What rod is which?

[Iplayfarmer]

What are the properties of the various welding rods?

I got a bunch when I bought my used welder, but I am finding out that most of it is not very good. I don't know if it got wet or it's just old or what. Some rods stick real bad and others will start an arc real nice.

I've got some 7018, some 7018 H4R, some 6013, and then a bunch of stuff that I can't read the numbers.

What are the common rods? How are they different? What rods are good for what applications?

 

[Ford960]

I use only two rods, 6011 and 6013.

 

[krue]

I would suspect that your rods are wet, which means pretty much useless. For welding specific info you can try Shop Floor Talk - powered by vBulletin

 

[Dirthog]

7018 & 7018 hr are low hydrogen rods you need a DC machine to run them if they got wet you can dry them again by heating them take a small dorm size refrigerator and put a 100watt light bulb in side so that it burns all the time after a couple of days the rods will dry out then put a smaller bulb inside to keep it warm and dry.

 

[MadReferee]

This type of welding question should best be asked in a welding specific forum. Two of the best manufacture forums are the Hobart and Miller forums. Try asking there. These forums are to welding what TBN is to tractors. Your questions have probably already been asked and answered, more than once.

Hobart Weld Talk Forums

Miller Motorsports Welding Forum

 

[Iplayfarmer]

I use only two rods, 6011 and 6013.

I found a few general descriptions on some catalog type web sites, but I could still use some "real world" practical advice.

When do you use 6011 and when do you use 6013?

 

[Fishguy]

Before you throw out the rods, you can try to dry them in your oven. Just lay them in there and turn it on to about 350 for an hour or so. After they dry out good then you will need to build yourself a storage box for them and any new ones you get. (You could also use a 5 gallon can that has a removable lid.) In this box put a 100w lightbulb and some vent holes. Keep the light on at all times and you should be good to go!

Good luck,
Steve

 

[dfkrug]

Any welding handbook will give welding rod properties. Both
6013 and 7018 can be used AC or DC. The former is hi-penetration,
medium strength, hi spatter. The latter is hi strength, low penetration,
lower spatter, and makes cleaner looking welds. For critical welds on
thick mild steel, I like to use 6013 first and cover with 7018.

Note that the Lincoln rod boxes suggest cooking the rods at 750F
even when new. I never do that, but I keep them in a sealed air
tight container.

I am told that 7014 rods are supposed to work very well, but I have not
found them.

 

[kossetx]

Iplayafarmer, I'm not looking at a book, nor am I a pro welder, but I'm going to give my welding rod assessment that is different than those stated. Any rod can stike an arc in an ac machine, but in my opinion a 7018 doesn't work well in an ac machine. Also, in my experiance a 6013 is not a penetrating rod. It is a high build rod like a 7018. A 6011 is a good penatrating rod also good for an ac machine and a 6013 is a high build smooth finish ac rod that doesn't penatrate well. You need to tell us what machine (ac/dc) you have. Just my .02

 

[Timber]

I agree my go to rods are 6011 & 6013 I use the 6011 to just fix things were I could care less if the weld is pretty or if it is difficult to clean or older stuff, Mostly repair work so I can fix it and go. 6013 I use for building stuff, new things or if I want nice welds that look pretty under paint. I am by no means a great welder but I have found these rods work best for overall work around my equipment. Once the rod gets warm you can get a nice ark. Clean your lens and let your eyes see your work in your shield before you strike your ark. Weld hot as hot as you can without melting your stock away. Also don't run long beads, do an inch or 2 and go to the other end and then to the middle and then to the beginning again, make sure you chip your slag. This will keep your distortion down.

 

[Harry c]

Like someone else said: Look at the Miller, Lincoln or Hobart site. They'll tell you the usage, polarity, and current settings for pretty much every rod you have (that you can identify anyway) You'll need to know the rod diameter as well as the number.
Don't get too carried away drying rods before you investigate. Some can not be dried and work satisfactorily. Once damp or even exposed to open air for a few days, they're junk. Others aren't sensitive to moisture. They'll weld in the rain. Some can be dried and work great. "Wet" rods give lots of spatter and porous welds as a rule.

 

[sandman2234]

The 7014 that df mentioned are probably one of the best rods if you want a weld that looks like a row of dimes. Only problem with them is they are a horizontal only rod. Since that is my favorite position anyway, I grab them when I can. They also don't like rust, paint, etc. The flux will actually peel itself off, leaving a beautiful weld.
6011 are what I use most, simply because most of my work is repairs, or using steel that I have laying around outside. Very seldom do I buy new steel, and when I do, I often mistake it for stainless, since it has no rust...
David from jax

 

[SPYDERLK]

I found a few general descriptions on some catalog type web sites, but I could still use some "real world" practical advice.

When do you use 6011 and when do you use 6013?

6011 for dirty or clean metal - - relatively foolproof, dampness tolerant. 6013 for clean metal.

A needle scaler works well for chipping and strain relieving the cooling weld.

Larry

 

[Boomerang1]

The weld from a 7018 rod is also more flexible.
Use it on weldments (welded joints) that may be subject to flexing or twisting.

 

[Highbeam]

When you go to a big box store to buy welding rod you will notice only 3 types 7018, 6013 and sometimes 6011. That is because those three are super commonly used and pretty much will work with anything. I have never had a piece of steel refuse to be welded with any of these rods.

 

[Iplayfarmer]

Thanks everyone! Lots of good input.

kossetx, I have a 230 amp AC welder. It's an old Montgomery Ward.

I went and bought some brand new 1/8" 6011 and 1/8" 7018 from the local hardware store and tried it at home the other night just to see if it was the welder or the rod. The 6011 worked great. Even with brand new 7018 rod though, I could hardly keep from sticking... even with the heat all the way up. Are there different kinds of 7018? ...i.e. one for AC and one for DC?

I also have a bucket of rod that I got from an old farmer, and I tried some of it out too. The markings were worn off of most of it, but from the looks of it there had to be 5 or 6 different kinds of rod there. I could put down a bead with any and all of it except the stuff that was marked as 7018. Now I've got about 10 pounds of 7018 rod from three different sources that I can't use.

The easy solution is to just do all of my welding with rod other than 7018. Mostly now I just want to know what is going on.

 

[Highbeam]

My 7018 rod is all clearly marked 7018AC where the other rod does not specify AC leading me to believe that there must be a DC 7018 out there with some quality that makes it less suitable for AC welding.

 

[sandman2234]

7018 rods take a little practice getting them started. I think it is called "tap-tap", which is how you start them, whereas 6011 is more of a scratch start rod. My Miller 330 has a soft start that I have gotten used to, but it makes 7018 a real challenge to start. One of my friends, a welder for 40 years came over, and had to have the Hi-freq turned on to start them. I just laughed at him and turned it on.
The key to learning to weld is find the right principle, and then practice, practice, practice. And when the electric bill comes in, ignore it and go practice some more. You should be able to weld passes on a piece of 1/2" plate to make it at least two inches thick before you take a break. lol
Practice really does make you closer to perfect.
David from jax

 

[California]

Thanks everyone! Lots of good input. I have a 230 amp AC welder. It's an old Montgomery Ward.

Like the one in this old thread? http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/related-topics/52820-wards-powr-kraft-230amp-stick.html#post595629

I went and bought some brand new 1/8" 6011 and 1/8" 7018 ... to see if it was the welder or the rod. The 6011 worked great....
I also have a bucket of rod that I got from an old farmer... Mostly now I just want to know what is going on.

Sounds like you and I are on the same path. First I found the old MW welder I showed in that thread, then I found 25 lbs of years-old 6011 for $5 so I just had to get that. The rod has been sitting behind the furnace for a year now so it's as dry as it's going to get.

This old 6011 works passable for rough repairs. Last weekend I reattached a stake on my trailer tailgate. .0625 (?) sheet to .750 round steel bar. It surprised me that it went together so well - but it's not so pretty that I'm going to post a picture!

This thing is hard to start an arc with. I don't know if that's design, old rod, or most likely user inexperience.

I too got a handful of unidentified old rod with the welder and couldn't do anything with it. I used a couple of them for cutting.

I've learned a lot reading this thread - thanks everyone!

 

[Soundguy]

I agree.. 6011 on ac if it is thick and or dirty.. or 6013 on ac if it is thinner and needs to look better.

occasionally a 6013 as tie passes on a 6011 bead.

Soundguy

I agree my go to rods are 6011 & 6013 I use the 6011 to just fix things were I could care less if the weld is pretty or if it is difficult to clean or older stuff, Mostly repair work so I can fix it and go. 6013 I use for building stuff, new things or if I want nice welds that look pretty under paint. I am by no means a great welder but I have found these rods work best for overall work around my equipment. Once the rod gets warm you can get a nice ark. Clean your lens and let your eyes see your work in your shield before you strike your ark. Weld hot as hot as you can without melting your stock away. Also don't run long beads, do an inch or 2 and go to the other end and then to the middle and then to the beginning again, make sure you chip your slag. This will keep your distortion down.