Buying Advice Overwhelmed by options

akroeze · Jul 2, 2014

Hi All,

So a bit about our situation. My wife and I recently took the plunge! We have recently purchased a 23 acre property with an eye towards homesteading. We have grand dreams of an orchard and a decent sized garden (possibly enough for a stand at our local farmer's market). Right now we have mostly wooded area (scrub brush/cedar) with 2 x 1 acre (give or take) former pastures that we will be turning into our first orchard/garden. We need a good tractor to do all of the chores surrounding this homestead such as breaking virgin ground, tilling, hilling, post hole augering, snow clearing, clearing land (I could hire someone to do it but I want to do as much as I can myself and just have them do the "really hard" stuff) and just general day to day tasks. I even have the grandiose future plans of "tractor for hire" income as well (but that isn't a primary focus of this purchase).

My experience with tractors? A JD X300 that we currently own... so none! I will continue to use this X300 for the lawn mowing, so a tractor would not need to have that mid-mount PTO option.

I have been doing lots of research as I like to over analyze things to the point of information overload/paralysis and I think I'm sufficiently overloaded so I'm now seeking your help. I think from what I can tell I would be best suited by a tractor in the 30-40HP range but correct me if I am wrong. To that end I have been talking with a few local dealers and have been given the following recommendations at different points:

-JD 2032R
-JD 3033R
-JD 3039R
-Kubota L3301HST
-Kubota L3901HST
-Kubota L3560HST
-Kubota B3350HSD (what is the difference between this and the SUHSD??)
-Kioti CK35HST (how is this one so much heavier than those in it's class?)

All of the dealers said the heavier the tractor the better (within reason) so from that logic I should go with the Kioti!

Thoughts? Input? Questions?

I haven't made it to the Massey dealer yet.

Farming5 · Jul 2, 2014

First of all I wouldn't be dropping 20k on a brand new 40hp tractor. I recommend you look at an older tractor with a loader on it. An old tractor with 40hp will do the same thing as a new tractor with 40hp. I farm 400 acres but all of my tractors were made before the 21st century and they get the job done well.

grm61 · Jul 2, 2014

Thoughts? Input? Questions?

Yes jump up one cog..go with a 40 to 50 horse tractor, the jump to the 40 horse frame size get you a lot more capability and stability and over twice the lift capacity for a couple grand.
I'm a slow typer so I am going to just copy paste my reply to another post. Take a look at the DK series kioti before they are gone.

Guys are paying 21 to 23 for a Kioti DK 40 HST 4WD...They are feature rich, rear remote standard, telescoping rear links standard, skid steer quick attach bucket standard, draft control standard, independent pto, cruise control, tilt wheel, cupholders etc...And don't forget 2761 lbs of lift to full height...107.8 inches.
The DKS are tier 3, they have been replaced by the NX series tier 4.
There are still DKs left, but not for long, once they are gone thats it, the DKs come in 40, 45, and 50 horse. the tractors are the same, just different motors.

This has been the sweet spot from Kioti, and one of the best tractor values out there for what you get for you money IMO.

Good Luck

akroeze · Jul 2, 2014

Farming5 said:
First of all I wouldn't be dropping 20k on a brand new 40hp tractor. I recommend you look at an older tractor with a loader on it. An old tractor with 40hp will do the same thing as a new tractor with 40hp. I farm 400 acres but all of my tractors were made before the 21st century and they get the job done well.

One of my concerns about the used market is that I am not overly mechanically inclined. That is going to be part of this learning process, we are taking a "learn by doing" approach to things. So my thought was if I get a new tractor I SHOULD have some grace period before I need to start repairing it. Smartest move ever? Maybe not...

I'm not totally opposed to used, just not an old beat up tractor that is going to need lots of love.

grm61 said:
Yes jump up one cog..go with a 40 to 50 horse tractor, the jump to the 40 horse frame size get you a lot more capability and stability and over twice the lift capacity for a couple grand.
I'm a slow typer so I am going to just copy paste my reply to another post. Take a look at the DK series kioti before they are gone.

Guys are paying 21 to 23 for a Kioti DK 40 HST 4WD...They are feature rich, rear remote standard, telescoping rear links standard, skid steer quick attach bucket standard, draft control standard, independent pto, cruise control, tilt wheel, cupholders etc...And don't forget 2761 lbs of lift to full height...107.8 inches.
The DKS are tier 3, they have been replaced by the NX series tier 4.
There are still DKs left, but not for long, once they are gone thats it, the DKs come in 40, 45, and 50 horse. the tractors are the same, just different motors.

This has been the sweet spot from Kioti, and one of the best tractor values out there for what you get for you money IMO.

Good Luck

The local dealer said he can't get a DK (that was one of my top choices). Maybe I'll start contacting other dealers further out...

Farming5 · Jul 2, 2014

Even though you aren't very good in mechanics you can still fix little things. My uncle started farming our family farm, which he hasn't been too since he was a kid, a while ago and didn't know much about mechanics. But he bought the JD 4430 that we still have today. He learned most of the mechanics from the neighboring farm, the local dealership and manuals. Also the spare parts for older tractors will be cheaper than newer parts. My point is a tractor from the 80's or 90's will be overall cheaper than a brand new tractor.

akroeze · Jul 3, 2014

I suppose if I keep my eye out I could use the money saved by not buying new to "splurge" on getting a cab tractor (if one becomes available). I had decided that it was too expensive new, but possibly used...

GManBart · Jul 3, 2014

Farming5 said:
Even though you aren't very good in mechanics you can still fix little things. My uncle started farming our family farm, which he hasn't been too since he was a kid, a while ago and didn't know much about mechanics. But he bought the JD 4430 that we still have today. He learned most of the mechanics from the neighboring farm, the local dealership and manuals. Also the spare parts for older tractors will be cheaper than newer parts. My point is a tractor from the 80's or 90's will be overall cheaper than a brand new tractor.

If someone isn't very experienced with mechanical stuff, and has zero experience with tractors, telling them to buy a tractor that is 20+ years old isn't very helpful. Just how do you expect them to buy one in good condition? How are they going to know what to look for? Who's going to point out the weak points, or more common wear items, of any particular machine? How will they know what a fair price is? The list of questions like that could go on and on.

With a new tractor they get a couple of years to learn how things work, don't have to worry about parts availability, and can spend the time left over working on their property, not their tractor.

Farming5 · Jul 3, 2014

I guess it just is his budget. If he has the money to buy a brand new tractor than I guess he should. I am just thinking if he just bought 23 acres and will have to buy a mower, post driver and other equipment I wouldn't want to be spending 20k on a tractor. I just don't think the amount of money he will spend on the tractor won't be paid off by a 23 acre farm in the next few years and you don't want to have any sort of debt when even doing small farming.

grm61 · Jul 3, 2014

The local dealer said he can't get a DK (that was one of my top choices). Maybe I'll start contacting other dealers further out...

Yes, call around, you can still get one:thumbsup:

jeff9366 · Jul 3, 2014

Following LINK is to threads from the T-B-N archive which my be helpful.

LINK:

https://www.google.com/search?clien...tractorbynet.com&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&gws_rd=ssl

jeff9366 · Jul 3, 2014

Are you retired so this project will be supplemental income, or does this plan replace a day job so it is 'make or break'?

MinnesotaEric · Jul 3, 2014

I was just at Elite Lift today in Minnesota and they have 2 cab on DXs on their lot still. I wanna say they were a 45 hp and 50 hp.

Jim is the owner, you may want to give him a jungle. 763-421-9081

paulfun9 · Jul 3, 2014

akroeze said:
The local dealer said he can't get a DK (that was one of my top choices). Maybe I'll start contacting other dealers further out...

I agree with stepping up to the DK40 or even 45 Its a solid machine and very capable!

akroeze · Jul 3, 2014

jeff9366 said:
Following LINK is to threads from the T-B-N archive which my be helpful.

LINK:

https://www.google.com/search?clien...tractorbynet.com&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&gws_rd=ssl

Thanks, will be looking through some of those.

EricTheOracle said:
I was just at Elite Lift today in Minnesota and they have 2 cab on DXs on their lot still. I wanna say they were a 45 hp and 50 hp.

Jim is the owner, you may want to give him a jungle. 763-421-9081

Unfortunately I am in Ontario, Canada so that is a bit far away.

So I guess the general consensus is that I'm "aiming too low" with a 30-40? My concern is that I don't want "too much" tractor.

I still haven't made a final decision on the new/used front, just a used one would have to be pretty new I think.

akroeze · Jul 3, 2014

jeff9366 said:
Are you retired so this project will be supplemental income, or does this plan replace a day job so it is 'make or break'?

Neither, we are both young (late 20s/early 30s) looking at this as a "serious hobby"/supplemental income to our regular jobs (we are both shift workers, not 9-5 mon-fri). When it comes down to it, if it is just break even I'm happy because we would be sustaining ourselves from a food perspective at a break even point (so in the end, money saved and that would be our "income") but naturally I'd love a bit of extra cash out of it.

flusher · Jul 3, 2014

akroeze said:
One of my concerns about the used market is that I am not overly mechanically inclined. That is going to be part of this learning process, we are taking a "learn by doing" approach to things. So my thought was if I get a new tractor I SHOULD have some grace period before I need to start repairing it. Smartest move ever? Maybe not...

I'm not totally opposed to used, just not an old beat up tractor that is going to need lots of love.

The local dealer said he can't get a DK (that was one of my top choices). Maybe I'll start contacting other dealers further out...

Get a new tractor with the best warranty and financing deal.

Forget about used tractors. I have a half dozen of these around my place and they are great if you want to improve your skills as a tractor mechanic.

To get your chores done, zero in on tractors in the 40 hp (pto) range with hydrostatic tranny, front end loader (FEL) with a 5-ft wide bucket and the skid steer quick attach option, dual rear remote hydraulic couplings. I'd choose R1 ag tires.

Good luck.

Gary Fowler · Jul 3, 2014

I also wouldn't suggest used. You don't get a good deal on them till they are 10-20 years old and by then, you can look to be replacing parts regularly. Newer used that are less than 5 years old are almost always nearly the same price as new, many times asking as much or more than they cost new when bought. The funny thing is many of them are getting those prices so negotiating a better price is not to great either. If you have a good credit line, you can get 0% financing on most new tractors which is worth a few thousand over new that would be 5-10% or more to finance. You can also roll all of your equipment purchased at the time of sale into the 0% finance so that is also worth some bucks.

Don't forget to price some of the LS tractors. There should be some dealers nearby and they are generally a few thousand less than all the other brands and have better warranty than most others especially the Kubota with 1 year vs a 5 year engine/powertrain on the LS and I think 2 year bumper to bumper warranty. And they come with standard options that most other brands charge for like 2 rear remotes, telescopic lower 3 PH links.

akroeze · Jul 3, 2014

Gary Fowler said:
I also wouldn't suggest used. You don't get a good deal on them till they are 10-20 years old and by then, you can look to be replacing parts regularly. Newer used that are less than 5 years old are almost always nearly the same price as new, many times asking as much or more than they cost new when bought. The funny thing is many of them are getting those prices so negotiating a better price is not to great either. If you have a good credit line, you can get 0% financing on most new tractors which is worth a few thousand over new that would be 5-10% or more to finance. You can also roll all of your equipment purchased at the time of sale into the 0% finance so that is also worth some bucks.

Don't forget to price some of the LS tractors. There should be some dealers nearby and they are generally a few thousand less than all the other brands and have better warranty than most others especially the Kubota with 1 year vs a 5 year engine/powertrain on the LS and I think 2 year bumper to bumper warranty. And they come with standard options that most other brands charge for like 2 rear remotes, telescopic lower 3 PH links.

What does the LS line offer over the standard L line? Their site isn't very clear on what you get for your $4-5k more.

grm61 · Jul 3, 2014

So I guess the general consensus is that I'm "aiming too low" with a 30-40? My concern is that I don't want "too much" tractor.

I don't know what you mean by "too much" tractor?

Many\most folks when buying their first tractor, settle on the 30-35 horse frame size, they see it as a step up from the "small" scuts, and it is, however for a couple grand more, moving to the 40-50 literally twice the tractor as far as lift capacity and stability (safety).

Myself, I find the 30-35 horse machines narrow and tippy, and with R4s, most in that HP range run the 15-19.5 drive tire which is wide, with a very flat profile, which makes for crappy traction on a fairly light tractor.

All I can tell you is the difference is night and day stepping up to the 40-50 horse frame size when it comes time to get some work done.