Exactly what is 'shuttle shift'

[jeffgreef]

Hi guys-

thanks, I think this clears it up for me. I have five sloping mountain acres where, at first, I'll be doing a lot of loader work making short trails and grading, where hydro is best. But later, when I move there, the tractor will be used mostly for snow removal, doing either blower or loader work. For the blower, shuttle is best because of less power loss, but for the loader the hydro is best. So, I guess I'll settle for a synchro shuttle if I have to, but not a clutch shuttle, cause in retirement I don't want to work a clutch too much. Hydro would be best, but then I have to get a higher horsepower to have enough power left over to throw wet snow in spring. With a half mile of uphill road to clear of snow with a blower, I don't want to get bogged down with a 25 horsepower hydro trying to slog uphill throwing snow with a 5 foot wide blower. One member had a Deere 4200 hydro that wouldn't throw snow with a 59" blower, so I'll be looking at a 25 horse synchro shuttle or a 30 horse hydro, as my budget allows. sound like sound logic?

 

[firefighter9208]

I have a Kubota M4800. It is a "gear" tractor with a partially synchronized transmission that lets you "shuttle" between low and reverse. You have to use the clutch.
http://www.kubota.com/f/products/m4800_features.pdf

This has been the one feature that I have had problems with on this tractor. At 500 hours I have had it in the shop twice to "adjust" the shifter. First time it was jumping out of low. They adjusted it and that lasted about 100 hours. Then it got to where you couldn't get it out of low.

The dealer replaced the neutral safety switch, because the shifter was hanging on it???

I suggest that if you buy a shuttle shift tractor that you buy one that is clutchless when shifting. That is what I will do next time.

Chris

 

[herringchoker]

I had a 1967 Ford 4500 backhoe/loader that I used for 17 years. It had a torque converter, a "power reverser" (wet clutch packs for forward and reverse controlled by a lever on the left side of the steering column) and a 4-speed mechanical transmission. No clutch pedal. Excellent setup for loader work.

 

[kennyd]

For the blower, shuttle is best because of less power loss, but for the loader the hydro is best.

Just my opinion here, but some make a big deal over the power "loss" of a HST tractor where I do not think it is warranted. Sure there is some-but if you buy the tractor that meets your needs, with the power you need and implements that match the machine and task properly up front then there is no "loss".

There are lots of people blowing snow with HST machines-I have not read one complaint of any that need 2 or 3 more HP to get the job done.

 

[dieselsmoke1]

My old Wain Roy backhoe had the same reversing transmission setup as 6sunset6 describes, the pedals change direction and the further you press, the more throttle you get.

Now if you really want to screw up your instincts for a while, go from this to a hydro. No telling how many times I got in a load bind and pressed the hydro pedal more and choked off the engine, not less to reduce the ratio, till I got my head retrained.

 

[arrabil]

One member had a Deere 4200 hydro that wouldn't throw snow with a 59" blower

My 4200 has been doing just that all winter. 17 degree slope. No problems at all.

An HST with the Cruise Control button is just like having a gear tractor where you don't have to hold the pedal so that seems to make HST superior all around to me.

 

[ovrszd]

In my world, if I have to push a clutch to disengage the powertrain, push a brake pedal to stop movement, move a lever from position "A" to position "B", take my foot off the brake pedal and release the clutch to engage the powertrain again in a different direction, I certainly don't call that a "Shuttle Shift".

I call that a gear drive like my L440DT. Pain in the butt for loader work.

To qualify for the title of SS the direction change should only involve one motion, moving a lever from position "A" to position "B". And possibly having to apply the brakes if on a steep grade.

 

[firefighter9208]

In my world, if I have to push a clutch to disengage the powertrain, push a brake pedal to stop movement, move a lever from position "A" to position "B", take my foot off the brake pedal and release the clutch to engage the powertrain again in a different direction, I certainly don't call that a "Shuttle Shift".

I call that a gear drive like my L440DT. Pain in the butt for loader work.

To qualify for the title of SS the direction change should only involve one motion, moving a lever from position "A" to position "B". And possibly having to apply the brakes if on a steep grade.

I agree, but Kubota calls there's a shuttle shift (on their gear tractors). You do have to push in the clutch, but don't have to come to a complete stop with the brakes.

Chris

 

[TripleR]

I agree, but Kubota calls there's a shuttle shift (on their gear tractors). You do have to push in the clutch, but don't have to come to a complete stop with the brakes.

Chris

That is the same setup I have on my Case CX80 and while it was advertised as having a "shuttle shift", it really isn't as I have to clutch to change directions and for loader work really doesn't make it any faster for me than on my MF 375. The only real "advantage" is that I can back up really fast.

 

[MtnViewRanch]

So I guess that some of you guys have a different definition of what a shuttle shift is compared to the manufacturers. Sort of reminds me of Crocodile Dundee, when Sue yells, "watch out, he's got a knife" and Dundee says" that's not a knife, this is a knife" as he pulls out his Bowie knife. Same thing, just a bit different.

 

[Heywood Jannockitov]

That is the same setup I have on my Case CX80 and while it was advertised as having a "shuttle shift", it really isn't as I have to clutch to change directions...

You do have shuttle shift. All shuttle shift means is you have a F-N-R shifter, usually at the left side of the seat or on the steering column that is separate from the transmission speed and range shifters. If you have to come to a complete stop to shift from forward to reverse, using the clutch, you have "non-synchro" shuttle and a dry clutch.

If you can shuttle shift between forward and reverse without grinding the gears while the tractor is moving, but still need to use the clutch, you have "synchro-shuttle" Kioti DK65, DK90 etc. among others - still with a single plate dry clutch.

A "hydraulic shuttle", "Power Shuttle", "Power Reverser" is combined with a multi-plate wet clutch and does the clutching electro-hydraulically, whether you push the foot clutch or flip the stalk on the steering column.

 

[firefighter9208]

OK, then I have a synchro shuttle.

When I think of shuttle I think of the John Deere 310 that I used working construction in college. I was driving along and for some reason, I guess stupidity, flipped that lever backward. I was going about 10 mph w/o my seat belt on. When that thing went into reverse I had to peel myself off the hood. Good thing nobody was looking, because I'm sure I looked pretty goofy. Last time I ever did that.

Chris

 

[TripleR]

You do have shuttle shift. All shuttle shift means is you have a F-N-R shifter, usually at the left side of the seat or on the steering column that is separate from the transmission speed and range shifters. If you have to come to a complete stop to shift from forward to reverse, using the clutch, you have "non-synchro" shuttle and a dry clutch.

If you can shuttle shift between forward and reverse without grinding the gears while the tractor is moving, but still need to use the clutch, you have "synchro-shuttle" Kioti DK65, DK90 etc. among others - still with a single plate dry clutch.

A "hydraulic shuttle", "Power Shuttle", "Power Reverser" is combined with a multi-plate wet clutch and does the clutching electro-hydraulically, whether you push the foot clutch or flip the stalk on the steering column.

Yeah, I know it's all been explained before; should of said in my opinion or just kept it to myself, I don't consider it a "shuttle shift" in spite of the mechanical definition as for me I see no advantage to having a "shuttle shift" over anything else if you have to use the clutch. My Case CX or backhoe are really no easier to use than my non shuttle shift Massey Ferguson. THIS IS ONLY MY OPINION AND YOUR RESULTS MAY VARY.

I probably need to stay off here as I seem to keep stepping into something.

 

[ovrszd]

Yeah, I know it's all been explained before; should of said in my opinion or just kept it to myself, I don't consider it a "shuttle shift" in spite of the mechanical definition as for me I see no advantage to having a "shuttle shift" over anything else if you have to use the clutch. My Case CX or backhoe are really no easier to use than my non shuttle shift Massey Ferguson. THIS IS ONLY MY OPINION AND YOUR RESULTS MAY VARY.

I probably need to stay off here as I seem to keep stepping into something.

I'm with ya.

 

[jenkinsph]

Triple R,

If the snow will ever let up and let it dry out I think I will make myself scarce here too. but while I am here I might as well argue with somebody.

You aren't alone!

 

[TripleR]

Triple R,

If the snow will ever let up and let it dry out I think I will make myself scarce here too. but while I am here I might as well argue with somebody.

You aren't alone!

I think I am probably suffering from symptoms of tractor withdrawal and don't like to argue, so I guess I am in trouble.

 

[Task]

I have a Massey Ferguson 1440 with Power Shuttle 16 speed Fwd. and 16 speed Rev. 2 shift levers on left side of seat, 4 ranges and 4 gears = 16 speed. A fwd. rev. lever on the left side of the steering wheel, this shift lever does not require the clutch.

I've only had it for a short time, but I'm very pleased with this tractor. 40 hp compact utility. It is the closest trans. to a HST. with out going HST.