Snow Is adding max weight to a Grand L a good idea.

[utvol2003]

I posted this on the Orange Tractor Talk forum wanted to get a little more insight.
I would like to know if anyone has had any bad experiences with filled tires and backhoe work on a grand L? I am having my L6060 built now with filled R1-14.9-26 tires, 600 lbs of wheel weight, Backhoe, and a 4n1 loader. All I have heard is how Kubota tractors are light and need more weight, but can the axles in the front and rear handle the added weight? I will continue to search the sites for answers.When I opened this thread I hoped to get some advice from those with real world experience. My concerns about weight began with operating the tractor on and around hills. The area will be very difficult to maneuver around and thought more weight would give me more stability. The next thing was using 5.5ft disc mower and baler (still unsure of baler size or type). I plan on building a 1/2 mile or so of gravel road across a steep incline. Then there is the fence installation with an auger and a 6" post driver. Any advice is greatly appreciated!

 

[Henro]

Hi,

Just to start things off, weight in the tires, or as wheel weights, is different than weight added to the tractor itself. This added weight is not generally carried by the axles, since it is resting on the ground.

Naturally, if you do something that causes a wheel to lift off the ground then the weight of the tire IS carried by the axle, but the weight of the tractor IS REMOVED from the axle, so there is likely a net reduction in the weight felt by the axle.

So it seems to me you should not have to worry about loading your tires or using wheel weights.

Bill

 

[Luke'sScreenName]

I posted this on the Orange Tractor Talk forum wanted to get a little more insight.
I would like to know if anyone has had any bad experiences with filled tires and backhoe work on a grand L? I am having my L6060 built now with filled R1-14.9-26 tires, 600 lbs of wheel weight, and a 4n1 loader. All I have heard is how Kubota tractors are light and need more weight, but can the axles in the front and rear handle the added weight? I will continue to search the sites for answers.When I opened this thread I hoped to get some advice from those with real world experience. My concerns about weight began with operating the tractor on and around hills. The area will be very difficult to maneuver around and thought more weight would give me more stability. The next thing was using 5.5ft disc mower and baler (still unsure of baler size or type). I plan on building a 1/2 mile or so of gravel road across a steep incline. Then there is the fence installation with an auger and a 6" post driver. Any advice is greatly appreciated!

I have a very similar MX4800 with Rimgard loaded R4s PLUS cast-iron wheel weights. I use it with a Woods BH90x hoe (very similar to a Kubota BH92).

It has about 420hrs on it. Maybe 50 of those are digging with the hoe. No problems so far. I wouldn't be caught on my MX4800 without loaded rears (unless the FEL was off).

Obviously, the stabilizers are down when digging. The 3pt can lift north of 2tons and the rear end has to be designed to support that so the hoe transport weight doesn't worry me.

You may already know this but Kubota's engineers appear to be very conservative. So the warning in the manual about loaded rears and BH use is an example of this (IMO).

I don't recall ever reading on TBN of rear axle issue due to weight stress. I do recall several Century/Branson's with issues.

You could put a massive stack of wheel weights on and skip loading the tires if you were worried. You could then take off the weights when the BH was on. (hint: you won't actually take off the weights because they are indeed heavy and it's kind of a PITA)

 

[jeff9366]

The Grand L tractors have adjustable rear wheel widths. One of the nice features justifying Grand L elevated price. There are four widths available on the four larger Grand Ls with R1 tires, from 50" to 56" and three widths with R4 tires, from 52" to 59". (This info is in Operator's Manual.)

Did you configure your L6060 for optimal wheel width when it was assembled at your dealer?

I would make sure you have optimal rear wheel width installed before messing with anything else. Rear tires filled 3/4 with liquid will certainly lower tractor center of gravity but probably will not increase hillside stability as much as wide rear wheels. On hills, bear in mind that load on axle will not be symmetrical. Load on downhill wheels and downhill side of axle could be 75% of total axle load.

If I interpret your opening post correctly, you are considering 600 pounds of wheel weights too. Wheel weights seem unnecessary and potentially stressful to your rear axle on slopes.




If you paragraph your posts they would be easier to interpret. Your opening post contains three paragraphs waiting recognition.

 

[bilrus61]

I've got two Grand Ls. Started out with a GL4200. I would say you won't have any issues at all. If you want to talk weight on a real axle I put a 8 foot Rhino TW96 on my G4200 and would ride around over this rough pot holey farm with it in the air on a three point mount. You can bet the shock weight on those axles were off the charts when I would be buzzing along with that very heavy mower on the axles and hit a ground hog hole. One time it bounced me up in the air a bit. Never a axle issue. I've got a 900 pound tiller on my GL5040 and carry it over the same rough ground bouncing along and never give my axles a second thought. That three point weight IS on the axles not like the weight on the tires which isn't.

I kinda like Kubota's idea of a light tractor but one you can add weight to if you need it. I've got a M7040 with larger tires and cast wheels. 1800 pound Land Pride 3696 mower on a three point mount. Tires Filled with fluid. Add on a loader and bucket , not to mention me <cough> and that thing is pretty darn heavy.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

I'm betting, when over loading, you would have front end or front axle problems before you will have rear axle problems!

SR

 

[MHarryE]

Something to keep in mind is tire load capacity. I believe your 14.9 x 26 R1 tires have a 3,000 pound load rating vs 4400 pound rating on a typical 17.5 x 24 R4 tire. Tire companies state that liquid ballast must be included in the load. Not sure what your weight might be with loaded tires and backhoe. I've typically seen backhoe on R4 equipped tractors due to the higher load capacity. There are many caveats in the load inflation tables. For instance while stationary the tire can be overloaded to 135% overload (235% of rating). At 2.5 mph that drops to 100% overload and continues to drop to rated capacity at standard speed (20 mph).

 

[Fallon]

I have a L4060, same frame as the L6060, just with less HP & smaller tires... I can spin the tires on mine easily even with loaded rears. You'll definately need lots of ballast to put the extra power down with the extra HP. The stability on my L4060 is way better than my old L3200, no way i'd go back or roll without ballasted rears.

 

[utvol2003]

Thanks Jeff for the great information!

The tractor is still at the dealership (Over 2 weeks now, after a waiting over 2 months on delivery) This has given me way to much time to second guess the set-up. The wheels are set at their widest setting and the wheel weights are supposed to be installed before delivery.

I read the info from MHarryE (great info for a beginner like myself) on the load rating of R4 vs. R1 tires and I was intrigued, but not surprised. I need the AG's to maneuver the hills safely. I realize I'm asking this tractor to do a little more than should be required, but I truly believe the L6060 will give me the best chance to succeed.

Good call on the post. I sent the post from my I-phone in 3 paragraphs. I may need to log-on to my computer before my next long post. Thanks Again!

 

[ProjectKing]

Thanks Jeff for the great information!
The tractor is still at the dealership (Over 2 weeks now, after a waiting over 2 months on delivery) This has given me way to much time to second guess the set-up. The wheels are set at their widest setting and the wheel weights are supposed to be installed before delivery.
I read the info from MHarryE (great info for a beginner like myself) on the load rating of R4 vs. R1 tires and I was intrigued, but not surprised. I need the AG's to maneuver the hills safely. I realize I'm asking this tractor to do a little more than should be required, but I truly believe the L6060 will give me the best chance to succeed.
Good call on the post. I sent the post from my I-phone in 3 paragraphs. I may need to log-on to my computer before my next long post. Thanks Again!

What are you asking the tractor to do? I'm curious what you are going to do to stress the tractor.

For hills the rear wheels need spaced out as far as possible. Also fluid in rear tires will give tractor lowest center of gravity... fill 3/4 up.

 

[utvol2003]

What are you asking the tractor to do? I'm curious what you are going to do to stress the tractor.

For hills the rear wheels need spaced out as far as possible. Also fluid in rear tires will give tractor lowest center of gravity... fill 3/4 up.

I am planning on using the tractor to dig out for a garage and a couple small ag sheds, dig a 3'x3'x400' ditch, install 80' of 24" pipe, 500 ft of water line, set 200- 6" posts, install 4000' of fence, cut and bale 5 acres for hay, keep 5 acres clear, seed and fertilize, keep up 1300' of gravel drive, and perform normal maintenance on a small farm.

 

[Turbys_1700]

Load the tires, set the rears wide, enjoy the stability. Don't overstress yourself. You have a good tractor that will serve you well.

 

[Fallon]

Are you getting a hoe as well? Didn't see that anywhere. The loader on a tractor is for loading, not for digging & most of your tasks are digging. Even with a 4 in 1 bucket a loader is not a dozer. Push it hard & you will tweak or break the loader arms. Not to mention the pain in trying to cut any things smooth. Tractors pull, not push.

A Grand L is going to be half the weight of a small industrial hoe. With the right hoe on the back it will get things done though.

 

[utvol2003]

Yes, it will have the BH92 Backhoe.

 

[SDT]

I cannot imagine why you would need added ballast, either liquid or cast iron for back hoe work.

Indeed, Kubota tractors are somewhat light when compared to some competitive models, but rear ballast is needed only for tillage with ground engaging implements, tasks for which hydrostat tractors are not well suited, or FEL work.

Rear ballast is just about mandatory for anything but play FEL work but you will not need it with the back hoe installed. Unless you plan to do FEL work with the BH not installed, I would not invest in rear ballast.

Myself, I have two cast iron weights on either side of my L6060 and a counterweight box filled with bags of playground sand (still in the bags) for FEL work. I do not have a BH. I never use liquid ballast because it complicates tire repair and I mount/dismount/repair all of my own tires.

SDT

 

[ProjectKing]

I am planning on using the tractor to dig out for a garage and a couple small ag sheds, dig a 3'x3'x400' ditch, install 80' of 24" pipe, 500 ft of water line, set 200- 6" posts, install 4000' of fence, cut and bale 5 acres for hay, keep 5 acres clear, seed and fertilize, keep up 1300' of gravel drive, and perform normal maintenance on a small farm.

All those tasks seem reasonable if you take your time. The digging will be slower than a excavator or big backhoe but it will get the job done.

The only concern I have is your hills. How steep are they?

You are buying a high dollar machine. Another option would be to buy two cheaper machines. Either a dedicated TLB like a B26 or mini excavator. And then a smaller L series. Removing backhoe and installing all the 3 point hardware is a pain especially if you do it often. Having two tractors or tractor and excavator maybe more convenient for you. (0: Just thinking out loud.

 

[Grandad4]

All I have heard is how Kubota tractors are light and need more weight, but can the axles in the front and rear handle the added weight? I will continue to search the sites for answers.

Every time I look up comparable tractor specifications, the Grand L Kubota weights are right in line with similar models from other makes... usually within a few hundred pounds more or less. The one exception seems to be Mahindra, whose "compacts" are about 1,000 lbs heavier than everyone else's, apparently the result of building its "compact" tractors more nearly like utility models only with shorter wheelbases and downsized tires.

I owned a Grand L with the factory backhoe for more than a dozen years. With the backhoe mounted, it weighed more than 7,000 lbs and never wanted for traction or pulling power. Due to the height of the backhoe, the tractor always felt less stable to me on side slopes with the BH mounted than without. We never loaded the rear tires, so when the backhoe was off, a heavy implement was needed in back for any serious loader work.

If you expect to do work on hills without the backhoe, I'd definitely load the tires for stability, along with mounting something heavy on the 3 pt.

 

[repete]

If you are going to dig out for a foundation or a building I recommend you get a grader box for the rear. If you set the teeth to dig, you can soften up dirt making for easier front loader work and when you are maneuvering you will not have the backhoe in the way. You can add more ballast to the grader box as well.

Give some thought to where you will be moving dirt to as well. If you are going down a hill with little weight on the rear be sure to be in 4WD so you can use the brakes. I have been caught in the awkward position of having the rear wheels skidding on dirt and gravel with no ability to slow down and had give it throttle to engage the front axle to use the front wheels to slow the tractor. In any case, with a front loader keep the loader as low as possible, the ground is your friend. If you feel unstable or out of control, get the load to the ground.

 

[kuboman]

Added weight with the hoe on will just be a waste. Stay away from loaded tires. Nothing but a hassle. If you feel you need to add weight use cast wheel weights.

 

[Luke'sScreenName]

Of course the weight is for when the hoe is off and I think the OP knows this.

For work with that tractor, to get max traction, (with an LA1065 loader) you absolutely need about 6-700lbs on each tire one way or another. PLUS 700-1200lbs of close 3pt ballast for max loader work IMO.

I am sure it would be ideal to remove that tire weight when mounting the BH. That is possible with wheel weights but not practical IMO.