Tiller tillers

Anonymous Poster · Mar 22, 2002

I am looking for a 48" tiller for my John Deere 650 tractor. I like the chain drive king kutter model (USA made) but the minimum HP requirement is listed at 20HP. Has anyone used this model tiller with under 20HP? Am I looking for trouble with this tiller and my 15HP tractor? Any comments on 48" Caroni ( listed range 15-40HP, chain drive) or 48" Sicma (kioti) tillers ( 20-35HP range, chain drive)
(Made in Italy)? All three are the same price with slip clutch ( $999)

Darren · Mar 22, 2002

I'm not familiar with your tractor but I talked to Kuhn about hp requirements. Kuhn is a French company that makes tillers from around 3' wide to over 15' wide. FWIW, even the 3' 5" model is speced as requiring 25hp.

Per Kuhn you can cheat on the hp requirements depending on the depth and the speed. If you have a hydrostatic transmission, you'll need to go very slow and not work at the greatest depth setting. You can till. It'll just take more time and several passes. If you have a gear transmission, you're probably going to be riding the clutch a lot. It might not work well enough to avoid a lot of frustration.

With a hydro, I'd try it. With a gear drive, you'd have to till a small increment of depth eachpass unless you had a creeper gear. It wouldn't be fun or fast. For perspective a 14hp walk behind tiller only does a swath about 42" wide.

RickM · Mar 22, 2002

I'm confused about <font color=blue>minimum HP requirement</font color=blue>. I have an old Befco 50" model and the manual says it's rated for 30 HP <font color=red>maximum</font color=red>. I thought gearboxes were rated for maximum not minimum. I can run that tiller behind my old B6100 all day. I think the HP of our tractors are about the same at 14.

JJT · Mar 22, 2002

I understand 5hp/foot of tiller width is the recommended minimum. I have 30PTO horses and a 6ft tiller, with heavy soil I'm glad I have HST, breaking new ground is slooooow. I've used the tiller in lighter soil and you really notice the difference.

What's the pto hp on the JD650? HST trans? 4wd? If you're in the high teens with HST you probably can get away with a 4' tiller. If you have a gear model, 2 wd and heavy soil, DON'T DO IT.

Darren · Mar 22, 2002

The max ratings are to absolve the manufacturer of liability when someone takes an implement and attaches it to a
to a tractor with more pto hp than the implement can handle. If there's no slip clutch in the drive line, you're running a good chance of destroying the implement gear box or breaking or bending something else if the implement ties into something too tough for the rated hp.

Something will pop and it won't be the tractor. Of course some manufacturers lowball the max hp rating to avoid warranty claims too. I know for a fact that Woods does that.

Min ratings on the other hand are to provide guidance on the amount of power required for satisfactory performance.

Steve_in_Ont · Mar 22, 2002

Even if you have a gear transmission... I hear that there is a trick... but it only works for tillers that turn in the direction that will tend to push the tractor forward...

Drive the tractor & tiller where you want to start tilling... place the tractor transmission into neutral... engage the PTO... Lower the tiller, and limit the speed of the tractor with the service brakes...

I have not tried this trick, but I hear that it works.

By using the above method (or by going really slow with hydrostatics or a creaper gear) I would think that any tractor could handle a tiller that exceeds it's "rated" capacity (naturally, there would be a limit somewhere).

One limiting issue might be the strength of the 3pt to lift the weight...

Good luck!

Chuck52 · Mar 23, 2002

Steve,

I run a 60" KK tiller with my L210. I had read the tiller would push the tractor this way, but mine just sat there. On the other hand, in low gear/low range, I can till pretty well anything I have on my property. My dirt is deep black, with clay down there somewhere. If I run at deepest setting in the garden, I will sometimes have to lift the tiller with the 3ph to get traction. I've tilled new sod by doing several passes at the middle depth setting. Takes maybe 4-5 passes to dig it in well. Reading all this about minimum hp makes me wonder if my old L210 may be under-rated hp wise. I do need more weight in front because the 700lb KK almost levitates the front end....right now I just don't run far with it lifted, and fortunately have only slight slopes to go up! It also helps that the lift points on the L210 seem to be closer to the tractor than on some newer models. A neighbor wanted to borrow the tiller to use with his 25hp Cub, but I'd had to cut the pto shaft and it was too short for his tractor.

Chuck

Anonymous Poster · Mar 23, 2002

I had a 650 mfwd with a 365 front blade and it pulled a ford 54" tiller good if it was hard packed soil i went over it a couple of times but the 650 shure turned ot good.

Titanic · Mar 25, 2002

MPNE ,You may find that the KK 48" tiller doesn't till exactly 48" .E-mail KK from thier web page and ask them if this is overall width or tilling width.