Is my MF 231 running too hot??

[buickanddeere]

Now here is a new problem that I KNOW isn't right.

I took the bottom hose off the radiator (cold engine).. Took radiator cap off and filled radiator up with garden hose through the bottom of radiator. When the water came out the top of the radiator I put the cap back on and sealed the bottom of the radiator opening with my hand.

Well guess what?! No water came out the radiator UNTIL I removed the cap!! Then all the water came out!

That is the laws of physics and is what is supposed to happen. Atmospheric pressure was holding the water in the rad. It's how a barometer works as well.

 

[buickanddeere]

I just can't understand why the needle on the temp gauge is right at the white mark (verge of running hot according to gauge) when the infrared thermometer is reading 180F at the thermostat housing.
It really makes me scratch my head.


It means the gauge and stat are working together as designed.

 

[buickanddeere]

OMG. Is this post a joke??

Careful how you ask that question. Apparently I "offended " somebody doing that and have had two posts yanked from this topic.

 

[Travis_R]

Brought radiator to shop this morning to have it pressure tested and whatever else it needs, if anything. I also ordered all 4 new radiator hoses.

For anybody needing parts for a Massey Ferguson, Stevens Tractor Co. in Coushatta, LA is a good place to get them. They have a large selection on their website and you can also request an agricultural parts book and a book of the implements/attachments they sell (may have to call). They also have tons of parts for Ford and a few other brands. It's worth it to check them out.

www.stevenstractor.com

 

[Travis_R]

Radiator checked out to be fine.

Waiting on hoses, sending unit, and temp gauge to come in so I can put everything back together and see what happens.

Thanks for all the replies, courtesy and kindness. I know some of you out there will receive valuable information from my experience.

 

[TomSeller]

Radiator checked out to be fine.

Waiting on hoses, sending unit, and temp gauge to come in so I can put everything back together and see what happens.

Thanks for all the replies, courtesy and kindness. I know some of you out there will receive valuable information from my experience.

Good to hear. This is consistent with the direction you have been getting here on TBN.

 

[Travis_R]

Good to hear. This is consistent with the direction you have been getting here on TBN.

You are correct and I couldn't agree more.

Just thought I'd add... On a positive note, I may not have gotten any parts in yet but the new corn seed I'm trying this year has arrived!

 

[Travis_R]

Well I did end up getting the sending unit and temp gauge in today. Didn't know the package was here til after dark. Looks like I'll be putting it back together tomorrow after I pick up the radiator. I'll do the testing with the old hoses til the new ones arrive.

Couple questions...

1) What is the small flathead adjusting screw for, that has plastic around it on the back of the gauge?

2) There's three male terminals on the back of the gauge. The upper left terminal has "B" stamped beside it, the upper right terminal has "T" stamped beside it, and the bottom terminal has what looks to be a "number 1 with 3 lines" stamped under the 1. There's a long line, a shorter one, then the shortest one.

Anybody have any information about this? Thanks

 

[Winmac]

Well I did end up getting the sending unit and temp gauge in today. Didn't know the package was here til after dark. Looks like I'll be putting it back together tomorrow after I pick up the radiator. I'll do the testing with the old hoses til the new ones arrive.

Couple questions...

1) What is the small flathead adjusting screw for, that has plastic around it on the back of the gauge?

2) There's three male terminals on the back of the gauge. The upper left terminal has "B" stamped beside it, the upper right terminal has "T" stamped beside it, and the bottom terminal has what looks to be a "number 1 with 3 lines" stamped under the 1. There's a long line, a shorter one, then the shortest one.

Anybody have any information about this? Thanks

Normally the black looking thing would be the gauge backlight bulb, Adjustable screw??? Some gauges can be calibrated( changes relative position of needle) don't touch it

B. is battery positive

T temp sender

The last is universally recognized symbol indicating battery negative

 

[Travis_R]

Normally the black looking thing would be the gauge backlight bulb, Adjustable screw??? Some gauges can be calibrated( changes relative position of needle) don't touch it B. is battery positive T temp sender The last is universally recognized symbol indicating battery negative

Thank you!!

I didn't notice the old gauge having the adjustable screw but it does illuminate when the lights are turned on. The old gauge is still installed at the moment.

 

[Travis_R]

Now there's 2 new issues since I went out and tried to put the new temp sending unit in...

1) Look at the pics at the bottom of this page. The sending units are different!!! And I used the MF part number! The new one is "A &I Products" aftermarket (so is the new gauge). But there is a discrepancy in the part numbers from the invoice saying the new A &I part number is the same as the Massey part number. Well I got proof this isn't so!!

2) When I finally got the new sending unit installed (very hard to tighten up) I turned the key on. The gauge did nothing! It usually would jump up a third of the way in the green.
So as I was moving around, I bumped the metal instrument cluster panel that the gauges and tachometer mount to (panel is below/behind steering wheel). Soon as I bumped it the gauge moved a little!
So I turned the key off and turned it back on. The gauge didn't move. I hit the instrument panel lightly and the gauge moved again!! Kept repeating this turning the key on and off...
Bad ground somewhere??

I removed the new sending unit. No threads were stripped out on anything but I honestly don't wanna reinstall it. The head is completely smaller than the old one.
BEFORE ANYONE ASSUMES, the threads that the sending unit screws into are FINE. The old sending unit screwed back in perfectly.

I'm still not ready to give up and get a mechanic.

So now what??

 

[Travis_R]

...forgot to mention that the new sending unit didn't even come with a brass washer. I'm guessing that's another screwed up part number that has to be ordered separately.

 

[sawtooth]

None of my tractor temp gauges move with switching ignition on so I'm guessing there not suppose to. They all slowly move up as engine warms. Sent from my iPhone using TractorByNet

 

[buickanddeere]

Did you not first measure the old and new sending unit at room temperature with an ohm meter ?

 

[buickanddeere]

Why pray tell would you install another red-white gauge instead of a 100-250F gauge ?

 

[buickanddeere]

Since we are into the cooling system . Perhaps we should check out the coolant pre-heater for winter starting?

 

[sawtooth]

Since we are into the cooling system . Perhaps we should check out the coolant pre-heater for winter starting?

Good idea

Sent from my iPhone using TractorByNet

 

[Travis_R]

Been working on tractor all day. Taking a break right now. Installed radiator and new temp gauge (A & I Products part # A-1877719M92)

It has nothing to do with this thread and that's why I never mentioned it, but the absolute most difficult part was getting the new air cleaner intake hose installed! What a nightmare!!!
I know it sounds simple but it wasn't. If I would have put some grease or a light coat of oil it probably would have been much easier. I didn't have any lube though, although butter or cooking oil would have probably helped.

The temp gauge was bad for sure. Long story short, I tested it by grounding out the wire going to the sending unit... The new gauge works exactly like it's supposed to.

Now Im sable to say the title to this thread should be changed to "Massey 231 Temp. Gauge or Temp. Sending Unit?" (LOL!) since we know it isn't running hot, which was proven by the infrared thermometer...


***NOTE TO MASSEY 231 OWNERS***

The air breather hose on mine was cracked right up to the clamp where the hose goes into the intake on the engine. TAKE THE HOOD OFF AND INSPECT YOURS FOR CRACKS. HAD NO IDEA MINE WAS CRACKED!
If you buy the aftermarket "A & I Products" (part # A-1672724M1, Massey part # 1672724M1) air breather intake hose, it will be a little longer compared to the OEM hose unless they make a revision in the future.
The A&I hose does come with the internal spring by the way...
If you cut the hose to the correct length it will be a piece of cake installing it but I didn't do this. I ran mine through the same hole the metal pipe comes out of that the oil bath air cleaner is attached to. (The round hole in the metal frame where the last metal pipe comes out that the breather hose connects to).
It will fit but is extremely tight...
Confused yet?? I will post a pic if I think about it.

ALSO... I do not recommend buying the A& I Products water temperature sending unit for this tractor!! They sent me their part # A-1877731M1, which was supposed to cross to the Massey number.
I ordered Massey part # 1877731M92 and the A&I temp sender IS NOT THE SAME. The head is smaller and the threads are different! The threads are the same size, but the thread pitch is different or something, I'm not sure. It didn't come with a copper sealing washer because it's tapered between the head and the last thread, which means it isn't supposed to screw all the way into the engine. I'm sending it back.
I ordered the Massey sending unit last night.

 

[Travis_R]

Since we are into the cooling system . Perhaps we should check out the coolant pre-heater for winter starting?

I have no idea where this is located and didn't know it even had it.
But it does have a "thermostart" for cold weather starting. By turning the key to the right (without turning over the engine) and holding it there for a minute or so, white smoke comes out the exhaust manifold which indicates it's warming the diesel.
That works fine. I used it this winter. And Thank God it's equipped with it because that engine would NOT start for nothing without it.

 

[buickanddeere]

I have no idea where this is located and didn't know it even had it.
But it does have a "thermostart" for cold weather starting. By turning the key to the right (without turning over the engine) and holding it there for a minute or so, white smoke comes out the exhaust manifold which indicates it's warming the diesel.
That works fine. I used it this winter. And Thank God it's equipped with it because that engine would NOT start for nothing without it.

A block heater is a much superior method of starting a cold engine than using thermostart. Pre-heating reduces starter wear, cylinder wall wear, lube oil dillution, battery discharge, alternator loading and fuel consumption. A prewarmed engine burns the fuel cleaner and more efficienctly.
Thermostart has it's place as an emergency cold start feature when electric pre-heating is impossible.

http://www.phillipsandtemro.com/userfiles/file/2013_ZEROSTART_CATALOG.pdf pages 60-61