Wood Lot Machines

[Jim_Fisher]

I have a friend who owns a 50 acre wood lot with a small hobby type milling operation on it.

He's using an old CJ (Jeep) to skid things around but has decided he want's a tractor type device for the lot - for the versatility it might offer (loader, 3ph, hydraulics, etc.)

The main issue as I see it is the requirement for ground clearance. This acreage doesn't have many logging roads (perhaps he'll make some) and it is mostly Maine white pine and some hardwoods. He's looking at 28-35 horsepower CUTs with diesels and 4WD and it is hard to make recommendations because of the clearance issues.

Anyone have any better suggestions regarding a machine for this purpose?

You might find this discussion entitled 'The Farm Tractor in the Woodlot' interesting.

http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=26571

 

[john_bud]

Remember, Power Tracs are designed pretty much like a logging skidder to start with. You owe it to yourself to try one out if you get a chance. Ask anyone that owns a Power Trac and a standard tractor which one they use most and why. They will tell you the Power Trac design simply out performs their standard tractor design for most tasks. I had a large International Harvestor industrial tractor/loader... HST, 50 PTO HP on the 3PT hitch, full cab, loaded tires, integral FEL with 3/4 yard bucket. It weighed about 8000 pounds with the box blade attached. It was a very strong tractor. I get more work done with my 25HP PT425. It is quick, nimble and safer on hills. I can go into more places with it than my monster IH ever could and leave the forest floor with less damage. And as I mentioned before, the quick attach feature makes it much more productive in that I can change implements in 15 seconds without getting off the tractor(30 seconds for hydraulically powered implements).

If you haven't seen one in action, click on my little animated Power Trac in my signature. That is a link to my website. Click on the videos link and watch a few of them in action(there are about 25 videos). If my little Pt can do that stuff, just imaging what their larger models can do! Enjoy the videos.

Moss,

I did check out your web pages. Nice stuff there. I'll keep an eye out for some seat time on a power trac, but 'till then, I still think that (for me) the 'bota will get more done. At least for pulling 6000# of trees behind the machine. I didn't just grow up in Missouri, I'm as stubborn as a dad burn Missouri Mule, too! (chuckle)

I do like the thought of having a brush cutter in front -- that's slick. Way slicker than backing thru the woods. Any the quick change is slick too! Lots of good features there.

jb

 

[MossRoad]

Moss,

I did check out your web pages. Nice stuff there. I'll keep an eye out for some seat time on a power trac, but 'till then, I still think that (for me) the 'bota will get more done. At least for pulling 6000# of trees behind the machine. I didn't just grow up in Missouri, I'm as stubborn as a dad burn Missouri Mule, too! (chuckle)

I do like the thought of having a brush cutter in front -- that's slick. Way slicker than backing thru the woods. Any the quick change is slick too! Lots of good features there.

jb

I had to see one and sit on it and watch it operate before I would buy one. I got that opportunity from a local landscaper. That was it.... it was a pure paradigm shift in my thinking about conventional tractors VS a multi-tool platform and what equipment I really needed to accomplish the tasks that I needed to do. It sounds korny, I know. But I can not see a need for a conventional tractor ever in my future since I bought this machine.

Being a small operation, I will never have the need to pull 6000# of trees in one pull. But I am pretty sure I can pull out six 1000# trees one at a time faster than I could gather and pull out those trees in one pull with my old IH and leave the forest with less damage, too.

One thing that I haven't seen mention of in this thread is a logging arch. It would allow an operator with a smaller tractor to move large pieces with less stress on the tractor and less damage to the forest as well. I may consider one if I see a need for it. I have about 24,000 trees on our place. Most are small, a few thousand are between 10" and 18" in diameter and a couple hundred are over that. If I harvest them for firewood, I'll cut them into smaller lengths under a thousand pounds and haul them out. If I have some nicer lengths for lumber, I'll get an arch so I can keep them longer lengths and still be able to move them with my small PT.

 

[daTeacha]

When an Amish crew logged my ground several years ago, they used an arch. Between that and the horses, they left hardly a mark on the woods. People wondered where all the logs came from as the pile across the street grew and grew since the place didn't look like it had been logged. Those things are great!

 

[john_bud]

Yeah, I've used a small arch behind a Honda ATV. It could easily pull out a lot of tree behind a small machine! But, I did hit a stump with the leading edge of a log once. Ouch, is all I have to say.

Say Moss, Was your old IH a 2WD tractor by chance? I ask as I have an old Ford 4140 gear tractor with a 3000# FEL and a 14' hoe on the back. It comes in at 8000+#. My 34hp kubota with 4wd can out work it. Easily. Combination of the 4wd traction and HST. Of course each machine has it's place. The little bota couldn't hold a 3000# backhoe!!

I don't think I will get any PT seat time around here. Never saw one. Would be fun to compare. Heck, it's always fun to get seat time and time on a new machine is the sweetest.

jb

 

[MossRoad]

Yes, the IH2500b that I had was 2wd, HST, 4 cylinder gas engine, 50HP PTO, loaded industrial tires, permanent FEL with oversized lift cylinders, 3/4 yard bucket, a 6' box blade with a 55 gallon drum of concrete in top and a nice cab with heat... lots of heat... no air... kill you in the summer heat! It was a very strong tractor. It could push over most 10-12 inch trees just by putting the corner of the bucket up about 8-9 feet and leaning on them. Once they started tipping over, I would drive to the side of them and force them down, then go back to the root ball and pop them out. Except for locust trees, which had a spider web of 2" roots that were like rubber bands running 20-30 feet in all directions. Those are really a pain. It did a lot of work for us when I excavated a road and mowed with a 5' brush hog for 5 years. But it was just too big for our needs once the road was in. After I bought the Power Trac PT425, it sat for a few years, so I sold it to an International Harvestor salvage yard, where it will become an organ donor so that more old IH tractors can live.

Here's some pictures of the old gal. For perspective, that's a 10' garage door and a full size Chevy van.

 

[Jstpssng]

Andy - Good suggestion. Since you have the 501 skidding winch did you consider the 3PH grappler like is seen in the link you gave? Pros & cons either way?

I'm not Andy, but I can think of a few pros and cons.

A few cons;
Like a self loading trailer, you need to get much closer to the trees than with a winch; hence more trails, and less ability to work around rough or wet areas. With a winch I have the ability to drop the "twitch" and move the tractor through a wet area or up a grade, then drag the trees through afterward. Also, the grapple is designed more for single tree removal, whereas I can hook onto 5 or 6 smaller trees at a time.

Pros;

The grapple allows you to hook onto a log without getting off the tractor, and also would be handy for holding the stem off the ground while cutting it into stove length pieces.
Aside from logging, the grapple would be handy for other uses such as moving large rocks, and brush. I have an old field that I'm reclaiming, with brush piles scattered all over 2 acres. The grapple would be handy for moving these to a central location for burning, instead of stacking it on my trailer by hand as I'm doing now.
Like everything which Valby makes, the one shown in the link is a very nice looking unit.


A self loading trailer would be nice to have; the winch could bring the logs out to a main trail, for later pickup. But at $10,000, I'd have to have a lot more than my 20 acres to justify it.

I've considered an arch for my tractor, as I have some large hemlock on my back corner that I want to have sawn to build my garage. However, my same neighbor with the sawmill also has a skidder, as well as 2 recent college grads who love to cut on the weekends; guess they'll be bringing it out for me. It's nice to have neighbors like them.

I'm still not sure what the OP is looking for, but the suggestions from all the previous posts show the wide range of options available.

 

[john_bud]

Moss,

Hmmm, that was a large brute of a 'beaut!

Must be nice to have the more nimble unit now.

jb

 

[MossRoad]

Moss,

Hmmm, that was a large brute of a 'beaut!

Must be nice to have the more nimble unit now.

jb

Yes. The PT425 fits in my garage. I can stand next to it and put my nose on the top of the canopy. I used to haul it in the bed of my full size pickup with an attachement. Power Trac makes several different size units of varying HP. There is one in there somewhere for just about everyone.

I think an articulated unit like a Power Trac, Stiener, Ventrac, or some of those European models are the way to go for most tasks with the exception of plowing fields. Heck, some of the European units have 3PT hitches for plowing, so they'd work well for that, too.