Octane

[Mark Page]

I was on the Husky site today and they strongly urge the use of 89 octane fuel in all their small engines. Although they didn't come right out and say so, I got the impression that the higher grade fuel was capable of keeping the alcohol supended longer and that shaking the gas cans now and again would also help.
I searched around a bit and learned that some Premium fuel (92+ octane) dosen't contain ethanol.
I think that one way or another I'm going to start using premium gas in my small engines.
Hey with premium gas I can bump back the timing, put higher compression pistons in, maybe go with a HE Ignition System and maybe headers and an intake.

 

[piller]

We have a few local stations that sell 100% gasoline, no ethanol, so I buy premium 100% gas for my chainsaws and such.

 

[arlen4720]

We have a few local stations that sell 100% gasoline, no ethanol, so I buy premium 100% gas for my chainsaws and such.

Around here (Minnesota) many BP stations carry "non Oxy" premium. It doesn't have ethanol. That's what I put in everything but my car.

 

[Steave]

I live in GA and I think all stations have to sell ethanol. I thought it was some kinda law or something. I'll have to check into it as I'd rather use straight gasoline.

 

[arlen4720]

I live in GA and I think all stations have to sell ethanol. I thought it was some kinda law or something. I'll have to check into it as I'd rather use straight gasoline.

It's the law here in MN also, but there is an exception for small engines and "classic" vehicles.

 

[SPYDERLK]

I live in GA and I think all stations have to sell ethanol. I thought it was some kinda law or something. I'll have to check into it as I'd rather use straight gasoline.

Hopefully this marginal environmental ploy and laws supporting it will go away with this years corn shortage. But then ... thats not politics. :confused3:
larry

 

[sailorman]

I use 89 octane non-ethanol in my stilh chain saw . Tried 87 ethanol gas once . Chain saw ran rough and hot

 

[bcjmmac]

From what I've read, you shouldn't use gasoline containing ethanol in any 2/4 stroke engine as the alcohol can cause extensive corrosion. As such, I started using premium gas in my lawn mover, chain saw, etc, since that is the only grade that is guaranteed not to have ethanol in it.
My brother is a mechanic & he recommends mid-premium grade for our car as well. He has been told that gas with ethanol gives 5-10% less gas mileage than straight gas with the same octane rating.

 

[bigdad]

I always used Shell 93 Octane for small engines etc then they started putting Ethanol in it. Rather hard to find non-Ethanol gas in my area. I support Ethanol production as many of my friends and neighbors are producers, but I don't like the repairs etc.

A small engine mechanic told me that the ethanol breaks down the plastics in fuel pumps etc.

From what I've read, you shouldn't use gasoline containing ethanol in any 2/4 stroke engine as the alcohol can cause extensive corrosion. As such, I started using premium gas in my lawn mover, chain saw, etc, since that is the only grade that is guaranteed not to have ethanol in it.
My brother is a mechanic & he recommends mid-premium grade for our car as well. He has been told that gas with ethanol gives 5-10% less gas mileage than straight gas with the same octane rating.

 

[masscity]

Either my Husky chainsaw or weedwacker requires mid grade, but my Champion 3500/4000 generator said do not use high octane gas.

I buy mid grade for everything, but my Chevy pickup.

 

[CurlyDave]

Around here, there are two stations which sell non-ethanol premium. It is at least $1/gallon higher than premium with alcohol.

I use it in all my chain saws, generators, and other small engines. I just bought some yesterday. I put a double dose of Stabil in it (put the Stabil in before you fill the can and no mixing is required) and put the date I bought it on the can. It will last at least two years without gumming up, which means I can shut off a small engine without draining the tank.

 

[LouieJunior]

Isn't Stabil alcohol?

 

[Mark Page]

High octane fuel burns slower than regular grade fuels. Could this cause an engine to run cooler? This could really matter in small air cooled engines, especialy 2 strokes.
Anyone remember the 101 Octane leaded Sunoco. I used to run it in my 396/375 Camaro. You could get a seat of the pants difference by just advancing the timing without any pinging. As I recall it was about 40 cents.
I'd give my eye teeth to have that car back.

 

[LWG]

Find an airport and buy 100LL gas. It's dyed blue, so be careful to label the containers you've mixed with two stroke oil. It has no alcohol, and will remain stable without additives for at least a year. Many small airplanes fly only a few times a year, so if the fuel degraded like mogas, there wouldn't be any pilots left in short order. I've been using in all my two and four stroke engines. No seal deterioration and so ruined carburetors.

 

[kensnelling]

Around here, there are two stations which sell non-ethanol premium. It is at least $1/gallon higher than premium with alcohol.

Wow, we have it better around here. For comprable grades of E-10 fuel to straight gas we only pay 15-20 cents more for gas. And for everyone that thinks that 93 octane fuel is all alchohol free, double check your state regulations. Some states do mandate that all grades of gas be cut with ethanol.

Ken

 

[Qapla]

... Some states do mandate that all grades of gas be cut with ethanol.

Florida has all pumps posted with signage that specifies that ALL grades have Ethanol added.

Fortunately, that does not apply to Diesel, so the tractor is safe.

 

[CurlyDave]

Isn't Stabil alcohol?

The bottle says it is petroleum distillates, which is not alcohol.

 

[MHarryE]

Why is everybody so against ethanol and our corn farmers? All of my latest small engine purchases state gasoline with no more than 10% alcohol. I believe it was a mistake when the mandate went in to use ethanol in gasoline, but we now have to live with it. All of the stations in our small Minnesota town have non-alcohol premium for use only in classic cars, small engines, and off highway - but yesterday it was 40 cents higher than unleaded regular. Sure, unleaded premium with 10% ethanol reduces fuel economy because ethanol does not contain the heat content of gasoline. It is a debate as to whether ethanol costs more to produce than the fuel used to produce the corn crop. This year there is no doubt - ethanol is a lose - lose except if you are a corn farmer. Then it is a big winner. I grown canola which will go into either cooking oil or bio-diesel. Thank you for your support. Actually after windrowing canola today I believe that the majority of my crop has gone into venison.

 

[kensnelling]

Why is everybody so against ethanol and our corn farmers? All of my latest small engine purchases state gasoline with no more than 10% alcohol. I believe it was a mistake when the mandate went in to use ethanol in gasoline, but we now have to live with it. All of the stations in our small Minnesota town have non-alcohol premium for use only in classic cars, small engines, and off highway - but yesterday it was 40 cents higher than unleaded regular. Sure, unleaded premium with 10% ethanol reduces fuel economy because ethanol does not contain the heat content of gasoline. It is a debate as to whether ethanol costs more to produce than the fuel used to produce the corn crop. This year there is no doubt - ethanol is a lose - lose except if you are a corn farmer. Then it is a big winner. I grown canola which will go into either cooking oil or bio-diesel. Thank you for your support. Actually after windrowing canola today I believe that the majority of my crop has gone into venison.

I for one never stated I was against ethanol or farmers who try to grow corn. Down here we are having extreme drought conditions, and I have seen several fields where the corn isn't worth harvesting. Don't know yet how that will turn out for the farmers.

As you stated in your post, E-10 fuel versus straight gas does reduce fuel economy. My daughter's Caravan is a flex-fuel vehicle, and the first time she ran it on E-85 she lost almost 45% fuel mileage compared to straight gasoline. On my truck and the wife's Jeep we lose 10% fuel economy with E-10, and on my bike I lose 15% if I use E-10 in it. When you take the price of each fuel and break it down into cost per mile it actually (on average) costs me 2-3 cents more per mile to use E-10 fuel. That doesn't include the subsidies paid by the federal government to the ethanol producers and to the growers. That is an amount I personally am unable to accuratly determine per gallon, but make no mistake, I am paying for it with my taxes.

So now, yes I have stated SOME of ny reasons I am against ethanol when it is used to help make a motor fuel. It was forced upon us as a way of cutting our usage of gasoline, but the reality is we are actually using more gas when ethonal is added.

And yes, I do feel fortunate to life in a state where we can still decide for ourselves what we feel is better to use as opposed to some bueracrat once again deciding they know what is best for us.

Ken

 

[swines]

None of the gas stations where I live have gasoline without ethanol, including premium gasoline. If I wanted gas without ethanol I'd have to drive 20 miles to an airport or 25 miles to an auto speed shop that handles Torco racing fuel. Instead, I buy premium gas, add an octane booster to it, Sta-Bil ethanol treatment, and Sea Foam Motor Treatment. The motors all run better on that mixture and I have no problems with gumming or stale fuel.

The problem with ethanol in fuel is that it will combine with the humidity in the air and you get water in the gasoline. If the gas is in an automobile, it's not much of problem if you drive the vehicle daily as the fuel is refreshed each time you fill up. This doesn't happen with small engine fuel as a lot of people, like me, buy a 5 gallon can of fuel and it sits for 2 months as it is used up fueling various pieces of power equipment.

The other problem with gasoline / ethanol mixture is that it has less energy per gallon - which is the reason automobiles get worse mileage on gasoline with ethanol. In most places, the ethanol is added to reduce carbon monoxide as a substitute for methyl tert-butyl ether (MTBE). MTBE raises the octane level, oxygenates the gas, doesn't affect mileage, and is less expensive than ethanol. Unfortunately, because of leaking underground gasoline tanks, MTBE has been found in ground water which is one of the reasons for legislation favoring ethanol as a gasoline additive.