JD 4520 weight bracket - design quality issue

[eepete]

I recently added the optional front weight bracket that attaches to the frame front weight bracket on my 4520. This lets me put 10 weights on instead of just 6. I need more weight because my MX-6 mower on the iMatch upped the ballast requirements.

The 1st picture is the 6 weight bracket that fits on my JD 318 garden tractor. Note that the retention bar goes through 3 mid position plates.
The 2nd picture is the optional 10 weight front bracket for the 4520. There are no mid position plates- the bar runs the entire width of the bracket. You can see a bend to the bar, and the 3rd picture shows that a little better.

So I put in a 7/16" bolt to keep the bar from bending. Could have used a 1/2", I'll get one sometime. You can see that and the reduction in bend in the next pictures.

When the tractor came back from the dealer, the bar had bent in enough that the inner weights were not secured by it. This part must be for multiple tractors because it has extra room (but not enough for more weights) at the ends.

It's sad that they got it right 15 years ago, and didn't get it right now.

Pete

 

[kennyd]

Good post Pete...I bet they don't sell many of those since most have FEL's attached. I would try to get your dealer to start a PIP (product improvement) for it.

 

[beenthere]

eepete
The 6 larger weights shown in hanging on the bracket don't look to be the right ones for that setup. That possible?

 

[radman1]

eepete
The 6 larger weights shown in hanging on the bracket don't look to be the right ones for that setup. That possible?

I was thinking the same thing. Are the middle weights for a different set up? I would think the purpose of the bar is simple to keep the weights from bouncing off the bracket and the weights should not touch the bar. Are the weights puting pressure on the bar and bending it?

 

[jenkinsph]

I agree that the retainer pin is flimsy. I can't see the need for the extra 4 42lb weights though. Six 70 lb weights keeps the front end firmly planted while using an MX6. I know what the book says but don't see the need unless you do alot of highway travel with the mower.

I always have one end weight flopped out a bit but the bar is straight, a little annoying but no big deal. I included a close up showing the eyes I added for tie downs, holes are large enough to run the 3/8" grab hook through, I have one on each side of the tractor. Also included a pic showing the length of the weight's hook which is long and makes these weights very secure.

 

[eepete]

I had the 4 42# weights from my 318. I purchased the 6 70# weights from the dealer at the same time I ordered the bracket. At the time of order, they did check/ask what kind of tractor I have. I have a total of 6 of the 42# weights, bought at 3 different times, for the 318. All three groups are a little different, but all three fit the brackets. The 70# weights are very similar in terms of the slot they have and the lip that the rod goes over to keep the weights from bouncing off the bracket.

The MX6 mower has a ballast code of 82 according to the manual. If you then go back to the 4520 manual, there is no way to get that ballast with just 42 # weights. In the table labeled "Implement Code using iMatch..." a ballast code of 83 is obtained if you have 12 70# weights. This bracket, the biggest they make for the 4520, can hold 10 weights.

So I was trying to get close to the right ballast, purchased 6 of the 70#, and then used my left over 42# to fill the bar out. This is the equivalent of 8.4 70# weights for a ballast code of around 72. Not quite as much as they recommend, but a lot of weight.

The bar is difficult to insert in the bracket. The lips on all the weights push on it a bit. On the 318, the bar slides through no problem. The extra space on each end of the weight bracket is puzzling too. I'll email the pix to the dealer and see what they can figure out, sounds like very few people have put this bracket on.
Steve, if you've been OK with just the 6 70# weights than I should just return the bracket and go with that since the bracket doesn't fit right. Silly me, I was reading and following the manual :confused2:.

I'll let everyone know what Deere says, tnx for the feedback.

Pete

 

[jimgerken]

I have purchased JD weights so I know how overpriced they are (typically $2 per pound! and then they have the nerve to charge you $80 for a "mounting kit of half a dozen bolts). So, adding up whats in that first picture, you have about one-fourth of the price of a 400 CX loader.

 

[eepete]

The bracket was $215. If it worked, that would be fine by me. Weights run just a bit over $1/#. Also keep in mind I have a good relationship with the dealer, and they get all my business. Bought a land plane recently, and worked hard with them to figure out how I could buy something from them. This included showing them what else I was looking at, etc. So prices in areas vary, and I'm hoping that if the dealer knows I'll always come to them 1st that they might go for more reasonable prices to get all the business. Just a guess/hope on my part.

So I'm about 11% towards a loader. While I'd love to have one, the compact size of the weights is nice. All I have to worry about is the big 'ol MX6 sticking out of the back.

Dealer has the pictures, says he's looking into it. I suspect he'll forward the email off to the Deere mother ship. He has verified that the brackets and weights are correct for the 4520.

Pete

 

[arrabil]

The weight bracket and restraining bar on my x475 looks exactly the same as yours. They just cheaped out in making it I think. The bar is just there to prevent the weight from popping off and nothing else from what I can tell.

And it was such a huge pain in the arse to get four smaller weights under the bar that I can't even imagine how you got your's through at all.

 

[jenkinsph]

Easy way to get the pin in with all 70# weights was to use a jack with a 4x4 supporting all the weights. It is hard to install the pin without holding up slightly.

 

[eepete]

The kennyd PIP is sounding better all the time. It might take some time and effort, but if the solves the problem for me and others down the road it would be worth it.

Steve, where were you when I was putting that bar through? I was lifting each weight, spraying lube, pushing the bar, and occasionally muttering an uncharitable word about the JD engineering department, particularly at the end of the process. I'll use the jack next time.

Next step is wait for the dealer and cut a spare hunk of 4x4.

Pete

 

[eepete]

Heard back from my Deere dealer. The weights are aftermarket, not "real JD". He noted that the mounting flange and lip were not as precise as the JD weights. This explains the approximate $1/# cost. So he's getting a "real JD" weight, and we'll see if that looks better and then look at the price.
This also explains why the 42# weights I have look different. Two are real JD, four are aftermarket. The JD are a better fit on both brackets. Casting is not modern rocket science, I have no idea why aftermarket guys can't do better.

I'm leaning more and more toward returning the weight bracket, and making the 6 70# aftermarket weights work on the existing bracket. If Steve says it works, that's good enough for me. Even if the "real JD" weights are OK, they will probably cost more and there is still the problem that the bar can flex enough that they weights could come off in a bumpy ride or roll over. JD needs to put a mid point flange on that bracket like they did years ago for the smaller bracket with lighter weights for my 318. Maybee lost sales will make them listen .

Other lesson here: Green does not mean JD, look closely..

Pete

 

[dcyrilc]

Heard back from my Deere dealer. The weights are aftermarket, not "real JD". He noted that the mounting flange and lip were not as precise as the JD weights. This explains the approximate $1/# cost. So he's getting a "real JD" weight, and we'll see if that looks better and then look at the price.
This also explains why the 42# weights I have look different. Two are real JD, four are aftermarket. The JD are a better fit on both brackets. Casting is not modern rocket science, I have no idea why aftermarket guys can't do better.

Pete

I'm curious. Where did you get the non-JD weights?

 

[eepete]

The Deere dealer said he got them "from a supplier in Greensboro NC". I can ask who it is if you want.

I guess I could put them on the milling machine and make them fit, but it's a bloody hunk of iron- it should just be cast right. And then that still leaves the way too long bar on the bracket.

Pete

 

[dcyrilc]

The Deere dealer said he got them "from a supplier in Greensboro NC". I can ask who it is if you want.

I guess I could put them on the milling machine and make them fit, but it's a bloody hunk of iron- it should just be cast right. And then that still leaves the way too long bar on the bracket.

Pete

I guess the answer I was looking for was the Deere dealer. I was wondering if they came from the dealer or if you found them somewhere else. Seems odd to me that a Deere dealer would sell aftermarket weights. Anyway, it was just curiosity.

Edit:
You might be able to leverage the dealer for "Deere" weights at the same price if he didn't tell you he was selling you an aftermarket product. Afterall, you would expect a factory product from the dealer.

 

[jenkinsph]

Pete,

I would return the large weight adaptor, fix the six weights you have and rock and roll. Put that money back in your pocket.


My landplane is close to 1000 lbs, the boxblade is 1250lbs. but doesn't extend rearward as far as the MX6, don't have any problems with any of these implements. My 820 is lighter at 4000 lbs and doesn't have front weights, it is a little light with the MX6 on it but is manageable. Having 420 lbs of weight on the front should cover you well.

 

[eepete]

Got email from the dealer this morning. The Deere 70# weights will cost me $90 each. Don't know if that's his cost as he works with me, or their every day price. He is ordering them "no obligation"- I can either trade them (+pay the extra $19/weight) or keep what I have. I can also return the front weight bracket no questions asked.

Cyril, this is the 1st time the dealer didn't give me the choice of Deere or aftermarket, so I can let this slide. An example of when this worked is when I bought the iMatch, and the dealer said they would include the adaptors for all my implements if they could use aftermarket adaptors. Hopefully this event will mean they will start asking the question when selling weights. I suspect a lot of people just cram the weights on and go.

Steve, you've yet to steer me wrong (and don't start now ). I'm going to return the weight bracket and just go with 6 70# weights. I'll see what the fit is like with the real weights. With the tool I have (milling machine but no welding cutters) it might be a lot easier to just put up the extra $$s and have a day to do work in other areas. Give me an aluminum chassis for electronics equipment and a 2 mil tolerance and I'm good to go. A big hunk of iron is a very different matter.

So there's the plan, I'll post a pix when it's all done. I was working outside yesterday, and you can hear the grass growing so this will be a just in time solution :laughing:.

Pete

 

[dcyrilc]

Cyril, this is the 1st time the dealer didn't give me the choice of Deere or aftermarket, so I can let this slide. An example of when this worked is when I bought the iMatch, and the dealer said they would include the adaptors for all my implements if they could use aftermarket adaptors. Hopefully this event will mean they will start asking the question when selling weights. I suspect a lot of people just cram the weights on and go.

Pete

Makes sense. He should ask though if he is looking at selling you aftermarket parts. As for myself, I would have raised a stink. But to be fair, if I'm going to the dealer, I'm looking for factory parts.

Glad to hear the grass is growing up your way. Here in Washington, or at least at my place, the grass seems to be growing everywhere except in my pastures. If something doesn't change pretty soon, I'll have to graze my cattle along the driveways instead of in the pastures.:laughing:

 

[eepete]

Just for fun, I tried mowing with no weights. Not much fun . Anything other than level ground and a turn more than 30 degrees doesn't work. So I'm thinking about 6 70# weights (420#s) and how that's about 9% of the weight of the tractor, and then thinking I might want more, but Steve said, and then thinking...

Ok, insert all the overthinking here --> [ ] and reduce the size of this post considerably.

So I took the bracket to a welding/metal fab shop I used years ago when I needed a special holding jig for a chassis for my milling machine, and had them add two plates with a holes so that the bracket holder had a good chance of working. They did a great job and even painted it, 1 day turn, $40.

The Deere weights came in at the dealer, and I went to look at them. They are correctly shaped, unlike the aftermarket ones. Note that the aftermarket ones in the 42# and the big honking weights (don't know what they are for the 6000 series and up) are OK, but the 70# ones are a bad mold. So I decide I want the 6 70# Deere weights. I bring the modified bracket and show it to my salesman at the dealer.
He's feeling bad for all the grief I'm going through. He said that's only the 2nd weight bracket the've ever sold, and others have just "made do" with the aftermarkets. As his way of making up for this confusion and my time, when the paperwork clears it's an even swap :dance1:.

This is why I like my dealer and salesman, this is why I'm always civil when things happen (and things always happen). We even figure out why I didn't get the word on the aftermarket, and everyone in sales (both tractors and parts) now has the word at the dealership. I've sent him the picture of my modified bracket, he'll forward it to Deere central. Problems are solved by focusing on them, and then when the problem is solved it's easer to go back to the people and figure out what happened and fix all that people stuff.

But to heck with all that, let's look at the pix:

The 1st one is using a jack to gently lift the weights. When I did this, the bar just slide through by hand no problem. The genuine Deere weights were the trick. Thanks to Steve for this little trick.
The 2nd pix is a top view of the entire assembly. There is some distortion in the picture, but you can see the bar is not bent, and you can see the mid position brackets that the bar goes through. I've added four 40# weights, and if things get squirrelly I can get more 70# weights if need be. Note also the bracket puts the weights more forward by about as much as the iMatch puts the MX6 mower more backwards. Someday I'll get a pix of the hill with pond at the bottom that's causing all this concern....
The 3rd pix is a shot straight down the line. You can clearly see the added flat bar with hole that the round weight holder goes through, and the bar is not bent.

You've got to like anything that works :thumbsup: .

I'll check back in a year or so and see if Deere has improved the bracket. All they have to do is extend an existing piece of metal up 1" and put a hole in it. Should cost less than $2. This will tell me if Deere is riding on their reputation or earning it every day. After all, they got it right 10 years ago on a bracket made for only 42# weights.
Fixed = :thumbsup:, not fixed = :thumbdown:.

Time to mow the grass again this weekend. More control, should be good. I've got a bit of a learning curve on the MX6, but that's another story for another day...

Pete

 

[dcyrilc]

Looks good Pete. Nice fix!:thumbsup: