what on earth does electricity cost near you?

[ponytug]

Im thinking how a person views going electric and electric cars depends on large part the kWh cost in their area

I know I would see things differently if I was paying 10-12 cents vs. 34-41 cents...

Upfront: we have pricey gasoline, but then we have pricey power, so I think that the takeaway is true in most of the US.

Once I did the math on an EV per mile costs, I realized how much more expensive an internal combustion engine vehicle is than an EV.
E.g. a Prius with 50mpg and $6.70 gas is $0.134 per mile, plus the cost of routine maintenance (oil change, air filter, and the dreaded Prius PCV, etc.) Our plug in hybrid is $0.047/mile with electricity at $0.14/kWh.

YMMV...

All the best,

Peter

 

[Torvy]

Upfront: we have pricey gasoline, but then we have pricey power, so I think that the takeaway is true in most of the US.

Once I did the math on an EV per mile costs, I realized how much more expensive an internal combustion engine vehicle is than an EV.
E.g. a Prius with 50mpg and $6.70 gas is $0.134 per mile, plus the cost of routine maintenance (oil change, air filter, and the dreaded Prius PCV, etc.) Our plug in hybrid is $0.047/mile with electricity at $0.14/kWh.

YMMV...

All the best,

Peter

Our plug in hybrid is a Prius....wish it was the Rav4.

 

[Torvy]

@3930dave. Hydro can be great up there...have you see what has happened to Lake Mead behind Hoover Dam? Not enough water.

 

[ultrarunner]

Glad I kept the Corolla with 41 mpg...

The newer one is larger but 32-33 max.

One thing several around here did was buy e-books... they had friends with them zipping all around.

Those around here quickly learned 1-2 miles straight up very steep hills were too much for e-bikes bought and really zap the battery EV.

The EV owners found going downhill easy and running errands easy but no way were you going to make it home with more than enough miles range shown when the last two are vertical...

Heck... even my Model T's have problems... not with power but fuel starvation as the prolonged steep grade prevent gas from the tank to reach the carb.

The solution is drive up in reverse or add a fuel pump... both I have done.

 

[3930dave]

@3930dave. Hydro can be great up there...have you see what has happened to Lake Mead behind Hoover Dam? Not enough water.

I've only seen one pic, but that was enough.... Lake Mead looks to be on its way to a puddle Yikes ! Did they find Hoffa yet ?

Many parts of Canada have tremendous Hydro resources..... part of why I get irritated when that valuable resources is being sidelined/bypassed, for sketchy reasons.....

Rgds, D.

 

[3930dave]

Glad I kept the Corolla with 41 mpg...

The newer one is larger but 32-33 max.

One thing several around here did was buy e-books... they had friends with them zipping all around.

Those around here quickly learned 1-2 miles straight up very steep hills were too much for e-bikes bought and really zap the battery EV.

The EV owners found going downhill easy and running errands easy but no way were you going to make it home with more than enough miles range shown when the last two are vertical...

Heck... even my Model T's have problems... not with power but fuel starvation as the prolonged steep grade prevent gas from the tank to reach the carb.

The solution is drive up in reverse or add a fuel pump... both I have done.

I bought a E-bike this year. 20km to work one way, is about 20% of the pack, some days 15%, But:

A) While I deal with multiple hills (something like 200' total change), it's not your near vertical Fault stuff.....

B) I deliberately chose a big battery pack (48v , and IIRC, 19.2Ah).

C) I want the exercise, so I always pedal, sometimes with no assist.

Cheap e-bike, small battery, just sit on the throttle..... won't see much Range, esp. not high Vertical delta.....

if I hadn't gone e-bike this year, I was getting serious about tracking down a Honda or Yamaha scooter, 150cc range - won't do 100mph in 3 seconds (or at all....) but would have suited my commute, and would be about perfect for urban San Fran use..... IF you're mature enough to ride one . But.... I already have an MC license, and a larger go-fast bike.....

Rgds, D.

 

[dfkrug]

E.g. a Prius with 50mpg and $6.70 gas is $0.134 per mile, plus the cost of routine maintenance (oil change, air filter, and the dreaded Prius PCV, etc.) Our plug in hybrid is $0.047/mile with electricity at $0.14/kWh.

How do you pay only $0.14/KWh around here?

I am on Silicon Valley Green Energy (PG&E) 2-tiered TOU rate, and my next KWh is 40 cents. That puts EV cost per mile higher than my 55-60 mpg HEV ('21 Hyundai Ionic Blue). I use only 12 KWH/day, so if I started to use more power, then the rate could go over 40 cents. I have seen as high as 49cents/KWh. Last gas was $6.16/gal.

 

[ponytug]

How do you pay only $0.14/KWh around here?

I am on Silicon Valley Green Energy (PG&E) 2-tiered TOU rate, and my next KWh is 40 cents. That puts EV cost per mile higher than my 55-60 mpg HEV ('21 Hyundai Ionic Blue). I use only 12 KWH/day, so if I started to use more power, then the rate could go over 40 cents. I have seen as high as 49cents/KWh. Last gas was $6.16/gal.

You are right; I misremembered my off peak sell rate.
We have nearly the same provider and power costs;
SVCE(green) EV2A:
Summer peak is $0.45 mid-peak $0.27, off-peak $0.17,
winter is $0.60/$0.36/$0.16.
So, that cost to run an EV to $0.0536/mile. Using your gas price on a Prius getting 50mpg is $0.123, but don't forget the oil and filter change costs which are not insignificant. (Car Edge estimates a further $0.0425/mile in maintenance costs.)

We are a net energy producer every month nine and a half months out of the year, and an annual net producer of electricity due to a reduction in commuting. We use batteries to help us never consume peak power in the winter, and not to import power for nine months of the year. Though with the daily meter minimum charge a significant amount of power and still be net zero at the end of the year (as in 65 to 170% of our total power use. The electricity rate schedules with solar are accounting Ph.D. level complicated. The last time I was on the phone with the power company asking for a bill explanation, they admitted that neither the customer service representative that I was speaking with, nor his boss knew what the acronyms were on my bill, and what the charges were for most of the line items. Crazy.

All the best,

Peter

 

[ultrarunner]

You are right; I misremembered my off peak sell rate.
We have nearly the same provider and power costs;
SVCE(green) EV2A:
Summer peak is $0.45 mid-peak $0.27, off-peak $0.17,
winter is $0.60/$0.36/$0.16.
So, that cost to run an EV to $0.0536/mile. Using your gas price on a Prius getting 50mpg is $0.123, but don't forget the oil and filter change costs which are not insignificant. (Car Edge estimates a further $0.0425/mile in maintenance costs.)

We are a net energy producer every month nine and a half months out of the year, and an annual net producer of electricity due to a reduction in commuting. We use batteries to help us never consume peak power in the winter, and not to import power for nine months of the year. Though with the daily meter minimum charge a significant amount of power and still be net zero at the end of the year (as in 65 to 170% of our total power use. The electricity rate schedules with solar are accounting Ph.D. level complicated. The last time I was on the phone with the power company asking for a bill explanation, they admitted that neither the customer service representative that I was speaking with, nor his boss knew what the acronyms were on my bill, and what the charges were for most of the line items. Crazy.

All the best,

Peter

Same here… clueless on the monthly bill going out.

 

[3930dave]

Same here… clueless on the monthly bill going out.

Ya gotta admit..... Nice Work, if You can Get It !

I'm already sold, but maybe they are trying to convince other people to go off-grid ?

Rgds, D.

 

[ultrarunner]

My annual prove up check arrived in the mail today... $201.00

This is for excess generated electricity from my 6kW array flowing into the grid over the last 12 months.

As I didn't pay anything for the system and do no maintenance... not a bad deal and more than covers the monthly meter fee.

 

[M59]

Here is website to look up average electric rate by state and city and what each type of rate payer pays in USA. Commercial, Residential, Industrial.

Electricity Rates and Usage

Electricity rates and other resources for local areas throughout the U.S. Find out how your electricity rate compares to the rest of the nation.

www.electricitylocal.com

 

[LouNY]

Here is website to look up average electric rate by state and city and what each type of rate payer pays in USA. Commercial, Residential, Industrial.

Electricity Rates and Usage

Electricity rates and other resources for local areas throughout the U.S. Find out how your electricity rate compares to the rest of the nation.

www.electricitylocal.com

Very nice link,
Thanks

 

[dfkrug]

Here is website to look up average electric rate by state and city and what each type of rate payer pays in USA. Commercial, Residential, Industrial.

Electricity Rates and Usage

Electricity rates and other resources for local areas throughout the U.S. Find out how your electricity rate compares to the rest of the nation.

www.electricitylocal.com

What kinda crack are they smoking at that site? It says a bit over 15c/KWh for San Jose, CA. My bill is very complicated (e.g. generation is separated from delivery), but I paid $99 for a total of 343 KWh for the month. That comes out to be 29 cents ave for each KWh that month.

The next KWh I use would be 51.03 cents during peak hours, and 48.4 cents otherwise.

 

[ultrarunner]

^^^Yep… the only thing that matters is cost per kWh no matter how you slice it.

Here in Oakland with added city tax I have not been under 30 cents first tier for a long time…

 

[dfkrug]

^^^Yep… the only thing that matters is cost per kWh no matter how you slice it.

Here in Oakland with added city tax I have not been under 30 cents first tier for a long time…

To add to the complicated rates, PG&E has a "baseline quantity" that changes with the seasons. Currently, that is 15.4 KWh/day. I am steady at 11-12 KWh/day, which puts me inside the baseline for winter rates, but outside in the summer. That, plus the time-of-use variation in rates adds to the complication.

Once a year, I get a small Silicon Valley Green Energy credit, which reduces my bill for that month.

 

[3930dave]

To add to the complicated rates, PG&E has a "baseline quantity" that changes with the seasons. Currently, that is 15.4 KWh/day. I am steady at 11-12 KWh/day, which puts me inside the baseline for winter rates, but outside in the summer. That, plus the time-of-use variation in rates adds to the complication.

Option A: Get an Engineering Degree, then become a Certified Management Accountant.

Option B: Go off-grid.

I'm lazy, I'll go for option B.....

(Joking..... but not 100%....) Rgds, D.

 

[ultrarunner]

To add to the complicated rates, PG&E has a "baseline quantity" that changes with the seasons. Currently, that is 15.4 KWh/day. I am steady at 11-12 KWh/day, which puts me inside the baseline for winter rates, but outside in the summer. That, plus the time-of-use variation in rates adds to the complication.

Once a year, I get a small Silicon Valley Green Energy credit, which reduces my bill for that month.

Year round mom's averages 12 kWh per day... it was less but I now wash at her house most days...

 

[dfkrug]

Option A: Get an Engineering Degree...

Option B: Go off-grid.

Well, I have Option A covered, plus I have a BS in Physics. But I am surely not opposed to Option B, if the calculations make sense. If I had more sun, I can see a DIY PV-panel plus lithium battery solution. Dunno if I could power my welders, pumps, and plasma cutter if I go fully off-grid.

OTOH, my neighbors with the super-duper solar system should be using electric heat, and trade one of their cars for a true EV...maybe a Hyundai Ionic 5?

Famous guy once said, "I never let my schooling interfere with my education." I do spend an inordinate amount of time reading economics books....

 

[3930dave]

I believe that was Mr. Twain..... oft liked what he and Will Rogers had to say (education, books, electric fences..... ).....

Obvious trade-off is between alt power sources and generator size off-grid. Not suggesting heavy welding is trivial power-wise, but I recall more than one Homepower article where one of the windup comments was "could have gotten away with a smaller generator"....

In context though...... ^ those HPwr homestead projects, while extensive, weren't running double-digit tons of A/C ..... so not what some or many would want today....

Rgds, D.