Engine Shutdown Systems

[SandburRanch]

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/john-deere-owning-operating/346702-engine-overheated-2510-a.html

Reading this post prompts the question : Has there been any improvement made in shut down systems that keep one from the expensive repairs as in the above post? Water and oil temperature shut downs have been the norm on industrial engines for several decades and why has the tractor industry been so slow to catch up?

 

[boggen]

more relays, more fuses, dedication to an on board computer chip that records information.

are you wanting a full "wiring harness" on a tractor like vehicles have? along with a couple computer chips?

do tractors need anti lock brakes? do tractors need sensors for air bag deployment? do they need exhaust sensors? air manifold sensor? temp sensor? RPM sensor? fuel type sensor? coolant sensor (antifreeze to water mixture), due they need multi heat sensors, to deal with "warm up" in say cold temperatures, or use of temp sensors for "cool down" before coolant system shuts off? do they need engine oil full or low sensor? transmission heat sensor? transmission oil full/low sensor? final drive / rear end oil sensor? hydraulic oil sensor for FEL/3pt hitch sensor? position sensors for FEL arms, and FEL bucket, 3pt hitch up/down sensors, outside temperature sensor, humidity sensor of outside air, then temperature and humidity sensor inside cab for heat and/or A/C? do they need battery sensor and current draw on battery? what about charging sensor for alternator? is there a sensor on each "valve" for positioning, include "max pressure relief valves"? RPM per tire? steering sensor? tilt sensors? gps sensor?

any sensor on a tractor is prone to failure. from dust to ramming tractor into things (dirt, bumpy roads, etc...) weeds snagging wires and ripping the wires out.

if any one of these sensors go bad... does it completely shut down the tractor? or big old "dummy light" come on? is there a sound that gets heard? will you be able to see the light or hear the sound over general operation of tractor? my eyes rarely look at dash board by steering wheel or dash board on side, my eyes are every were else but looking at dummy lights. and many 3pt hitch attachments even tractor itself can be rather loud at times. in a vehicle (car/truck) eyes are front nearly all the time, and dummy lights are within view.

i am willing to admit that a few times over years i never noticed temp gauge going up, till most likely a few plus minutes have passed. i check it regularly with a quick glance but not every single minute. one time low on coolant, (leak developed), other time thermostat went bad, another time wrong mixture of antifreeze / water, other times radiator plugged up with crud. another time the hydraulic oil cooler was plugged with crud, another time transmission cooler was plugged up crud.

do you want KISS (keep it simply stupid) as much as possible (least amount of wires possible)? or full on board diagnostics with a small computer screen? or in between some sort of "check engine light"?

anything that requires some sort of computer to be plugged in, more likely will require a "dealer service", and more likely trailing tractor to local dealer. even for a cheap sensor that goes bad. that all but takes a few minutes to check with computer, pull part and put in new part? yet costs a few hundred bucks (counting trailing tractor to dealer and back to you)...

 

[SandburRanch]

The question was KISS. Can you answer the question about water and oil temperature shutdowns?

 

[Harry in Ky]

While such systems have indeed been around for years (Murphy is the first name that comes to mind), and they are well known for engine failure prevention. I think the main reason you don't see them installed on tractors is because most will trigger immediate shut down. This can be a safety factor (here we go again) in certain circumstances and thereby generate liability issues. I know such systems can be designed to activate any number of warning devices, lights, bells, whistles, etc, but that would be only as effective as the operator's attention span allows.
Personally, I doubt the added cost vs the effectiveness would be very well received in the marketplace. Just my opinion.

 

[BHD]

a very simple system I set up for my old generator, (made with an old combine harvester motor, I went to the auto parts store and found a oil pressure switch that did not ground out but had two terminals and it was for an warning light, I hooked in line with ignition (coil) it may have been normally on and when low pressure it would break the connection, I put two start buttons on the dash, one for the start and one to by pass the low oil switch, as soon as it starts and starts to build oil pressure I can release the second push button, one could use a stander grounding oil pressure switch with a relay, but by pass it in a similar way put in a toggle to break the circuit.
some thing like this. is what I used,
https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/productdetails.asp?RecID=88

my guess is I could rig up some thing similar on the heat side of it, or in series so both would work on the same shut down system,

 

[SandburRanch]

a very simple system I set up for my old generator, (made with an old combine harvester motor, I went to the auto parts store and found a oil pressure switch that did not ground out but had two terminals and it was for an warning light, I hooked in line with ignition (coil) it may have been normally on and when low pressure it would break the connection, I put two start buttons on the dash, one for the start and one to by pass the low oil switch, as soon as it starts and starts to build oil pressure I can release the second push button, one could use a stander grounding oil pressure switch with a relay, but by pass it in a similar way put in a toggle to break the circuit.
some thing like this. is what I used,
https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/productdetails.asp?RecID=88

my guess is I could rig up some thing similar on the heat side of it, or in series so both would work on the same shut down system,

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Exactly, and it seems a spring loaded toggle would be just the thing for a start bypass.