Grappling fun - A Picture Thread....

[Jim Timber]

How much would a 4x4x4 tote weigh full of oak? I have a forklift that I could use to load it, but it would be nice if my tractor could lift it.

Figuring on 66% fill density of the 64cf of volume of the tote, and 63# per cubic foot of green red oak, you're looking at 2660# plus the tote.

If you milled it all into cants and stacked them at near 100% density by volume, you're looking at 4,000#.

 

[Piston]

I understand how you load the first round but doesn't it fall out when you open the dual lids to load the second round??

Yes it does, the way I do it, is if there are two pieces of wood like that (or large rock, or hay, or whatever you want to move) I go up to the first one, open the grapple, close the clamp, pick up, drive to the second one....then....position the grapple over the second piece, dump the grapple, lower it pretty close to the second piece (closer to the ground that way), open the grapple (first piece falls to the ground underneath the grapple arm), then lower the grapple in the dumped position over both of the pieces of wood, then clamp and away you go.

There are times when I'm picking up stumps (I often move multiple stumps at a time) where I can lower the grapple, pick one up (lets say on the LEFT side), then drive to the second one, but right before I get up to it, I lower the LEFT grapple clamp onto the next stump I'm going to pick up (which already has a stump in it) and position it so when I open the grapple, only the RIGHT (empty) side opens, then pick up, reposition, and pick up the next stump in the RIGHT side.
It sounds confusing to type, but it pretty quick really. You can't take too much time though because since the clamps share a circuit the closed one will start to open and equalize with the second one, but this happens slowly and with a stump it has enough odd shape to it that you won't drop the first stump. I can't do this with large rocks though.

 

[Gordon Gould]

This "Grapple Picture Thread" has derailed.

Let's try to get back on topic fellas, there are plenty of discussions about tires elsewhere on the forum.
(Or, if you just HAVE to have these discussions, at least post a photo with every off topic reply )

More pics please.

Sorry - my fault Piston.

Thanks for the picture and description of both tire types on your Mahindra. That cleared it up for me.



gg

 

[Piston]

Mostly I like the "I'm going to eat you" look of the thing.

Me too :laughing: I probably would have bought that grapple if they were around "back then".

 

[IslandTractor]

Oak is 45lbs/cubic foot. Figure 25% air space (??? correct) and you'd be looking at a 4x4x4 tote weighing about 2000lbs. If no airspace then up to 2800lbs. As the weight is necessarily centered at least two feet in front of pivot pins it might be doable with a big CUT loader (2500-2800lb lift) so long as you don't need to lift to full height. It would be close though.

I use a tree boom to lift a water saturated swimming raft out of the ocean and move it for winter storage. I don't know how much it weighs but by using the tree boom I can keep the weight right at the pivot pins.

 

[4570Man]

Well, by the numbers my tractor won't lift it. Of course I'm going to try it, but I'll probably have to use the forklift.

 

[k0ua]

How much would a 4x4x4 tote weigh full of oak? I have a forklift that I could use to load it, but it would be nice if my tractor could lift it.

It could be somewhere north of 3000 lbs. Green red oak is supposed to be about 61 lbs per cubic foot. I guess it would depend on how it was stacked and how much air is in the tote vs. how much green wood.

 

[k0ua]

Oak is 45lbs/cubic foot. Figure 25% air space (??? correct) and you'd be looking at a 4x4x4 tote weighing about 2000lbs. If no airspace then up to 2800lbs. As the weight is necessarily centered at least two feet in front of pivot pins it might be doable with a big CUT loader (2500-2800lb lift) so long as you don't need to lift to full height. It would be close though.

I use a tree boom to lift a water saturated swimming raft out of the ocean and move it for winter storage. I don't know how much it weighs but by using the tree boom I can keep the weight right at the pivot pins.

Did you figure dry oak or green oak?.. I got figures of 61 thru 64 lbs depending on species of oak for green..

 

[Jim Timber]

I was thinking white's number and posted red. Red is 61#/cf.

Wood Species - Weight at various Moisture Contents

Seasoned it's only down to 57# though, so it's still gonna be heavy. Mixing up your totes with stuff like pine or aspen for easier fire starting would further reduce the weight. I don't plan on selling too many pure oak totes. The price paid isn't high enough a premium to make up for not getting rid of my junk trees.

 

[IslandTractor]

Did you figure dry oak or green oak?.. I got figures of 61 thru 64 lbs depending on species of oak for green..

I didn't look carefully. Just saw that the first number that came up when googling "oak weight" was 45lbs/cubic foot. Must be well dried given what the others have posted.

 

[k0ua]

I didn't look carefully. Just saw that the first number that came up when googling "oak weight" was 45lbs/cubic foot. Must be well dried given what the others have posted.

Well in any case, most folk's tractors are not going to lift a well packed tote full. Mine sure isn't.

 

[4570Man]

My forklift will lift more than I need to haul in the ton truck so it won't be a problem. The bigger forklift will overload my trailer with duel 5k axels in one lift.

 

[Jim Timber]

I think the 20% moisture content on that chart is where it'll be after 1-2 years. If you kiln dry it, you might get it down another 10-13% from where it was green, but I think you're pretty well maxed out around 15% MC when air dried vs the 7-8% possible out of a kiln.

 

[4570Man]

As long as you don't have to load a truck like I do the 3 point hitch on most cuts can lift a tote of wood.

 

[Xfaxman]

I understand how you load the first round but doesn't it fall out when you open the dual lids to load the second round??---------------------

I loaded 4 rocks with the dual lid and only got out of the cab to take pictures:

Drove under the first two.

Side view, first two.

Drove around to get #3.

Extended the boom.

Closed the lids and picked it up.

Curled up and opened the lids.

Curled down, opened the lids and extended the boom some more.

Lids down and curl up with #4.

Took them to the rock pile.

 

[Snowback]

These guys performed the first pass heavy lifting out at our place. That T-770 Bobcat skidsteer had a large, round tined dual lid grapple that would really penetrate the piles of trees that were full of dirt from a careless dozer operator. He could spear the pile, pull out, and shake dirt out before piling on. These two pics were a second or two apart and there is no editing/photoshop. Would you get that close the pile, even with a pressurized cab? I think they earned their keep... (www.keysandsons.com) Highly recommend them if you are in greater Houston area.

Moving tree debris from stacked pile with dirt to one of many burn piles.

Really getting intimate with the fire!

 

[Jim Timber]

That's the difference between "your machine" and "bosses machine."

 

[94BULLITT]

And how on earth would you know anything about that, Roger?
Travis

I read about it on the internets

I moved this pile last Thursday with the grapple.

I'd bring the bottom of the bucket almost vertical and curl into the pile so the rounds rolled up and over the bottom edge. It's all about technique.

With the root grapple, you can just scoop under and pack them that way. I'm thinking you could have a very large bucket and get more in it with a wide grapple lid, but it wouldn't be useful for dirt as it'd be too heavy for most utility tractors to lift. Mine maxes out with a heaping 3/4 yard of taconite tailings, but you could put half a cord of firewood on it with ease - it'd never fit in my dirt bucket.

The ultimate for moving firewood. would be a skeleton bucket with dual lids.

That's what I had an issue with, the firewood splits falling between the 9" time spacing.
I pick up grapple loads of split wood to move them, sometimes loose but when I'm carrying it a long ways I'll take the time to stack it on.

I welded more tines onto my grapple because of the falling firewood, and now it's very rare that I
Lose a piece. I ran out of flat bar so didn't do the middle yet.
View attachment 453326



I can fit quite a bit of firewood on there when I take the time to stack it, and I stack it high using the grapple lids as support.

I may have to add some tines to mine. It would be nice to have them removable like the light duty EA grapple.


Instead of a pic I'll post a video.

 

[Piston]

I like those firewood pallets Roger.

I was thinking of making something like that, but instead of making it to lift with the forks on the front, make it so it's held up off the ground 4" or so like yours are, but leave the middle open, so I could slide under it with the grapple tines and lift it with the grapple instead. Since I almost never have my front forks on unless I'm moving pallets of lumber, it would be a lot more useful if I could lift it with the grapple open.
Only thing I haven't checked yet is if the grapple clamps would get in the way, even when open, but since they open pretty far, I could simply adjust the height of my stacks to allow room.

Edit: Do you guys think that would work?

 

[4570Man]

It might work with your backhoe, but most machines lack the lift capacity to do this. The grapple will hold the load farther from the pins than pallet forks will.