need advice on tractor needs

[rstipp]

My wife and I have just purchased an 18 acre place with rolling hills in the Ozarks, with 3 inches of soil then rocks and clay. We have a very nice barn and the setting of the home is back from the road several hundred feet on a blacktop lane. The farm is in grass and the former owner had hay taken off it except the yard with a rail fence around the house. We would like to keep the fields bush-hogged, put in a vegetable garden, and deal with several trees with limb damage from previous ice storms. Also, we have snow and so that means being able to clear the lane to the road in front of the place. We both work and have limited time to deal with the maintenance. We can spend up to $20k to $25k. Thinking about pulling a 6 ft. bush hog, having a front end loader, box blade, and a tiller for the garden. I am asking for advice on what to buy. I am not inclined to do any mechanical work on equipment. Any suggestions?

 

[Egon]

You have made it quite easy. Just start going around to the different dealers looking and sitting!

 

[newbury]

I am not inclined to do any mechanical work on equipment. Any suggestions?

Find the closest dealers of Deere, Bobcat, Kioti, Kubota, MF.
Visit them AND their service depts. Ask the local tractors owners and buy whatever your money can from the best dealer. Despite our "color wars" they are all pretty much the same.

 

[bp fick]

What Egon and Newbury said.

 

[rstipp]

what do you think of Mahindra? What about gas versus diesel?

 

[bp fick]

Mahindra is not in the "top 3", but most posters here, who have them, swear by them, frankly.

Oh, a final piece of advice, and it is only as good as free advice always is, but .....

Buy the Dealer!!! The top 6 "brands" or "colors" of tractors are all excellent products. Really. We all have our personal choices, just look at our avatars or lists of equipment owned. But... again.. Buy the dealer. Find a good, solid, reputable, well endorsed by local guys and gals, and then study the product. You will be just fine. And... it's a blast!

 

[bp fick]

Oh, btw, you won't be buying any gas tractor. You just won't be.

 

[Steve C]

My wife and I have just purchased an 18 acre place with rolling hills in the Ozarks, with 3 inches of soil then rocks and clay. We have a very nice barn and the setting of the home is back from the road several hundred feet on a blacktop lane. The farm is in grass and the former owner had hay taken off it except the yard with a rail fence around the house. We would like to keep the fields bush-hogged, put in a vegetable garden, and deal with several trees with limb damage from previous ice storms. Also, we have snow and so that means being able to clear the lane to the road in front of the place. We both work and have limited time to deal with the maintenance. We can spend up to $20k to $25k. Thinking about pulling a 6 ft. bush hog, having a front end loader, box blade, and a tiller for the garden. I am asking for advice on what to buy. I am not inclined to do any mechanical work on equipment. Any suggestions?

Invest the 25k wisely and manage a 10% R.O.I. take the $2500 and pay your neighbors who already own the proper equipment and have years of experience using it to do the tasks you would use the tractor for. It is a win/win situation. The fact that you are not inclined to do any mechanical work on equipment means that any little thing that goes wrong you will have to truck it back to have it fixed. That and the general maintenance, greasing oil changes and such will also add a yearly cost to own the equipment along with the time and trouble of getting it back and forth to the service department. The brush hog and tiller will require at least minimal maintenance and the box blade will need painting every once in a while. You will also need something to push snow with, the FEL is not the greatest thing for that task. That will add to the overall cost. Get yourself a nice rear tine walk behind tiller for the garden maintenance and a chain saw and ladder for the trees. Continue to have the hay cut off on shares instead of just mowing it down and letting it go to waste and use the money from the hay to pay for the tiller and chain saw. But if you still think you want/need a tractor I would suggest that you buy it from the closest dealer with a great service department and expect to go there every once in a while.

Your tractor will lose value over time and will have an anual cost of maintenance. If you take the depreciation and anual maintenance cost and add it to the lost ROI from actually buying the thing you might be suprised at how much it actually cost to own one.

But it still might be worth it for the entertainment value of just being able to push dirt around. Mine is but because I got it and all my implements used I have only around 5K in mine and I plan on doing all the repairs myself keeping the repair cost to a minimum. Most guys who own tractors and implements own welders and enjoy or at least know how to use them. Things will break and need to be put back together every once in a while. If you have to pay to have this done it can get expensive.

You should also consider the hazards of doing the work yourself. In Hillsdale Michigan the owner of our local grocery store chain "The Market House" was killed when his brush hog fell on him. This man owned a multi million dollar Estate and stable property near Jonesville Michigan. His horse barn alone was worth more than every house I ever owned combined. It is a shame that he is not around to enjoy it. He obviously was a very smart man and was rewarded for his hard work with great success. If he had been more mechanically inclined perhaps he would have recognized the hazard that he exposed himself to by trusting the 3 point lift to hold up the brush hog while he went under it to fix a problem. A $10 jack stand could have saved his life if he had been carrying one in his tool box.

I love my little tractor even though I don't have everything for it yet, but I worked on a farm while growing up and have learned the dangers of playing with powerful heavy equipment. If I didn't want to do any mechanical work I wouldn't own it. The danger and the cost would outweigh the benefit. It is just something to consider. Tractors can be a lot of fun and give you a great feeling of accomplishment but they can also put you in a world of hurt in an instant.

O.K. I know this isn't the response you would expect from a tractor forum member but you have to look at the big picture and all the reasons to own one. Since I only have 11 acres split into 2 parcels I have come to realize that I don't really "need" a tractor so I own mine for entertainment and have alloted a reasonable value for that purpose. Just something to think about.

 

[flusher]

My wife and I have just purchased an 18 acre place with rolling hills in the Ozarks, with 3 inches of soil then rocks and clay. We have a very nice barn and the setting of the home is back from the road several hundred feet on a blacktop lane. The farm is in grass and the former owner had hay taken off it except the yard with a rail fence around the house. We would like to keep the fields bush-hogged, put in a vegetable garden, and deal with several trees with limb damage from previous ice storms. Also, we have snow and so that means being able to clear the lane to the road in front of the place. We both work and have limited time to deal with the maintenance. We can spend up to $20k to $25k. Thinking about pulling a 6 ft. bush hog, having a front end loader, box blade, and a tiller for the garden. I am asking for advice on what to buy. I am not inclined to do any mechanical work on equipment. Any suggestions?

Tractor: diesel, 30-40 hp (pto), 4WD, hydrostatic transmission, power steering, category 1 3pt hitch, 2 or 3 pairs of remote hydraulic fittings on rear

FEL: 5-ft wide bucket, skid steer quick attach option, dealer welds grab hooks and D-ring chain hook on bucket

Any of the major tractor dealers will have models with this configuration.

 

[bp fick]

I am not inclined to do any mechanical work on equipment.

Perhaps the OP could help define what was meant by that statement.

I heard that as "I don't want to wish to fix old stuff"

Steve C, you seem to have heard that as "I am not inclined to do mechanical things"

Perhaps the original poster will clarify.

 

[Steve C]

Perhaps the OP could help define what was meant by that statement.

I heard that as "I don't want to wish to fix old stuff"

Steve C, you seem to have heard that as "I am not inclined to do mechanical things"

Perhaps the original poster will clarify.

Fred
That is a very good observation. I know degreed mechanical engineers who can't bring themselves to change a spark plug in a lawn mower either because they don't know how or can't be bothered, and I also know some good old boy's who can't even read who won't hesitate to rebuild an entire machine, tractor, motorcycle or truck even if they haven't seen one like it before and are smart enough to ask for help with the areas that they don't understand. You are right the definition of I am not inclined to do mechanical things is not well defined and is pivotal to answering the origional question.

 

[mjncad]

I'm guessing the OP's comment about not being mechanically inclined to mean he is leaning towards new so as to have a warranty and hopefully less chance something breaking.

But as others wisely said, the OP should clarify his statement to get the best advice.

 

[newbury]

Oh and note - Bobcat tractors are white Kioti's.

 

[MarkV]

Welcome Rstipp to the forum and congratulations on the new property. If you are interested in buying new, which your budget will handle, I would not be too worried about the mechanical end of things. I have one Kubota that is 11 years old without having to go to the shop and another that is 4 years old and trouble free.

Sounds like mowing pasture will be your biggest use. The rule of thumb is 5 PTO hp per foot of mower. I agree that you will want a 6 mower which puts in the 35 hp tractor range. The other implements and task you list can easily be handled by that size tractor. The only thing I question is the boxblade. They are great for grading soil but it does not sound like you have plans for much of that. A rear blade may be a better choice for dealing with snow. With your hills consider having a dealer add liquid ballast to the rear tires. It lowers the center of gravity and will make the tractor more stable and safe on hill sides.

I agree that you should shop dealers in the area, sit on a few tractors and see what feels right to you. There are some good deals right now.

MarkV

 

[IslandTractor]

Invest the 25k wisely and manage a 10% R.O.I. take the $2500 and pay your neighbors who already own the proper equipment and have years of experience using it to do the tasks you would use the tractor for. It is a win/win situation. .

Please let us know how to get a 10% ROI average without being part of an early Ponzi scheme. I agree that paying for services is an option for the OP but would imagine he will need a much greater "nest egg" to pay for such services. I agree with your estimate of $2500/yr for mowing, snow removal and some occasional brush clean up/tree work but I haven't seen such optimistic figures for ROI since Bernie Madoff was thrown in the slammer.

Investing 25K in a new or slightly used tractor and implements would likely be the best way to get a 10% ROI for someone in the OP's position.

 

[newbury]

Also, we have snow and so that means being able to clear the lane to the road in front of the place. We both work and have limited time to deal with the maintenance. We can spend up to $20k to $25k. Thinking about pulling a 6 ft. bush hog, having a front end loader, box blade, and a tiller for the garden. I am asking for advice on what to buy. I am not inclined to do any mechanical work on equipment. Any suggestions?

Critical Parameters:
spend up to $20k to $25k.
"I am not inclined to do any mechanical work on equipment" - means new or darn near
6 ft. bush hog - forces about 30+HP tractor, plus $1,000?
front end loader
box blade - about $500 plus
tiller - $2,500

To get all this new (basic Kubota B7800/B3200) would be about $20K. For snow - if you want a front mounted snowblower add another $2K to 3K.

For Kioti or Bobcat probably less.

Whoops - forgot - add about $25 for the first fill up

 

[miserymule]

I have been "tractoring" for 10 years with 40 acres. Mostly I mow, till, plow snow, grade a long gravel driveway, bush hog, and look for opportunities to move stuff around with machinery. I have owned a 20 hp JD diesel and an 80 hp JD. I am in the process of moving to one 26 hp JD (2520). The biggest tractor was too big (maneuverability issues) for some things, but it was a champ at driveway grading and bush hogging, and I just felt like Superman driving it. I used it once to pull a large truck full of roofing material out of mud (the tractor didn't even grunt).

I am a big fan of hydrostatic transmission tractors (which the big one wasn't), as they improve maneuverability so much, albeit at the expense of some drivetrain efficiency. I also believe hydrostatics make for a safer tractor, though some disagree. I am a John Deere fan, but there are many fine tractor brands, and while I have shopped other brands, I have always come back to JD. As others point out, the quality of the local dealer is important.

I found 20 hp too small for bush hogging and marginal for grading, though fine for mowing, which is 80 per cent of what I do. I am hoping that the new 25 hp tractor will be better. I sold the great big one because I was using it so little, and the small one was stolen.

SteveC makes some excellent points. Tractors seem to be all designed so that every single thing you need to do to them requires the maximum force an average male human being can exert (perhaps I am exaggerating, but it feels that way). If you really dislike mechanical work, it will be a problem, because even the installation and removal of an implement (they are all heavy-even the small ones) requires some knowledge of leverage and often the application of a tool of some kind (in spite of manufacturer claims to the contrary). Plus, there are many things on a tractor that need to be inspected, tightened, lubricated, or otherwise fiddled with on a frequent enough basis that it's not practical to haul it or have it hauled to a dealer for every little thing. However, I must say that in spite of all the work, aggravation, and possible loss of body parts, becoming proficient in using and working on a clattering assemblage of diesel engine, hydraulic systems, and moving parts is a rewarding undertaking. I love it, and would never think of hiring someone to mow or plow, unless it was an emergency. The one time I did have my grass mowed by someone else, it cost $175. My wife had the driveway plowed (with my tractor) when I was out of town during a big storm and that cost $100. Maybe having everything done by others would be cheaper than spending $25K on machinery, but as the credit card commercial says, some things are priceless.

I have stayed away from used tractors (though the big one I bought had 50 hours on it as a demonstrator) because I don't know how well they've been maintained, and I figure somebody got rid them for some reason, maybe just to trade up, but maybe not.

When I bought my first tractor, I was a total newbie, though I am a mechanical engineer by training, and have worked on cars and other mechanical things since I was a kid. In spite of that I never knew how much I liked diesel engines and hydraulics until I got a tractor. I say that if you can afford it, and are willing to learn at least rudimentary mechanical skills, go for it! Then you can put on your overalls, go to town, and not feel like an imposter.

 

[bp fick]

All really, really good posts. But alas, unless we hear more, the OP was merely a drive by and all the rest is what.....? Good reading for the rest of us, I guess.

 

[Steve C]

very well said. I understand the superman part very well, when I got off the old 8N and onto the 4020 JD I was in heaven. I was just trying to make the point that if you don't want to do mechanical work then perhaps tractors aren't as much fun to play with as one might think.

 

[Steve C]

Please let us know how to get a 10% ROI average without being part of an early Ponzi scheme. I agree that paying for services is an option for the OP but would imagine he will need a much greater "nest egg" to pay for such services. I agree with your estimate of $2500/yr for mowing, snow removal and some occasional brush clean up/tree work but I haven't seen such optimistic figures for ROI since Bernie Madoff was thrown in the slammer.

Investing 25K in a new or slightly used tractor and implements would likely be the best way to get a 10% ROI for someone in the OP's position.

Equipment depreciates, you will get a negitive ROI but the entertainment value can balance the costs if you would rather be on the seat of a tractor doing something instead of watching T.V. Some do, many don't..... If it is worth it to you for entertainment value, fine, go for it. Mine is but my investment is very low and I like working on stuff. If I didn't I wouldn't, but that is just me.

The stock market is in the pits, there are many fine well run companies that are selling at fire sale prices. My all time favorite is Dow Chemical. although they have cut the dividend, they still pay one. They agressively manage their businesses and try to do the best for the stock holders. I have been caught up in 3 of their cost containment programs twice as a contract employee and once as a direct Dow Chemical employee. and am presently unemployed because of it. Although it is personally a little difficult I understand and appreciate what the management is doing. If you buy Dow or a similar company you will probably get a 200% ROI in the next couple of years. My stock that was worth about 90K six months ago is now worth 380k. It is trading at 22-23 a share, about half of what it was in the past. I think they are going to get back there. If it does I will be sitting on 760K and I will buy a new John Deere! Dow makes the stuff that other people use to make stuff. If the economy ever recovers they will be in at the ground floor. If it doesn't...it just wont matter. We will all be in the tank. I have seen a huge ROI on my Dow stock since they got rid of me...perhaps they know something that I don't. (I am a dumb chit and they don't need the likes of me telling them how put together a manufacturing plant, although I did a much better job with their Dow automotive plants than they did, mine went in at budget and made prime product right away, l can't say that the ones that their experts designed are operating as well but that is a story that can't be told, and they will eventually get there no matter what the cost. They didn't ask me how to do it and since they eliminated my job I wasn't inclined to take the time to tell them. I am not bitter. I know they have to do the things they do for the reasons they have to do it.

Disclaimer: I am the dumbst SOB you ever met when it comes to investing. I bnought Merrion Merrel Dow, Clearly Canadian and a Home health care company that I have since forgot the name of on the advice of a stock broker that I used to work with.

On his advice I lost about 20K in 3 years. Therfore I submit to you that I know nothing about investing. I only know what works for me.

On the positive side, any company that is smart enough to fire me three times must know what they are doing! Dow Chemical has some smart guys running the place. I am 59 years old, I cost to much and produce to little. I spend to much time thinking and to little time doing. They measure everything they can and put it in a chart. They haven't yet found a way to measure and quantify original thoughts and creativity, so anybody who has these thoughts and visions operates outside the system and is doomed to fail. I have seen this happen to many creative people. It seems to be the archilese heel of many large organizations, they are so busy promoting their shining stars into conventional predescribed roles that they fail to recognize those who can truely inovate for the good of the company.

well maybe I am just a bit put out

As an example I have designed some systems that were adapted as MET (most efective technology) for Dow automotive and Dow Pharma. I did this under very harsh time constraints at the time, I just had to come up with something in a hurry to fix a process problem and it worked! I don't do my best work under those circumstances so after thinking about it for a couple of years I refined the design to simplify the construction and save about 80% of the construction cost to do the same job with no loss of functuionality. Utilizing field welds of common structural components instead of machined parts and building adjustibility into the final field weldment. They said no thank you, we like what we have, go back to doing what you were doing we don't even want to see it. From a designeers standpoint, that really hurts. My best stuff has never been built, yet they are happy as **** with my second best stuff even though it cost a lot more to build. This has happened to me only twice but I don't understand it. They are amazed at the first design but fail to comprehend the benefits of the second refined version, must be a cost benefit ratio thing or something......

confused in mid Michigan

unemployed dumb chit.....
Dow chemical Small projects Mechanical designer
Nuclear Power plant mechanical maintenance planner Fermi II Monroe Michigan
Dow Automotive lead designer Hillsdale Michigan
Dow Chemical mechanical maintenance planner zone A Midland Michigan
Dow Chemical mechanical designer/process piping and mechanical systems.
Bechtel Power Nuclear mechanical field engineer
Alden B. Dow Mechanical designer
Nuclear HVAC designer Gilbert Commenwealth, Jackson Michigan
Dow Chemical mechanical designer/process piping and instrumentation
Mechanical systems designer, HVAC, plumbing and Fire protection..

hey if you need someone with a lot of mechanical imagination and if you don't mind if if they die off in a couple of years, give me a call. Marvin will be very hapy.