, etc. This puts more stress on everything from the ground up to the weight. If you drive this tractor on a real bumpy road, fast all the time, then you might add some stress to the drivetrain. But if you are just doing normal tasks, IMO not any problem.

Personally I'd load the fronts solid for one purpose, flats. Problem is on my tractor I don't have any problem with front flats. Ok guess who'll have a flat this weekend!

art · Jan 20, 2009

RobJ said:
I don't think it'll do any of the above.

It'll add little weight if you have a small tractor.
The ground surface contact is still small so not that much friction is added (if any).
No additional weight is added to the wheel bearings, unless you start bouncing the front end.
Again the rolling friction might go up a nano amount unless you travel up hill both ways. ...ever rolled a wood floor with one of those 6" diameter solid steel rollers, about 150#. They roll pretty easy, harder up hill, easy down hill, hard as heck to pick up!

IMO you add more stress to the front end by adding weights, loaders, etc. This puts more stress on everything from the ground up to the weight. If you drive this tractor on a real bumpy road, fast all the time, then you might add some stress to the drivetrain. But if you are just doing normal tasks, IMO not any problem.

Personally I'd load the fronts solid for one purpose, flats. Problem is on my tractor I don't have any problem with front flats. Ok guess who'll have a flat this weekend!

As a dealer I love your reponse! Keep working for me!!!!!!

IslandTractor · Jan 20, 2009

art said:
As a dealer I love your reponse! Keep working for me!!!!!!

Art, how many CUTs with less than several thousand hours have you ever had to replace ball joints on? I don't believe I've ever seen a post on TBN regarding worn out ball joints so this is just new to me. I am sure it is an issue with older machines with many thousands of hours and decades of service but is this really a reason not to load fronts? I'm wondering if you rebuild engines more often than front suspensions. Is it the light weight Kubotas with this issue or do heavier machines also have the problem?

Treemonkey1000 · Jan 20, 2009

I ended up foam filling my fronts as I use the tractor to skid tree's out of the woods. Plus I didn't want to get a flat out in the middle of the woods and try to cart a tire out from the booney's. I think the foam added about 160lbs to each tire.

Solo · Jan 20, 2009

I have the fronts filled on my TC18. Filling added around 33lbs. to each tire. That is not much but it did make a noticeable difference. I think a loader would cause more stress on the front end than 66lbs. would.