Leveling Modern Ag Batwing

[5030]

I use a long straight 2x4 to level mine and adjust the trailing wheels accordingly.

 

[5030]

ooops, I run mine behind one of my Kubota's on the remotes.

 

[oldnslo]

They don't seem to retract any further. I might have to try to swap some hoses around

I would start by tracing the lines from lift cylinders to see how they are connected.
Take notes or pictures showing:
what blind or cap end of main cylinder is connected to
What the rod end of main lift cylinder is connected to
What the left and right wing lift cylinders blind or cap ends are connected to.

Pictures looks like left & right lift cylinder rod ends goes straight to the tractor. Is this correct?

What are the wing fold cylinders connected to? These are single acting so should connect direct to tractor.

With this info we should be able to figure what the problem is.

 

[leonz]

The wing cylinders are connected and used as double acting cylinders

Have you tried moving the draft controls with the engine shut
off to see if the cylinders will bleed back to the oil reservoir in
the transmission to eliminate an air lock condition?

I neglected to ask you if the hydraulic system on your mule is an
open center or closed center hydraulic system.

An open center hydraulic system uses a gear or vane pump and allows
hydraulic oil to pass freely through draft control valves, steering valves
and the transmission if it is gear driven.

A closed center hydraulic system only operates when the control valve
handle pushes or pulls the swash plate that moves the pistons back
and forth to create movement.

Please readjust the ratchet jacks to have an equal number of threads
exposed on one side as it appears that the right ratchet jack adjustment
is longer in length so you need to loosen the left ratchet jack to the
same length to eliminate any binding of the wings.

 

[oldnslo]

The wing cylinders are connected and used as double acting cylinders

Agree wing wheel lift cylinders are double acting but do appear to be connected that way.

Have you tried moving the draft controls with the engine shut
off to see if the cylinders will bleed back to the oil reservoir in
the transmission to eliminate an air lock condition?

If valve have float I would just put everything in float to see what happens. Not sure what model Deere that mower is hooked to

I neglected to ask you if the hydraulic system on your mule is an
open center or closed center hydraulic system.

Why does open or closed center matter? The valves are most likely cylinder spool with A & B work ports blocked in spring center position.

An open center hydraulic system uses a gear or vane pump and allows
hydraulic oil to pass freely through draft control valves, steering valves
and the transmission if it is gear driven.

A closed center hydraulic system only operates when the control valve
handle pushes or pulls the swash plate that moves the pistons back
and forth to create movement.

Please readjust the ratchet jacks to have an equal number of threads
exposed on one side as it appears that the right ratchet jack adjustment
is longer in length so you need to loosen the left ratchet jack to the
same length to eliminate any binding of the wings.

 

[matthew.maxwell2]

It looks like the wing wheel lift cylinders are still extended while center section are fully retracted if plumbed correctly all of the wheel lift cylinders should fully retract when lowered. Will the wing lift cylinders retract further? The diagram calls them phasing cylinders

After looking at it a little more, it appears the "phasing cylinders" for the wings aren't retracting all the way so they are different lengths than the cylinder in the center.
Not quite sure how to make them all matched. I would assume that if one bottoms out the others should still retract until they also bottom out, but they just stop when the first one stops

 

[matthew.maxwell2]

The wing cylinders are connected and used as double acting cylinders

Have you tried moving the draft controls with the engine shut
off to see if the cylinders will bleed back to the oil reservoir in
the transmission to eliminate an air lock condition?

I neglected to ask you if the hydraulic system on your mule is an
open center or closed center hydraulic system.

An open center hydraulic system uses a gear or vane pump and allows
hydraulic oil to pass freely through draft control valves, steering valves
and the transmission if it is gear driven.

A closed center hydraulic system only operates when the control valve
handle pushes or pulls the swash plate that moves the pistons back
and forth to create movement.

Please readjust the ratchet jacks to have an equal number of threads
exposed on one side as it appears that the right ratchet jack adjustment
is longer in length so you need to loosen the left ratchet jack to the
same length to eliminate any binding of the wings.

I did even the ratchets back out.
It's a JD 6415 and I believe it's an open center setup.
It's seems like airlock on the lift cylinders might be doing it. I had to use the tractor for someone else today, but tomorrow I'll him it back up and see if I can bleed them.

 

[matthew.maxwell2]

Agree wing wheel lift cylinders are double acting but do appear to be connected that way.

If valve have float I would just put everything in float to see what happens. Not sure what model Deere that mower is hooked to

Why does open or closed center matter? The valves are most likely cylinder spool with A & B work ports blocked in spring center position.

The deck lift cylinders are definitely double acting but the wing lift are plumbed up to be single acting. Looks like there are ports on the opposite side of the cylinder that might make them double acting but they are plugged off - and this matches the way the manual shows it.
Its a 6415 and it does have a flat position. Might be a good way to bleed the system. I'll give it a shot.

 

[matthew.maxwell2]

I would start by tracing the lines from lift cylinders to see how they are connected.
Take notes or pictures showing:
what blind or cap end of main cylinder is connected to
What the rod end of main lift cylinder is connected to
What the left and right wing lift cylinders blind or cap ends are connected to.

Pictures looks like left & right lift cylinder rod ends goes straight to the tractor. Is this correct?

What are the wing fold cylinders connected to? These are single acting so should connect direct to tractor.

With this info we should be able to figure what the problem is.

I'll get some pictures when I hook it back up to the tractor this afternoon or tomorrow.
Thanks for the help!

 

[oldnslo]

Matt,
A question that should have been asked is did this mower used to work and now suddenly doesn’t? If yes what changed? Hose break, cylinder leaking and repaired, etc.

I am wondering if the wheel lift cylinders are a master - slave system where the main lift cylinder rod end is connected to the wing lift cylinders blind or cap end. These require “phasing” and fixed cylinder sizes so the rod end volume of main lift is the same as the two wing lift cap end volume. Not a common type design but in theory if forces all three cylinders to move together.

You don’t need to connect the tractor to trace those lines.