Lenar tractors!

Wan4me · Nov 25, 2003

No, as an engineer we could not stand marketing. They go out and promise the world to the customers with no technical knowledge and then come back and ask us if it can be done.

If we say yes, they say can you get it done in 3 months for a 9 month job. No, not marketing at all. I stayed in an office(not cubical, I was senior) and work. They golf, stay at nice hotels & eat $200.00 meals. I ate chocolate drank coffe & listened to my cd's while doing my designs and sim's.

Off topic, what type of engineer are you? Just curious as I still enjoy talking to other engineers.

Thanks

JohnS · Nov 25, 2003

and I don't totally disagree with you. You are just the first engineer I've heard of waving the ISO flag! /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif From many lessons learned, from many projects, following process is not an indicator of why one project was a success. Not following process is used many times, for blame, on projects that were not as successful.

SPIKER · Nov 26, 2003

OK I say the send JOHNS a FEEE test tractor, let him use it and post his results!!!

NO JOHN DIDN'T PUT ME UP TO THIS! lol. HE does the CHINA tractor community a great service for maintaining his web site with updated info links ect. I think he would be a great person to convince and he's familair with JM and can easy get lots of people the info he felt was good, ok and if JOHN can't get time to try one out and post the results then I'll step up to the plate and pit one aginst my 284 just well, i can and I'll remain unbiased too! /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

ok I had my fun...

Mark M

MarkNHow · Nov 26, 2003

I thought this was a Chinese tractor forum not a brag about yourself forum.

The complaints seem to be about the attitude and the advertising more than the product itself. I visited the Lenar home page and some dealer sites. The home site says assets of 7 billion but they fail to mention that it is Yuan not US dollars. 100 US dollars = 830 Yuan. I was assuming this was an American site which seems misleading to me.

This is from 1 of Bens' post.
And the main objective seems to be exporting as many models as possible each year into the USA with little concern about improving quality or support, but that is my opinion from experience.
Jinma came out with an LE model which did come with improvements over the previous model.

This is from 1 of Bens' post.
Typical Chinese Tractor (Jinma, Shenniu, Taishan, etc.):
Your typical Chinese tractor is made in a 40 to 50 year old factory.
Jinma also has a new factory.

A Lenar site I visited said you won't find junk here that's why we don't carry Jinma. That's not the kind of advertising I'm going to buy from.

If it is true and they have Ford quality control that doesn't overly impress me. All you need to do is look in Consumer Reports.

I think they have the definitions of "confidence" and "arrogance" mixed up.

Anyway just my 2 cents worth.

Mark H

JCooper · Nov 26, 2003

It's amazing at all the different opinions people have about different things. I LOVE it....it's what makes this world go 'round.

I tend to adhere to the facts. The only fact that I know to be certain is that JMC (Jiangling Motors) is owned by Ford AND Isuzu. I also know that JMC makes our tractors. The best part is that JMC makes their own engines as well. I'm not sure what all other parts are interchanged between the tractors and cars such as alternators, staters, switches, etc. Bottom line, they are excellent machines. So as far as them being on "par" with JM.......I definitely don't think that's the case. These tractors don't leak, they start when you turn the key, and we just haven't had any problems with them.

I haven't owned the JM but I have seen them upclose. Side by side there's a world of difference in not only fit and finish but every part on the tractor. I'm not pushing one tractor over another........I'd recommend buying whatever tractor fits your pocketbook. Make smart buying decisions.

I'll try to post some pictures that give a little info on the auto plant and Jiangling (JMC) itself. Never posted a pic but I'm gonna try.

Durbob · Nov 26, 2003

I think when Buck called Bens bluff and asked him to produce some kind of documentation to show Fords involvement with the Lenar tractor and Ben hasn't shown any...well..to me that says it all. Also when Tractor Ernie tried to buy tractors from Ben, but he didn't have any and Buck had them in stock and was within a 100.00 dollars or so of Bens price. And Buck sells retail ...yet Ben claims to sell to dealers. That doesn't add up ,does it?

lwh · Nov 26, 2003

JCooper,
Just to clarify ownership, Ford has made an investment by purchasing around 30% of the Jiangling stock. Ford did a similar thing in this country and at one time owned a significant (but I believe less significant on % basis) part of Cummins Engines. For about 10 years I heard "Ford owns Cummins and blah, blah, blah". Of course, none of the versions of blah, blah, blah ever happened. So that's part of where I come from.
The other part: I tried not to be too blunt in my original post, but that didn't work. Over time I've read posts from Ben on other boards and have read the web pages from his organization. Not the way to win friends in my opinion.
And finally, my Jinma is a nice tractor. If Lenar is superior, I imagine it is frustrating for the folks who earn a living from them, to see Jinma outsell and be more talked about. But, most likely, venting doesn't actually sell tractors. And just to clarify, most of this rant is not directed at Cooper.

Wan, answer to your question is: mechanical

CooperTractors · Nov 27, 2003

I don't claim to know anything about tractors as I am here to learn. So....I can't be accused of confidence or arrogance by any stretch of the imagination.

However, I do trust the opinions and business practices of Cooper Tractors on all levels. It is the product itself that interests me, not the marketing strategies or personal nature of individuals.

I have read several posts requesting Fords involvement with JMC. Other than Fords own 2003 Plant Guide (located on their website), I am not sure what other "proof" is necessary.

If you'd like to review this guide, please go to:

http://www.ford.com/en/company/about/corporateCitizenship/principlesProgressPerformance/our-perspective/company-plant-locations.htm

Hopefully, this will end any controversy on the subject.

Have a happy Thanksgiving!!
Jacki
PS...I like Jacks Ribs...wet or dry...hot or mild.....they are the BEST!!

Tractors4u · Nov 27, 2003

Jiangling Motors Corp., Ltd.
Nanchang, Jianxi (People's Republic of China)
Products: Ford Transit, light trucks and TFR pickup trucks, Isuzu, and various components
Year Opened: 1997
Plant Size (sq. ft.): 103,000
Note: Ford has 30% equity



Does various components mean tractors?

JCooper · Nov 27, 2003

( Jiangling Motors Corp., Ltd.
Nanchang, Jianxi (People's Republic of China)
Products: Ford Transit, light trucks and TFR pickup trucks, Isuzu, and various components
Year Opened: 1997
Plant Size (sq. ft.): 103,000
Note: Ford has 30% equity



Does various components mean tractors? )

Yes, evidently it does. They purchased 30% of Jiangling. That means 30% of every move Jiangling makes.

This is like trying to defend my Wal-Mart stock....that would be one difficult task trying to prove to someone that, yes I own some of Wal-Mart but I don't own the pharmacy.........wait, I don't think my stock is even valid in the garden center. I sure hope I receive some of the dividends from the pet center. If I buy stock in the name "wal-mart" then it's wal-mart stock. I didn't just choose just the underwear department. LOL ;-)