Tired Ford 3000 engine......

Kaliburz · Apr 8, 2006

Today I gave all the model info off the tag to the parts people at the NH dealer (originally Ford). Told the parts person to price me a reman engine original application (same HP), then to find out if a 4000's will fit and then a later model.

I said I'd like to have between 50-55HP at the PTO, so I don't know what engine that would be. They're doing research so that I'll know options...... /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif Cylinder test will be hopefully this month. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Farmwithjunk · Apr 8, 2006

simple block heater does the trick with no machining required. I've got a switch (in the house) that controls recepticle wher heater is plugged in. Just flip the switch about 1/2 hour before needing it, and I've got a warm tractor ready to fire.

Soundguy · Apr 9, 2006

( The mechanic I did chat w/ who's serviced it said that Select-O-Speeds were installed in tractors up to 70HP. So in theory, the tranny should be able to handle the power. )

SOS were on tractors with higher than 70hp. Also.. each sos unit was built for it's class of machine. Just because you see a sos in a 70hp machine doesn't mean you can take one from a 48hp machine and smoke 70 hp thru it.. etc.

Soundguy

dgl24087 · Apr 9, 2006

Also, the rear axles on the 3000 series and 4000 series are entirely different, the 4000 has the planetary rears and wet disk brakes, the 3000 have the older style axles and shoe type brakes.

Kaliburz · Apr 13, 2006

( ( The mechanic I did chat w/ who's serviced it said that Select-O-Speeds were installed in tractors up to 70HP. So in theory, the tranny should be able to handle the power. )

SOS were on tractors with higher than 70hp. Also.. each sos unit was built for it's class of machine. Just because you see a sos in a 70hp machine doesn't mean you can take one from a 48hp machine and smoke 70 hp thru it.. etc.

Soundguy )

Oh joy.....so Ford took short cuts..... now you're making me wonder what SOS the spare one is from.

Well, as I said, I'm waiting to schedual the compression test this month. If I do swap out the old 3000 40HP engine out, it would to something not so "wild". I would like 50-55HP at the PTO, so I'm guessing the engine would be around 60HP? I told that to my NH parts person who's doing some research.

Any how, the SOS in this application ONLY moves the machine. There is no "heavy" pulling. I'm sure the PTO system can transmit the slightly higher HP. I'm sure the SOS in the 3000 and 4000 were similar since their respected class ratings were 10HP different....

The price of each option will determin which one I go with, IF the compression test shows the engine to be tired. The options I'm thinking-
A)factory rebuilt 3000 engine
B)factory rebuilt 4000 engine (3 cylinder one, not 4)
C)factory rebuilt from a "newer" tractor (repower old 3000) to a updated engine to give 50-55HP at PTO (maybe a 4610 engine, if I recall my model numbers).

This grape harvester came w/ two tractor options up top. The Ford 3000 was used on the early & later models 4000 and an International. I was told the IH was 60HP.

Soundguy · Apr 13, 2006

( Oh joy.....so Ford took short cuts..... now you're making me wonder what SOS the spare one is from )

Well.. that's not exactly waht I said. What I said was that not all sos trannies were bolt in replacements.. just like not all ford clutches and trannies were bolt in replacements. for instance.. if you had a ford with sos tranny and wanted to swap in a 5spd.. you'd have to do some pto section work onthe rear end.. IE.. it isn't a straight swap. Again.. if you had a 5spd and wanted a 5spd with 2 stage clutch.. it isn't just a clutch swap.. there are about 14-20 different parts in the 5spd made for the single stage clutch vs the 5spd made for the dual stage clutch... etc.

Good luck with whatever you find.
( by the way.. the 3cyl engines were a good unit.. event he gas ones.. as it was the same block.. thus the gas ones were 'way' tough.. compaired to the 4 cyl models.. )

Soundguy

Farmwithjunk · Apr 13, 2006

( ( by the way.. the 3cyl engines were a good unit.. event he gas ones.. as it was the same block.. thus the gas ones were 'way' tough.. compaired to the 4 cyl models.. )

Soundguy )

Tough? Like a $2 steak! But the 3-cylinders greatest quality was (is) it's incredable torque compared to the older 4 cylinder version. Whata stump-puller!

Kaliburz · Apr 13, 2006

Speaking of torque, what is the torque curve of the 3000? I mean, I don't even know what engine RPM get's the max PTO speed. The tach doesn't have anything marked "PTO" on it. And if did, not ther now (there was a big sticker on the dash, but all there is is an outline of one now....)

As I said, I'm a Deere person.... new to Fords.

It's up to the parts person to tell me what they found out on what will fit in there......

dgl24087 · Apr 13, 2006

PTO is rated at 2000 RPM, the only torque rating I can find is 122 ft-lbs. @ 1400 RPM.

Kaliburz · Apr 14, 2006

( PTO is rated at 2000 RPM, the only torque rating I can find is 122 ft-lbs. @ 1400 RPM. )

Dang, it's up there. Well, not as bad as Deere though... they have the engine speed up to 2000 RPM+ to get 540 in the back end.

Reading the "IT" manual I bought, I ran accross something that might be the issue. The manul talked about the "cold starting aid", a little thing that is screwed into the intake and bascially "burns" fuel in the intake to warm it up the air. The ignition is suppose to have a postion for it, BUT, it isn't the original key! The original is suppoe to have a "heat" and "heat start". And to make things more interesting, this little heater isn't even hooked up to anything, just a wire that ends.

Being the inquisitive person I am, I went to NH and asked the parts guy about it. Still available. I bought one, just incase. The mechanic that worked on it before said to test those, just jump a wire from the it to the battery. Take off the intake connector (connects intake and tube), watch for smoke, he said. It's a funny set up. The unit has a resievor mounted on the bulk head. The injector over flow and pump over flow go to this resivor, fills it and any extra returns to the tank. The bottom of the reservor is piped to the cold starting aid.

So, when I got home....I did as he said.... it smoked. So, like the book says....active for 10 seconds (I went 20 since I count fast) and turned her over /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif Guess what, she fired right over and it was about 47 degrees (cold day). Tomorrow morning I'm gonna go test it again (after she sits in the cold over night!) /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif (Hope tonight is cold!)

I was thinking of buying the original switch, but I decided to just that push button would work, just install it in the dash below the key. Hold in for 15 seconds and crank her over.....

I guess you learn something everyday..... /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif