Which Implement For Vine And Root Removal From Woods? (Sandy-Loam Soil)

[jeff9366]

At this second I am leaning toward the Hay King C-3 Renovator for vine and root removal. Then continuing to use my well tested Ratchet Rake on the FEL bucket to pile exhumed vines. Ratchet Rake is pictured in Post #1, Photo #2. Debris transport to burn pile via my FEL clamp-on aluminum Debris Forks.

Just one new implement, the Hay King Renovator.

I can further utilize the Renovator to help my neighbor, who installs sod on residential sites, mostly new construction.

I have not settled on this equipment combination. Still researching. Still open to suggestions.

Ideally someone will suggest a vender for parabolic shaped, 3/4" to 1" thick rippers.

 

[jeff9366]

Gotcha, then I would suggest a mini ex with a thumb, you can get quite good at scarifing roots with them and with the thumb drop them into a trailer to get rid of them. Thanks for the info on the trees, always good to learn from someone who knows! Like was stated your next best bet would be a box with hydraulic retractable scarifiers then clean up with a grapple. CJ

Review Post #4.

 

[sdef]

I have a RO72 on the back of my 7000#, 45 gross HP, R4 tired, HST and have similar vines I have removed in clay soil. The large diameter vines, even just a few inches below ground, can easily stop the tractor due to having a long length anchored at each end, with the many off chutes grabbing the soil, perpendicular to my travel path. Picture a military jet's tail hook while landing on an aircraft carrier, for the visual effect of the vine(s) once surfaced.

The problem in my case is not the amount of shanks I have in the ground, but rather the length and diameter of the underground vines being hooked by the shanks. And when the tractor gets stopped, it is usually held by just a single shank or maybe a couple by a long vine still anchored on each end of what I pulled to the surface.

I had to resort to just allowing the larger ones to be pulled to the surface by the tractor and after I have a few above ground, going back and manually cutting the roots at the surface on either end of the now exposed vines. To do the job right, I would need to then go back and dig up each end of the vine still in the ground using a stump bucket.

I think in a larger area like what you have, it is a lot to ask of a CUT, if one also values one's time.

 

[jeff9366]

The grape vine roots I am dealing with do not put out side filaments. Vines slowly taper, then may branch at the ends, but without holding/filament side shoots they free from sandy-loam relatively easily. Even so, I do plenty of cutting sections free from the dirt with loppers. If you look at Photo #1, Post #1, you can see where my ROBB has surfaced a box blade width of vines.

The soil was perfect that one day. I need something that will work on imperfect days too, hopefully faster. I think the shape and angle of the box blade rippers is the problem. Good for cutting to the bottom of pot holes, not so good as an ersatz chisel plow.

 

[xtn]

Sounds like the ideal solution would be just four or five good shanks, arranged as on the front of a box blade (although angled for lifting the roots), with the out-side two sharpened to a knife edge and maybe positioned a few inches ahead of the others. In this way maybe you could cut the roots to implement width as you pull through them, and pull them out. Each pass you make would pull out a bundle of roots the width of the implement... instead of tugging the whole root out to the side and resulting in an aircraft carrier style stop. Maybe? I dunno I'm just thinking out loud.

xtn

 

[jeff9366]

Good idea. I will consider further.

However this does not directly address the decreased draft of parabolic rippers relative to straight rippers. Parabolics are easier to pull, though more expensive to manufacture.

Tremor® Subsoiler - Unverferth Primary Tillage

Agriculture Subsoilers - Monroe Tufline

http://www.hayking.com/Chisel Plow.htm

http://www.umequip.com/tillage/freedom-3pt-implement/soil-ripper/

 

[sdef]

Good idea. I will consider further.

However this does not directly address the decreased draft of parabolic rippers relative to straight rippers. Parabolics are easier to pull, though more expensive to manufacture.

Tremor?ｮ Subsoiler - Unverferth Primary Tillage

Agriculture Subsoilers - Monroe Tufline

K&M Mfg. Product 4

Soil Ripper - Freedomｮ 3pt. Implements

The first three items appear to be designed for larger tractors than many of us have on TBN. And my soil is not sandy enough for me to consider implements of this type, except for the last one. I have a Fred Cain S2 subsoiler but have not tried it yet. Everything Attachments has a video on it which you may have seen:
Fred Cain Tractor 3 Point Hitch Subsoiler S-2
I am also going to use it to install irrigation pipes for the garden, besides its intended usage.

In reviewing all of the items you posted, it would seem that replacing the scarifiers on your ROBB with fixed ones designed to be more circular may be a decent compromise, along with T-N-T; love mine and as a tractor newbie, makes me FAR more productive and FAR less aggravated, considering the alternative :thumbsup:

 

[jeff9366]

In reviewing all of the items you posted, it would seem that replacing the scarifiers on your ROBB with fixed ones designed to be more circular may be a decent compromise.

I know someone out there sells parabolic shaped rippers. If this thread stays "fresh" long enough, someone will contribute a vender name and web site. It is such an obvious business opportunity.

 

[bcp]

Maybe adapt a parabolic fertilizer knife.

Nichols Tillage Tools

parabolic fertilizer knives-photos

If there was a manufacturer nearby, they might work with you on a modification for your needs.

Bruce

 

[the old grind]

Good idea to get a plot in now and keep the greater task in perspective. IMO that's big for the hp on hand and boils down to 'x' teeth/hp being pulled at a time any way you rig it up. Yes those vines will pull up like ropes, and I'd see what the ROBB would do with fewer teeth down (2-3?). For such work I just make however many passes to pull up wads(?), nip here & there, and bundle up with the forks.

Can't compare the usual ~3/4 ac/job I've done this with to the task at hand, but there's only so much another implement will do considering tractor size. I might pass on the 'renovator' in favor of a disc (on hand?), but that neighbor might like it enough to buy it if it doesn't work out. Food plots seem to need cultivation more for ease of working than for sprouting good crops. (Know when enuf is enuf?) Grape re-sprouts can be sprayed in Spring if fall planting is the norm. (Sometimes I envy those who have more usable land than water, and more room to plant ... )

 

[sdef]

Considerations I just stumbled across. Or maybe you could contact the OEM for just the shanks or have them modify their existing design for your ROBB. However, a large, regular subsoiler with a single shank is usually recommended for use with an ~30HP tractor. My guess is you may be able to use a twin shank in sandy soil for the depth you are contemplating. But in my clay, I would most likely just spin the tires.

BTW: IF you have never had the opportunity of visiting an Agri Supply store, they are a very large, true, farm store. Really neat place to gather most any type of implement piece/part right off the shelf as you pass by.

Subsoiler, One Shank, Category 1 Hitch

Subsoiler, Two Shank, Category 2 Hitch

 

[jeff9366]

Thank you for three helpful replies.

I am considering a sub-soiler, however the made in USA Unverferth 'Freedom" soil ripper is a better choice for me than Agri Supply, as 18" is all the rip depth I can ever contemplate needing. For the vines, 6" should suffice.

If I buy a dedicated implement for surfacing vines I am would like to have secondary use for it in mind.

I buy replacement shanks for my Rollover Box Blade from Agri Supply via web order. I recently planned an overnight stay in Lumberton, N.C. and planned to visit the Agri Supply store there; but plans changed.

UNVERFERTH LINK:

Soil Ripper - Freedomｮ 3pt. Implements

 

[jeff9366]

Maybe adapt a parabolic fertilizer knife.

Nichols Tillage Tools

parabolic fertilizer knives-photos

Excellent idea. I have added Nichol Tillage to Bookmarks on my Mac.

I was fooling with the Ford Series 101, 2-14" plow yesterday. I have it plowing but not well. I will refine plow adjustments next week.

Thereafter I will get back to the Rollover Box Blade, measure, and determine if Parabolic Fertilizer Knives will fit and be an improvement over what I have.

THANK YOU.

 

[jeff9366]

After one year and five months of consideration I special ordered a 66" Dirt Dog 'All Purpose Plow' (APP 66-5) which I will call a Field Cultivator, rather than a plow, as no soil inversion occurs.

Cost was $835 FOB dealer, no sales tax on Ag nor Forestry equipment in Florida. I rented a U-Haul truck to transport Field Cultivator from Dirt Dog dealer, forty miles away, home.

Five parabolic shank Field Cultivator pulls much easier than the five rippers on my Bush Hog Rollover Box Blade. (Photo #11)

Like all implements, operating this one involves a learning curve. It worked well this afternoon. It should perform better as I accumulate hours pulling/adjusting it. (Photo #6)

I pulled Field Cultivator through a small patch of Bahia pasture grass to see if it would work as a Pasture Renovator in my sand-loam soil. It penetrated 5"-6" without tearing up surface growth.

This implement is a contemporary reproduction of an original Harry Ferguson design circa 1934. Ferguson called it a 'tiller'. Ford/Dearborn marketed same implement as a 'Field Cultivator', after parting ways with Ferguson.



LINK: Dirt Dog Manufacturing

 

[Poopdeck Pappy]

I looks like it will do a great job. When I was a kid on the farm, we used chisel plows with fixed shanks (no springs). Field cultivators were not very common at all in our area. Now, the only fixed shank chisel plows I see are older ones from the days gone by.

When you have a chance to use it some more, I'd love to see some more action pics and to hear a report on your thoughts and impressions. I think with one of these plus a disc harrow and a drag of some sort (for leveling and busting up clods), I wouldn't need a rotary tiller. Plus I think the field cultivator would bust up and aerate the soil deeper than a tiller would.

 

[jeff9366]

Dirt Dog Field Cultivator / 284 pounds Vs. Athen's Chisel Plow / 737 pounds with five shanks, both made in Georgia.

Note: parabolic shape shanks.


Field Cultivator -an implement used to perform secondary tillage operations such as seedbed preparation and weed eradication*. Field cultivators are equipped with steel shanks that are typically spring mounted to permit the shank to move within the soil and shatter clods. Field cultivators are constructed similarly to chisel plows, but are more lightly built.

[*not much for general weed eradication due to space between shanks. Would be fine for weed eradication if sweeps were substituted for standard chisel points.]


Chisel plows are primary tillage implements which use curved shanks to penetrate and "stir" the soil without inverting a soil layer. Chisel plows cause less residue disturbance than moldboard plows and are often used in conservation tillage systems.

 

[jeff9366]

When I was a kid on the farm, we used chisel plows with fixed shanks (no springs). Now, the only fixed shank chisel plows I see are older ones from the days gone by.

LINKS (2) Buckeye Tractor Co., Columbus Grove, Ohio: Buckeye Tractor Online Catalog Page 18-01 Chisel Plows

Buckeye Tractor Online Catalog Page 30-03 Garden Series

 

[sdef]

Five parabolic shank Field Cultivator pulls much easier than the five rippers on my Bush Hog Rollover Box Blade.

Why do you think this is? The shape? The shanks on the field cultivator appear to be a bit longer than the ones on the ROBB. I have a RO720 ROBB.

 

[jeff9366]

Might have better luck using a parabolic ripper shank which would tend to push the rock upwards. These shanks have longer gradual curves that could get under the rock and make them rise to the surface. A straight shank subsoil could work but would have a harder time.

Perhaps spring-return character of the shape has something to do with it, at least with Chisels and Field Cultivators.

The Hay King Pasture Renovator, a heavy duty implement, also has parabolic shape soil contact parts. Heavy duty tractor subsoilers, such as Monroe Tufline and Unverferth have forged blades with a parabolic face.


Anyone out there know the WHY? of parabolic shank shape?

 

[bcp]

Anyone out there know the WHY? of parabolic shank shape?

I have a comparison of angled and parabolic that may be of interest.



I suspect angled or parabolic shanks require less down force (weight) to enter the soil and stay down, compared to vertical shanks.

Bruce