wirlybird
Gold Member
- Joined
- May 20, 2021
- Messages
- 447
- Location
- Oklahoma
- Tractor
- John Deere 3038 E, John Deere 3032E, John Deere 756, John Deere X585, John Deere 332
So it has been about a month since I ordered the flail. Issues were mostly covered in the previous thread.
Shipping was pretty quick and seemed uneventful. Shipper contacted me to give an estimated delivery day and on that day the driver called to say he was 20 minutes out.
Overall, the flail was pretty well packed, and it did not seem that it had experienced an exceedingly rough journey.
A few things to note on the packing.
Aside from the overall pallet and metal frame which is sturdy, the flail is steel strapped to the pallet. There was no protection or cushion between the strapping and the painted main body of the flail. However, there was some cushioning on the metal frame of the "crate" to protect the flail. So, someone thought of it but could do a little more.
The "parts" box and the PTO shaft were also under the steel straps and pretty well crushed. No issues for the metal parts, 3 point mounts and hardware, but the PTO shaft shield was crushed and deformed. It was not broken and after a few days in the sun it has mostly regained its shape.
Main issues I found.
Hardware was missing and inadequate I felt. No washers for the bolts and the bolts seem a bit undersized for the holes they go in. About half of the bolts were too short, you could barely get the nut on. Lock nuts were half height and strip easily as did the bolts. Probably grade 2 or maybe 3. This hardware is for mounting the lower draft arm mounts and the top link mount so these things need to be tight and stay tight. I feel the bolts should be a size larger and a higher grade to properly secure the mounts. I have ordered all new grade 5 bolts, washers and lock nuts $80 at McMaster-Carr. Will probably end up replacing all the bolts on the whole flail to make sure it is secure and strong and up to the job. My choice.
The gearbox. The threaded hole for the oil fill/vent plug was basically cross threaded or looked like it was threaded twice. It appeared it was likely a manufacturing defect. Sent pictures to Betstco and they sent to the manufacturer. Betstco concluded it is a manufacturing defect and the gearbox is being replaced. I don't like the fact I have to take the new flail apart to this level, but I appreciate their effort on this, and it is certainly easier than shipping the whole thing back.
Other more minor issues I found while doing a thorough checkout of the flail. This is something that should be done on any new equipment.
I found loose bolts on the gearbox mounting and other places. It seemed bolts had been put in place but never tightened.
Belts were loose as were the Allen screws that hold the pulleys in place. Most of these things other had also found so I knew to look for them.
Reportedly, people burn up belts early on with their new flail. I think loose belts to start with and then not checking belt tension after the first hours is the likely cause for most.
The mounting of the top link mount is a little poorly designed. It causes the top link to go at an angle between the tractor and the implement. I think this could potentially cause side-loads on the top link mounts which may or may not cause issues down the road. This is something I may try to redesign and may not be hard to do.
Ok, things not in the manual or are incorrect. Betstco is working to get new manuals and videos!
One thing is the oil fill on the gear box. It calls for 3 quarts in my manual, others call for 1 quart. I think 1 1/2 quarts is about right.
Manual says to use the check plug. Betstco says ignore that. What you need to do is look into the fill hole and you will see the top of the output shaft. Add gear oil until it just covers the output shaft. This is a fair amount more than the check plug would allow.
They are working on improved and more detailed belt tightening instructions. May be a no-brainer for some but for others it could be easy to not do it correctly.
Height adjustment is lacking. There is no information regarding the holes for rear roller height adjustment. What approximate height does the top hole represent and likewise the lowest hole? Once you set a "height" using the holes the rest of the procedure is a bit ambiguous. Set the top link pin at 15 degrees rearward in relation the lower pins. What? I need a protractor?! Other flails say level the top of the gearbox or level the skids to the ground. I tried doing the 15 degree thing and it resulted in the skids not being at all level and the gearbox not being level. I am going to work on this more when I can.
I think people run into trouble with flails because the height and flail orientation for the selected height are not set correctly. I have discussed this with Betstco and will report more on this once I am able to get the flail running.
They do discuss the skids but might be easy to overlook. A little more detail might be useful also.
Greasing. Mostly straight forward. When greasing the bearing for the top belt pulley it is a good idea to take the belt cover off and watch for grease to start to show behind the top pulley. It can take a lot of grease but do not over grease or it will end up splattering the belts and ruin them. Same for the other areas. do not over grease.
Well, I think that about covers it! Sorry, pretty wordy but I wanted to get me observations down.
In no way is this meant to be a hit job on Betstco. My last Ranting thread was enough for that!
I think the flail is a pretty solid implement and could use a little TLC to improve things.
A lot of looking online has shown that most of what I have experienced others have also.
Most also say Betstco has helped, and I now have to agree that they do seem willing to get it right.
I hope we can use this thread to discuss some of the things I have mentioned such as setting the height so it may help others.
Thank you to everyone who has contributed and offered support and ideas. Frustrating journey at the start but we'll get there.
Shipping was pretty quick and seemed uneventful. Shipper contacted me to give an estimated delivery day and on that day the driver called to say he was 20 minutes out.
Overall, the flail was pretty well packed, and it did not seem that it had experienced an exceedingly rough journey.
A few things to note on the packing.
Aside from the overall pallet and metal frame which is sturdy, the flail is steel strapped to the pallet. There was no protection or cushion between the strapping and the painted main body of the flail. However, there was some cushioning on the metal frame of the "crate" to protect the flail. So, someone thought of it but could do a little more.
The "parts" box and the PTO shaft were also under the steel straps and pretty well crushed. No issues for the metal parts, 3 point mounts and hardware, but the PTO shaft shield was crushed and deformed. It was not broken and after a few days in the sun it has mostly regained its shape.
Main issues I found.
Hardware was missing and inadequate I felt. No washers for the bolts and the bolts seem a bit undersized for the holes they go in. About half of the bolts were too short, you could barely get the nut on. Lock nuts were half height and strip easily as did the bolts. Probably grade 2 or maybe 3. This hardware is for mounting the lower draft arm mounts and the top link mount so these things need to be tight and stay tight. I feel the bolts should be a size larger and a higher grade to properly secure the mounts. I have ordered all new grade 5 bolts, washers and lock nuts $80 at McMaster-Carr. Will probably end up replacing all the bolts on the whole flail to make sure it is secure and strong and up to the job. My choice.
The gearbox. The threaded hole for the oil fill/vent plug was basically cross threaded or looked like it was threaded twice. It appeared it was likely a manufacturing defect. Sent pictures to Betstco and they sent to the manufacturer. Betstco concluded it is a manufacturing defect and the gearbox is being replaced. I don't like the fact I have to take the new flail apart to this level, but I appreciate their effort on this, and it is certainly easier than shipping the whole thing back.
Other more minor issues I found while doing a thorough checkout of the flail. This is something that should be done on any new equipment.
I found loose bolts on the gearbox mounting and other places. It seemed bolts had been put in place but never tightened.
Belts were loose as were the Allen screws that hold the pulleys in place. Most of these things other had also found so I knew to look for them.
Reportedly, people burn up belts early on with their new flail. I think loose belts to start with and then not checking belt tension after the first hours is the likely cause for most.
The mounting of the top link mount is a little poorly designed. It causes the top link to go at an angle between the tractor and the implement. I think this could potentially cause side-loads on the top link mounts which may or may not cause issues down the road. This is something I may try to redesign and may not be hard to do.
Ok, things not in the manual or are incorrect. Betstco is working to get new manuals and videos!
One thing is the oil fill on the gear box. It calls for 3 quarts in my manual, others call for 1 quart. I think 1 1/2 quarts is about right.
Manual says to use the check plug. Betstco says ignore that. What you need to do is look into the fill hole and you will see the top of the output shaft. Add gear oil until it just covers the output shaft. This is a fair amount more than the check plug would allow.
They are working on improved and more detailed belt tightening instructions. May be a no-brainer for some but for others it could be easy to not do it correctly.
Height adjustment is lacking. There is no information regarding the holes for rear roller height adjustment. What approximate height does the top hole represent and likewise the lowest hole? Once you set a "height" using the holes the rest of the procedure is a bit ambiguous. Set the top link pin at 15 degrees rearward in relation the lower pins. What? I need a protractor?! Other flails say level the top of the gearbox or level the skids to the ground. I tried doing the 15 degree thing and it resulted in the skids not being at all level and the gearbox not being level. I am going to work on this more when I can.
I think people run into trouble with flails because the height and flail orientation for the selected height are not set correctly. I have discussed this with Betstco and will report more on this once I am able to get the flail running.
They do discuss the skids but might be easy to overlook. A little more detail might be useful also.
Greasing. Mostly straight forward. When greasing the bearing for the top belt pulley it is a good idea to take the belt cover off and watch for grease to start to show behind the top pulley. It can take a lot of grease but do not over grease or it will end up splattering the belts and ruin them. Same for the other areas. do not over grease.
Well, I think that about covers it! Sorry, pretty wordy but I wanted to get me observations down.
In no way is this meant to be a hit job on Betstco. My last Ranting thread was enough for that!
I think the flail is a pretty solid implement and could use a little TLC to improve things.
A lot of looking online has shown that most of what I have experienced others have also.
Most also say Betstco has helped, and I now have to agree that they do seem willing to get it right.
I hope we can use this thread to discuss some of the things I have mentioned such as setting the height so it may help others.
Thank you to everyone who has contributed and offered support and ideas. Frustrating journey at the start but we'll get there.
