FIAT 80 series engine pre heaters...

[mungus]

So whilst it doesn't get super cold down here in Victoria, Australia, it still gets cold in the winter. We are at about 1,200 feet above sea level and regularly get frosts in the winter, with months where the daily highs are below +10 Celsius. So this got me thinking about fitting a block heater, like I've seen in my time in Europe and working on Ski-fields in New Zealand etc. Mainly to avoid the need to leave the FIAT 780 running for 15 minutes to warm up, reduce starter wear and the emissions on start up. (gets a bit smokey when that cold). So I thought I'd record it here for others contemplating this inexpensive upgrade.

Options:

Block heaters;

The IVECO 8045.04 engine has no easily accesible frost plugs, all being located behind the fuel filters or injector pump on the RHS of the engine. (don't be fooled by the 40mm plug on the LHS behind the alternator, that's just covering an oil return gallery). However I found 2 European manufacturers who supply such a unit, if you wanted to go to the trouble of that installation. This also means the heating power cable AND its socket on the element, will be right next door to your high pressure diesel system. Not exactly dangerous but hardly ideal IMHO. You are looking at dismantling all that stuff and the resulting diesel mess and maybe bleeding of the system afterwards. Your choice I suppose. Those Euro brands also required you buy a specific power lead with a weird plug to make it all work (of course). Those setups totalled out at around $200 AUD plus postage.

Lower Radiator hose heaters;

DEFA (Norway) makes one of these in the required 36mm size. Cost is around $200 AUD - Plus you need their special cable. I think they are around $50-80 plus postage. They will work but you will need to fabricate a new lower hose with a tight radius to replace the FIAT steel tube. Can be done of course, its just an elbow after all, and perhaps a pre made elbow can be sourced from your auto parts store. (that's what I did to source my bottom heater hose).

Tank Heaters;

A small pumped tank heater can be easily plumbed into the heater hose lines. (if you have them, as only cabin tractors would, otherwise budget for time and maybe $50-100 AUD to add these. This type of pre-heaters are available in either 110v o 240v, and thanks to our counterfeiting "friends" in China they are cheap. (I bought a 2KW one off eBay for $35 AUD inc postage ex UK). They are pretty compact and easily mount beside the engine. (see photos on following post).

Voltage notes;

Most countries outside the Americas have 240V power, which is a bummer as the majority of block heaters sold on line use 110V. A pity as they are cheap from big brands like "hot-start", and the range is big. The IVECO / FIAT 8045 motors use a 36mm frost plug, so that's all you really need to look for, as long as the element isn't a weird shape. So anyway if a block heater is your kind of thing, and you're not stateside etc, then you have to look at the European made units (much costlier than the US brands), OR find a 36mm US made one and buy a 240 to 110V voltage converter, (about $60-80 AUD on eBay). It must be of significantly higher wattage than your heater. (common sense, but as we know, it ain't that common).

Decision.

I went for a compact pumped tank heater, of 2 KW power, as its a fairly straight forward install and eliminates the voltage and obscured frost plug issues. Works well. I tested my installation yesterday at +1 C, and the temp gauge went from off the bottom of the scale to about maybe 10% of the way up the normal range in about 50 minutes. You could feel the little pump motor whirring away and feel the heat going up the hose within a few minutes. I imagine if you leave it on for say 2 hours it would be up to around 30% but its unnecessary for the intended purpose.

I think the DEFA hose heater is a good option too, but it costs about triple what I spent, and in my case by adding the heater hose set up I have prepped my tractor for a cabin upgrade (one day?).

Result?

The engine started up in maybe 2 seconds, no extended cranking as is usual on colder days, and no excessive smoke.
The head, block and hoses felt toasty warm and the tractor was all ready for work with no further warm up.

Installation details below.

 

[mungus]

Installation.

OK, first things first, whilst you can simply cut a bit out of the heater hose and slip the unit in, that's not ideal. These little pumped heaters effectively function as a siphon, so they work best if you feed in water from as low as possible in your cooling system (bottom hose or a block drain) and feed it into a high point (upper heater hose or the thermostat housing). My FIAT is a ROPS tractor, so no cab, which means no AC and no heater... :-( (BTW anyone with a spare early FIAT 80 series cab that you want to sell - let me know...)

So the answer seemed easy enough, simply remove one of the M16 x 1.5 allen keyed bungs from the thermostat housing and weld a pipe nipple into my bottom hose pipe. Add a couple of elbows and Bob's your aunty (these days anyway). Best laid plans and all that, the bung was of course rusted in solid. Nothing I tried worked, good tools, EZI-OUTs, heat, drifting with a small chisel, nada. So out came the water pump and thermostat housing (one obscures the other). Anyway once on my bench, drilled close to thread minimum ID and tapped clean all was well. It did at least allow me to give my water pump a look over and grease job. Repaint everything, replacing a rotten pump inlet pipe at the same time, and reassemble. (1/2 day).

M16 x 1.5 is not a common thread for pipe adapters in OZ, and we use BSP for pipes here, not NPT as in the Americas (different I'm afraid). So eBay to the rescue and cheap M16 x 1.5 to 1/2" BSP adapter was sorted. Add in an extension nut and an elbow etc and voila, I have a top "heater" hose.

 

[mungus]

So that done on to the bottom hose pipe. As the pipe is mostly 36mm steel tube its not hard to simply buy a 1/2 BSP pipe nipple, cut to length, drill the hole and MIG it in place.
Add the required elbow and 5/8" (16mm) pipe barb and we have the bottom hose (inlet for the pump heater).

 

[mungus]

So onto mounting the unit itself...

The easiest place I could spot, was under the alternator where there are several M8 x 1.0 (fine) tapped holes. So I made a small steel bracket, slotted for a heavy duty zip tie (fast access), painted it and added some self adhesive 10mm high density sponge rubber. This rubber serving to isolate it from vibration a bit. This location allows minimal hose runs and allows the power lead to attach to the alternator harness naturally. The lead exits the engine bay just below the clutch pedal and a few zip ties ensure it stays thereabouts. A cheap outdoors type plastic power plug cap keeps the muck and moisture out when not in use.

So that's it, all done and working well. I did think about a more engineering type clamp for the unit, but this works well, its neat, strong and easy access.
Hope this helps someone one day.

 

[mungus]

Update. I don’t recommend that type of heater.
The idea is fine and my installation worked well.
However the heater failed after a year or so with little use. It starting popping my barns circuit breaker whenever I plugged it in. So I removed and disassembled the heater, finding water in the wiring compartment, and all over the contacts. The sealing around the pumps motor had failed. I had a new spare that I’d bought to install in my pickup so I swapped them out and that failed too. In exactly the same way. This time after maybe 6 months with barely any use. I’m using new 50/50 antifreeze so the coolant is good. So I suggest buying another type. Those 2 came from China via eBay, but was covered in Russian writing, so where it’s made I’m not exactly sure. I’m going to try a different type and see what happens…

 

[Egon]

A little electrical space heater and a small tarp will work very well. No installation hoops to worry about.

 

[LouNY]

After using a chinese diesel to air heater this past winter in my utv,
I would be tempted to try their water heater types.

Haveing a stand alone hot water heater for preheating with no 120Vac needed

My air heater;

 

[mungus]

Update. I don’t recommend that type of heater.
The idea is fine and my installation worked well.
However the heater failed after a year or so with little use. It starting popping my barns circuit breaker whenever I plugged it in. So I removed and disassembled the heater, finding water in the wiring compartment, and all over the contacts. The sealing around the pumps motor had failed. I had a new spare that I’d bought to install in my pickup so I swapped them out and that failed too. In exactly the same way. This time after maybe 6 months with barely any use. I’m using new 50/50 antifreeze so the coolant is good. So I suggest buying another type. Those 2 came from China via eBay, but was covered in Russian writing, so where it’s made I’m not exactly sure. I’m going to try a different type and see what happens…

Finally received my new heater from eBay. 3KW this time. Still made in China (I think) and still covered in Russian writing. But a different design so here's hoping this one doesn't leak internally and short out like the last 2... Its an easier install as no elbow hose was required and its mounting bracket fits right up to an unused engine block thread.

Air heaters don't warm engine internals. And that's the objective of the exercise: reducing wear and smoke, not just getting it to barely start so you can't enjoy clouds of toxic smoke and listen to your engine wear prematurely until it finally warms up. As for the "little tarp and a space heater". Unless you leave it there for ages to warm soak the engine I doubt it does much at all. I had to start big V12 diesel engines for Ski field lifts in ice and snow as part of my job. I know what works and what doesn't... And I've heard a few "pub" tales... However in my experience (5+ decades) unless you can directly heat the block or its fluids you'll achieve little. On the ski fields we had little butane heaters / pumps that heated the coolant where there was no mains AC, similar idea to what that Amazon listing shows. Practically speaking there is a reason why block or coolant heaters are optioned or even fitted as standard by OEM car / truck / tractor manufacturers... They work!

 

[Egon]

Finally received my new heater from eBay. 3KW this time. Still made in China (I think) and still covered in Russian writing. But a different design so here's hoping this one doesn't leak internally and short out like the last 2... Its an easier install as no elbow hose was required and its mounting bracket fits right up to an unused engine block thread.

View attachment 819445

Air heaters don't warm engine internals. And that's the objective of the exercise: reducing wear and smoke, not just getting it to barely start so you can't enjoy clouds of toxic smoke and listen to your engine wear prematurely until it finally warms up. As for the "little tarp and a space heater". Unless you leave it there for ages to warm soak the engine I doubt it does much at all. I had to start big V12 diesel engines for Ski field lifts in ice and snow as part of my job. I know what works and what doesn't... And I've heard a few "pub" tales... However in my experience (5+ decades) unless you can directly heat the block or its fluids you'll achieve little. On the ski fields we had little butane heaters / pumps that heated the coolant where there was no mains AC, similar idea to what that Amazon listing shows. Practically speaking there is a reason why block or coolant heaters are optioned or even fitted as standard by OEM car / truck / tractor manufacturers... They work!

Does that mean a tarp and Herman Nelson will not work when starting Cat Equipment in very cold weather. That is a very common procedure on construction sites.

A tarp and small electric heater have worked well for myself. It does heat the engine & radiator nicely in the same time frame as a block heater.

I’m just relating seven decades worth of experience in up to minus 40 degree weather.

 

[LouNY]

A tarp and a salamander heater have worked for me at times.