L5740 Cab -- clearance for rear chains?

[FatTire]

Is it possible to reposition the rim on the disk to gain more clearance? I'm looking at buying a new to me tractor and the one I looked at today had 17.4L-24 R4's with two piece rims. I was discouraged by the lack of tire chain clearance. This was a smaller L3x40 tractor, but I'm certain your rims are the same style.

The wheels look like the rim can be disassembled from the disk (hub) and repositioned to alter back spacing. The sales person thought it might be possible but never had anyone request it before. They commented they have done this on AG wheels before, but uncertain about the R4's.

Called another dealer and they didn't know either. They suggested using spacers, until they verified Kubota doesn't offer them for the Grand L tractors only the basic L's and B's.

Has anyone tried repositioning the rim/wheel disk?

It would be really nice if this is possible and a zero $ solution if it is possible.

After posting the above, I reread the entire string of responses and noticed post #14 address this. Can you provide details how this is done.

Yes, that's exactly what they are talking about above. In the photo in Post #16, you can see the valve stem. Normal install would have the valve stem on the inside of the wheel, but he's reversed the hub disk, and swapped left to right. It is weird that dealers haven't heard of this, people move the disk to the opposite side of the spacer all the time -- but up until now I hadn't heard of anyone reversing the disk. Good idea.

 

[moship]

Consulted the L3130 owners manual and found a page describing tread adjustment (see attachment). For the 17.5L-24 industrial tires the data suggests an extra 4.4" of tread or 2.2" per side can be obtained by repositioning the hub disk/rim interface. I realize this data is for a 30 series tractor, but the 40 series shouldn't be all that different. Perhaps someone with a Grand L 40 can confirm.

Never paid any attention to this page before because the turf tires couldn't be adjusted.

Fat Tire, Agree it was weird they didn't know anything about it. One of them is consulting Kubota Technical tomorrow to find out.

Note: 4.4" based on 58.7" - 54.3" tread positions.

 

[dstig1]

TripleR beat me to it...and I forgot about it when I was out in the shop earlier - sorry! But he basically showed you what i was going to. If my brain works tomorrow, I will grab a measurement and a pic with the chains on.

 

[TripleR]

I grew up row crop farming and had to change wheel widths depending on what we were doing, so flipping rims or moving tires from side to side was fairly common. I'm too darned old to do that now, so I had mine done prior to delivery. Fortunately my dealer not only sells tractors, but still run family farms and are a great resource to their customers who are unfamiliar with products and/or operation.

Sadly being met with a blank stare is becoming all too familiar at tractor dealerships when you ask for advice or input.

 

[moship]

Thought I'd share what the dealer sales person relayed from Kubota Technical concerning repositioning 17L-24 R4's.

They claimed the tires/wheels are already at their widest position and can NOT be made wider. I've included a picture, so you can see first hand what they are "claiming" is the widest setting. I didn't say anything, as I believe others on this forum who present solid evidence their rims/hubs are repositioned for greater clearance.

Picture 1: Measurement of tire/inner fender clearance
Picture 2: Orientation of rim and hub disk. You'll have to zoom in to see the hub disk is positioned outside the rim.

 

[FatTire]

Thought I'd share what the dealer sales person relayed from Kubota Technical concerning repositioning 17L-24 R4's.

They claimed the tires/wheels are already at their widest position and can NOT be made wider. I've included a picture, so you can see first hand what they are "claiming" is the widest setting. I didn't say anything, as I believe others on this forum who present solid evidence their rims/hubs are repositioned for greater clearance.

Picture 1: Measurement of tire/inner fender clearance
Picture 2: Orientation of rim and hub disk. You'll have to zoom in to see the hub disk is positioned outside the rim.

That 2 (or 2 minus) inches you are showing looks like what the dealer sent me for my L5740. In a perfect world it would be enough, but in my world not quite. Funny, Kubota apparently has no idea about TripleR and dstig1's solution. Should have my 5740 by the end of next week, maybe in time to use during the multi-day storm forecast for the last few days of the month.

 

[TripleR]

Go down to Rounded Fender/Wide Step for a picture of the successor to the L5740 which is the same as my L5030 and L5740: http://www.kubota.com/product/LSeries/L60/pdf/L60_Features.pdf

 

[FatTire]

Go down to Rounded Fender/Wide Step for a picture of the successor to the L5740 which is the same as my L5030 and L5740: http://www.kubota.com/product/LSeries/L60/pdf/L60_Features.pdf

!!! I looked at the L6060 and even worked on a trade-in deal for a used one with low hours. They're very nice, the cab is nicer, especially if you don't have all 3 rear remotes. (The third slot for rear remote control is located weirdly behind the other two.) But then after that deal didn't work out I got cold feet because of the hoses outside of the FEL, dangling 3rd function hose, and somewhat the higher cost compared to a low hour 5740. That particular 6060 had an air-ride seat, but this 5740 already has rear defrost and wiper, which I need. Air-ride seat is nice but I don't really "need" it.

 

[Oldpath05]

Thought I'd share what the dealer sales person relayed from Kubota Technical concerning repositioning 17L-24 R4's.

They claimed the tires/wheels are already at their widest position and can NOT be made wider. I've included a picture, so you can see first hand what they are "claiming" is the widest setting. I didn't say anything, as I believe others on this forum who present solid evidence their rims/hubs are repositioned for greater clearance.

Picture 1: Measurement of tire/inner fender clearance
Picture 2: Orientation of rim and hub disk. You'll have to zoom in to see the hub disk is positioned outside the rim.

That ain't enough room for a rubber band. What happens if you put the tire on the other side of tractor, I need chains so I'd see how durables spacers are and how much $, should be cheaper then a AG tire set-up.

 

[TripleR]

!!! I looked at the L6060 and even worked on a trade-in deal for a used one with low hours. They're very nice, the cab is nicer, especially if you don't have all 3 rear remotes. (The third slot for rear remote control is located weirdly behind the other two.) But then after that deal didn't work out I got cold feet because of the hoses outside of the FEL, dangling 3rd function hose, and somewhat the higher cost compared to a low hour 5740. That particular 6060 had an air-ride seat, but this 5740 already has rear defrost and wiper, which I need. Air-ride seat is nice but I don't really "need" it.

I agree on the L6060, just pointing out the same wheel setup from at least the L30, L40 into the L60. I traded in a really nice L5030HSTC with new front tires and only a bit over 1400 in for a new L5740 to avoid the "improved" L60 as I mow a lot of brush and didn't like the fuel tank and hose routing especially the third function. I have back problems, so I subsequently installed a Grammar air ride seat. Certainly a good tractor for some, just not me.

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/customization/301405-grammar-air-ride-seat-5740-a.html?highlight=

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/owning-operating/302353-brush-guard-cab-tractor.html?highlight=

 

[dstig1]

I finally remembered to get photos and measurements tonight. The tape measure isn't the easiest thing to see, but it was a little over 3" from the chains to the metal piece that protects the wire running down the inside of the fender. That would be the closest point where a chain could contact, as best I could tell. I didn't take photos of the wheel/hub setting as it is exactly the same as TripleR's

 

[dstig1]

Thought I'd share what the dealer sales person relayed from Kubota Technical concerning repositioning 17L-24 R4's.

They claimed the tires/wheels are already at their widest position and can NOT be made wider. I've included a picture, so you can see first hand what they are "claiming" is the widest setting. I didn't say anything, as I believe others on this forum who present solid evidence their rims/hubs are repositioned for greater clearance.

Picture 1: Measurement of tire/inner fender clearance
Picture 2: Orientation of rim and hub disk. You'll have to zoom in to see the hub disk is positioned outside the rim.

It is hard to tell from the photo, but the hub disc appears to be inside the wheel rim mounting points. Still there may be one wider setting by flipping the tire around on the hub (and you would have to swap sides too). The mounting points on the wheel rim are not centered on the rim, so for the widest setting you want them positioned so they are in the closer position to the tractor. Then position the hub behind them so the hub is closer to the tractor than the rim attachment points. Here is the diagram from the manual that shows it (albeit, not the best graphic, IMO). They go from narrow to wide, left to right.

 

[moship]

FatTire,

Did you ever flip your wheels around to gain extra chain clearance? If so, how much clearance did you gain and did the extra tire width exceed the width of your snowblower?

Few months back I purchased a used L4740 with R4's. The tires are very close to inner fender as you described. It looks like my hub and rim can be flipped around to gain more clearance. I'm hoping to learn from your experience before going through the labor of doing so. The downside of doing so for me is this will likely exceed my front snowblower width...

Thanks in advance for sharing your experience.

 

[FatTire]

I held out some hope that I'd have enough clearance with a careful chain installation. So tried it, and if every single link was perfect I still only had about 0.1" clearance on certain links. No way would the chains stay that way during actual use.

My local dealer (farmer's CO-OP) said they did the thing with turning the tires/hubs around and swapping sides frequently, so I looked into that. After measuring and talking to them again, it looked like that was going to give me TOO MUCH clearance. I've forgotten what we determined, but I'm thinking it was an extra 3.5" per side. That would be too wide for my blower and even for my 84" rear blade when angled. In the end I decided on 2" wheel spacers from BORA (Motorsports-tech of Reno, NV). Those spacers are nicely made, I had the dealer install them and load the tires at the same time. BUT, even with only 2" per side my blower is now a bit beyond my rears (looks like about an inch per side) and the 4" total extra tire width is a lot more noticeable when grading with the rear blade than I expected.

Unfortunately we have had very little snow here (southern Rockies) and I have not been able to test the blower to see if I care about the width or not. If it seems to matter I'm thinking I could either add some wings to the blower or I could sell it and go up to 7 ft. I didn't pay too much for the 6ft blower, but finding a 7ft 3-point blower in good condition around here may take quite a while. I regret buying a 6ft anyways, it wouldn't cover the tracks either way in a bend. Don't know what I was thinking...

I want to suggest that you could take some measurements from your own machine and see what you think you'll get by reversing the tires. The mechanic at our dealer said something about "not all these wheel assemblies were the same". I couldn't pin down if he meant not all the wheels were the same across the different models, or across the range of years. I'm not even sure if he knew --- they just don't seem to pay that much attention to it. BTW, I never measured my old MX5100 hubs during the 3 months that I owned both machines, but they sure looked the same as my L5740's and I was pretty sure at the time there was no difference. Only later when I got into it did I wonder if they were exactly the same or not.

Hope this helps.

EDIT: The reason I wondered if the MX5100 might be a tiny bit different is that when I measured my 5740 hubs I convinced my self that I was going to get more clearance than shown in dstig1's photo above. Why would that be, other than some difference in the wheels? There is no difference in the frame of a 5240 and 5740.

 

[FatTire]

One more thing. 2 inches is not very much extra width, but the combination of loading the rears and adding that extra bit of width makes the L5740 feel a heck of a lot better. I had the rears loaded on the MX5100 from the beginning so I didn't even realize how critical it is on these Kubotas. Night and day.

 

[Green Acres Homestead]

Man I may be double posting this because the first time didn't seem to work. Here is a set a chains I got for my l4740 and they fit and they work great.

 

[moship]

FatTire,

Thank you for taking the time and sharing your experience with detail and clarity. It's exactly what I was looking for. Your "too much tire clearance..." is exactly what concerned me about flipping the rim/hub orientation when using blower and/or blade. You've saved me a lot of time!!!!

For what it's worth I'm planning on making wings for the blower, just because I prefer the blower to clean wider than tractor tire width.

gaproperty,

Can you post a close up picture of your hub/rim orientation where they bolt together. I believe yours are set the same as mine are currently, but would like to verify. The chains are way more aggressive than what I could use, but it's nice to see the design works in our situation. Can you provide a website? The chains I've found for R4's typically relatively large link diameters which reduces clearance, I'd be ok with smaller diameter (weaker or less robust) chains, if they would fit as well as yours do. Thanks for your contribution!

 

[FatTire]

FatTire,

The chains I've found for R4's typically relatively large link diameters which reduces clearance, I'd be ok with smaller diameter (weaker or less robust) chains, if they would fit as well as yours do. Thanks for your contribution!

This is true. My rear chains are Duo's and the links are quite a bit larger than gaproperty's nice chains, and they don't lay out as cleanly so you can't have as tight a fit as gaproperty's. I like the stability that the 2 inch spacers provide, but watching the video above I started wondering if I could have skipped the wheel spacers and purchased chains like that. But I don't how much a pair of those chains cost, so maybe I should just put my brain back in sleep mode.

 

[Green Acres Homestead]

Hi Moshap. I will try to get some pictures today but my rims are set to narrow width. My snow blower is 74 inch and it clears the outside of the tires by a bit.

As for a web-site I ordered mine through a local dealership in Nova Scotia Canada namely Nova International so I don't know the web-site of the chain manufacturer. In the video I posted, there are close ups of the box the chains came in with a part number and name displayed on the side. I suspect if you search the web for that part number or name you would get the web-site. You can also google Nova International, the dealership I bought them from and they may be able to help you out. I too will try doing a search as time allows. As for the chain design they seems to have a slightly smaller side link or at least narrower in design thus requiring less clearance. They main chain is a 5/16 chain or 8 mm but the side chain I believe is 7mm. Whoever made these chains put some thought into it because they got the lever type closures so you can tighten them up and side chain adjusters to shorten the side link. They say in place on the tire and they were the same price as the lighter duty l ones, at least from this dealership. Around $1000 Canadian.

As for going with a smaller less robust chain, The ones I had prior were less robust and slightly different design and a different brand name. They were Aquiline. Although good for there intended purpose they were to light for my tractor and I had hard time keeping them from moving around on the tire. I am not sure if the reason they moved around on the tire was because of the design or the light duty no weight to them. These light duty ones I had prior stayed in place better if I didn't have them on really tight. At least after getting them twisted out of position from making turns and spinning in the driveway when I got back out on the pavement most times the centralfugicial force from the fast turning of the tire seem to adjust them back where they should be. But my new heavier chains in the video stay in place perfectly. When I bought them I asked the dealership for some spring load fasteners to hold these chains in place. He said I could sell you some but you don't need it with these chains. Tighten them down and they will stay in place. As it turns out he was right. Nova International is the name of the dealership. They are huge here and many contractors swear by them and with the little experience I had with them I must agree and will be getting my business from now on.

On of my main reasons for writing this is to help you out. I am not associated with Nova International or the chain manufactures. I hate buying junk and dealing with problem dealerships so I like to give credit where credit is do and both these chains and the dealership is deserving of credit. Hope this helps. Thanks Ray

FatTire,

Thank you for taking the time and sharing your experience with detail and clarity. It's exactly what I was looking for. Your "too much tire clearance..." is exactly what concerned me about flipping the rim/hub orientation when using blower and/or blade. You've saved me a lot of time!!!!

For what it's worth I'm planning on making wings for the blower, just because I prefer the blower to clean wider than tractor tire width.

gaproperty,

Can you post a close up picture of your hub/rim orientation where they bolt together. I believe yours are set the same as mine are currently, but would like to verify. The chains are way more aggressive than what I could use, but it's nice to see the design works in our situation. Can you provide a website? The chains I've found for R4's typically relatively large link diameters which reduces clearance, I'd be ok with smaller diameter (weaker or less robust) chains, if they would fit as well as yours do. Thanks for your contribution!

 

[moship]

Gaproperty,

Thank you being so kind to articulate the detail with clarity. It is very helpful and I知 certain others will benefit from it.

My traction needs are not as great as these chains will provide but I値l research the company in the near future.