Hydraulic Pump Upgrade (Deplorable Diesel)

   / Hydraulic Pump Upgrade (Deplorable Diesel) #1  

PCABE5

Platinum Member
Joined
Oct 31, 2007
Messages
812
Location
Wisconsin
Tractor
John Deere 4066R Cab and loader
Ever consider what the best upgrade to your tractor could be? Do you do a lot of loader work? Or 3pt work? Maybe run equipment off the rear hydraulic outlets? Well quite possibly your answer would be faster hydraulics. Deplorable Diesel, Deplorable Diesel | Deplorable Diesel, has the pump you WILL want and after install it you'll be asking yourself what took me so long.

The LS XR31xx and XR41xx and the New Holland Boomer 40/45/50/55 use a stock 12cc or 8.2 GPM pump. Sounds good right? But did you know LS and New Holland specs show the pump gross rating and not the actual flow rate of the hydraulic system? Bet you didn't. I researched two other manufacturers, John Deere 3R series and Massey Ferguson 1700 series, and both have larger implement pumps than the stock LS/New Holland but their flow rates listed in the specs are actual flow rates and not the gross pump capability. For example JD uses a 14.1cc 9.7 GPM pump rated at 9.1 at the outlet.

I got a new 16cc/10.99 GPM hydraulic pump from Deplorable Diesel and figured that a comparison of flow rates from the stock 12cc/8.2 GPM pump to Deplorable's 16cc/10.99 GPM pump would be a benefit for all of us. So, I purchased a flow meter, hoses and connectors to test the flow rates before and after. The results speak for themselves and users will be impressed. If you have used hydraulics on any of these tractors or other brands you should know that a change of even .75 GPM will be noticeable to you.

I decided to take flow rates of my New Holland Boomer 40, XR3140 hydrostatic transmission, in the stock configuration from both the loader valve and the rear outlet. Some variation will be seen but it is negligible and is the nature of me trying to capture the highest meter reading that was repeatable.

NOTE 1: It was discovered on the hydro units, due to hydraulic plumbing, that if the PTO is engaged you will see a slightly higher flow rate.

NOTE 2: Hydrostatic and mechanical transmissions have a different implement plumbing configuration so it is "possible" that the mechanical transmission could see higher flow rates in the stock configuration but they will not be significantly different. I'm thinking they will be comparable to the "w/PTO" reading below.

NOTE 3: Mechanical transmission testing of the stock pump will happen and the results will be posted here later.

Rated speed 2600 rpm, high idle/wide open 2750 rpm, and Rear PTO 2509 RPM/2545 for mid PTO (all RPM's from the service manual)

Stock flow rates of the Boomer 40 (XR3140) HST:

Stock flow rates in GPM: Rear outlet

RPM w/o pto w/pto
Idle 1.5 2
1500 3.5 4
2000 6 6.25
2400 6.5 7
2600 7 7.5
2750 7 7.5

Stock flow rates in GPM: Loader outlet

RPM w/o pto w/pto
Idle 1.75 2.25
1500 3.75 4
2000 6.25 6.5
2400 7 7
2600 7.25 7.5
2750 7.25 7.5

This shows the stock 12cc 8.2 GPM pump is 91% efficient at a flow rate of 7.5 GPM.

Deplorable flow rates in GPM: Rear outlet

RPM w/o pto w/pto
Idle 2.25 3
1500 5.5 6.25
2000 7.5 8
2400 9 9.75
2600 9.75 10.5
2750 10.25 10.5

Deplorable flow rates in GPM: Loader outlet

RPM w/o pto w/pto
Idle 2.25 3
1500 5.5 6.5
2000 7.5 8.25
2400 9 9.75
2600 9.75 10.5
2750 10.25 10.5

This shows the Deplorable 16cc/10.99 GPM pump is 96% efficient at flow rate of 10.5 GPM.
NOTE: Deplorable Diesel website rates their pump at 10.6 GPM and the results validate that claim as there could be a margin of operational error to my testing that .1 GPM should be considered an insignificant difference, within a margin of error, between my results and their claimed rating.

The results show that there is a flow increase throughout the RPM range with the Deplorable Diesel pump verses the stock pump. At idle you will notice a faster 3pt hitch and faster loader but at 1500 RPM and above you will really notice the difference. Same results will be for any implement you attach to the tractors hydraulic outlet.

On the Deplorable Diesel website, they note, "greatly improves loader/bucket cycle times and as a bonus almost complete eliminates the bucket flop the LS tractors often suffer from."

They also note what tractors the pump will fit:

Fits LS XR3135, XR3135H, XR3135HC, XR3140C, XR3140HC, XR4140, XR4140H, XR4140HC, XR4145, XR4145H, XR4145HC, XR4150, XR4150H, XR4150HC, XR4155, XR4155H, XR4155HC. (This includes the comparable New Holland/Case version of the above tractor models)

Fits but not recommended for LS XG3135, XG3135H, XG3140, XG3140H, MT235, MT235H, MT240, MT240H. (I believe this would apply to the New Holland WorkMaster).

At the end of the day am I happy with the pump upgrade? Yes, I am extremely happy with the upgrade. We all buy these tractors to do work and doing work faster and more efficiently is what it is all about. If you have an XR tractor, this pump should have been stock.

I did not address a how to replace the pump because it is pretty straight forward but if you are not comfortable with doing something like this have a professional assist you with this. Just make sure you keep everything clean as possible. Here is what you will need:

1. 8 gallons of hydraulic fluid (some fluid will remain in the system).
2. Hydraulic filter(s)
3. Hydraulic pump sealing washers and o-rings (suction and pressure lines)
4. Hydraulic pump (comes with the gear case gasket).

Follow the instructions Deplorable Diesel includes with the pump and you should be good to go. Start to finish it took me about 4 hours to complete.
 

Attachments

  • Hydraulic Flow Rates.pdf
    36.9 KB · Views: 190
Last edited:
   / Hydraulic Pump Upgrade (Deplorable Diesel) #2  
WOW!! I was just looking at that site yesterday. The only thing that I dont quite understand about Deplorable Diesels website. They have a very small hand full of products for very specific tractors. Kinda like the owner of the site makes products for his tractor type of thing. Having never heard of Deplorable Diesel before yesterday, I was skeptical.

BUT NOW...

Awesome write up. I am sure this pump will void every warranty there is on these machines, but I am considering voiding it anyway.

Where did you get the sealing washers and O-rings? Are they standard size?

I'm kinda gitty with excitement about this. :cool2:
 
   / Hydraulic Pump Upgrade (Deplorable Diesel)
  • Thread Starter
#3  
I got the two copper sealing washers and two orings from the dealer. Just a couple bucks.
 
   / Hydraulic Pump Upgrade (Deplorable Diesel) #4  
I wonder if this would help the steering on the XR41 series. I know one fix for it is the put bigger steering cylinders on it. When I am stopped and a roll of hay on the front, I have to let it move a little to get wheels to turn.
 
   / Hydraulic Pump Upgrade (Deplorable Diesel) #5  
I wonder if this would help the steering on the XR41 series. I know one fix for it is the put bigger steering cylinders on it. When I am stopped and a roll of hay on the front, I have to let it move a little to get wheels to turn.

Dang, you just made me cringe. Just thinking about turning the steering wheel with that load and not moving,
thats a tie rod eating maneuver good luck with doing it.

The pump upgrade is nice, hard to get to much flow, more seems to always be used.
 
   / Hydraulic Pump Upgrade (Deplorable Diesel) #6  
Very nice write up and interesting read.

So, LS uses the main pump to feed the PTO valve? On most tractors, the steering pump will also feed the PTO valve so there is no losses on the main pump.

That Deplorable's pump seems crazy expensive. Has anyone tried to source that pump on any other hydraulic shop? That looks pretty much a standard mount and spline shaft.
 
   / Hydraulic Pump Upgrade (Deplorable Diesel)
  • Thread Starter
#7  
So, LS uses the main pump to feed the PTO valve? On most tractors, the steering pump will also feed the PTO valve so there is no losses on the main pump.

On the hydrostatic transmission version the power steering pump feeds the hydro and the implement pump feeds the PTO. The mechanical transmission is as you described. This is a little different and why I want to test a mechanical transmissions flow rate.

Some hydrostatic transmissions I've seen use their own charge pump so flow from steering or main pump isn't used.
 
   / Hydraulic Pump Upgrade (Deplorable Diesel) #8  
Oh I see. It totally makes sense.
 
   / Hydraulic Pump Upgrade (Deplorable Diesel) #9  
Sorry, I didn't think about the steering using different pump. My old Case backhoe used the same pump for front end loader and steering. Different pump for backhoe.
 
   / Hydraulic Pump Upgrade (Deplorable Diesel) #10  
I was just lamenting my loader speed while turning the compost last night.... I specifically asked them why they do not recommend this pump for the other LS models that it fits (like my xg3140).

I had no idea running the PTO could increase implement flow rates... Is there any reason I shouldn't run the PTO very nearly all the time? (besides start up and shut down, essentially)



Response from Rusty at Deplorable diesel, "The 16cc pump on that model causes the loader speed to be a little faster than many operators would be comfortable with. If you have sufficient experience running equipment it may work well for you however I would recommend using extra caution while you are getting use to the change in performance.

Thanks

Rusty"

I believe I'd just keep the rpms lower if I were uncomfortable with the speed of the implements.
 
Last edited:
 
Top