Engine oil pumping into hydrolics

[sd455dan]

This is why chinese stuff has no value. Not only does this stuff happen, but getting parts is virtually impossible,……i am sorry you spent money on this tractor. This is obviously why it was being sold. I would go back to the seller, with several large rowdy friends, drop off the tractor, and demand your money back.

Yeah my 554 has never done any work...
Just mowed about 15 acres yesterday

So far far, better than the poor Kubota owner who had to spend over $10000 Out of Pocket to get a running 6 year old tractor- after the entire fuel injection system catastrophically died instantly...


Parts are going to be a headache that is a fact, but that is a recent development.

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[Bob Rooks]

Bob not saying you are not right. How can hyd oil get into engine from the hyd pump? This is going be interesting when we find out for sure.

(Hmm, double negative) That's easy. When the pump deadheads it is capable of producing pressure exceeding it's design (we're talking maybe a 5,000 psi spike). The oil is forced past the ends of the gears and along the input shaft, through both lip seals, through the drive gear sleeve bearing, and into the crankcase. Depending on engine speed, the crankcase could fill quite rapidly.

 

[Leejohn]

Bob I guess we well have to wait and see were this goes, but it is interesting.

 

[Bob Rooks]

Yeah my 554 has never done any work...
Just mowed about 15 acres yesterday

So far, far better than the poor Kubota owner who had to spend over $10000 Out of Pocket to get a running 6 year old tractor- after the entire fuel injection system catastrophically died instantly...

Parts are going to be a headache that is a fact, but that is a recent development.

I'd just ignore that poster. He brings nothing meaningful to the table. Those pine needles - GEEZ!

 

[sd455dan]

I'd just ignore that poster. He brings nothing meaningful to the table. Those pine needles - GEEZ!

yeah it was late and the troll type post hit me wrong.

I should have let it go.

..

a pic of the rear seal of the Shanghai 495A engine block both an outer seal #43 and the actual crankshaft seal #44 assuming the 552 is the same as my 554 which i am not convinced yet

 

[ruffdog]

Oil pushing from a bad rear main seal would also have to push past the transmission input shaft seal, all the while not leaking onto the ground from the clutch area. I'm just thinking several of the TBN sleuths would like to have 1 hour looking at this mystery tractor.

 

[TSR]

yeah it was late and the troll type post hit me wrong.

I should have let it go.

..

a pic of the rear seal of the Shanghai 495A engine block both an outer seal #43 and the actual crankshaft seal #44 assuming the 552 is the same as my 554 which i am not convinced yet

A lot of the early tractors from China and Japan the clutch housing were sealed to keep water out when using them in the rice paddy. The bad thing here because they were sealed condensation would rust everything inside. I may have missed this but did the clutch housing ever get checked to see if it had oil in it. Most of "our" tractors will have a weep hole for fluids to run out and some with a cotter pin in it so as not to get plugged up. It is possible to fill the bell housing and go through the input shaft into the transmission because most input seals never are renewed. Some have a drain plug on the bottom. Remove the plug and check for oil..... Better have a drain pan!

 

[Bob Rooks]

A lot of the early tractors from China and Japan the clutch housing were sealed to keep water out when using them in the rice paddy. The bad thing here because they were sealed condensation would rust everything inside. I may have missed this but did the clutch housing ever get checked to see if it had oil in it. Most of "our" tractors will have a weep hole for fluids to run out and some with a cotter pin in it so as not to get plugged up. It is possible to fill the bell housing and go through the input shaft into the transmission because most input seals never are renewed. Some have a drain plug on the bottom. Remove the plug and check for oil..... Better have a drain pan!

This issue has been addressed in previous posts.

 

[sd455dan]

A lot of the early tractors from China and Japan the clutch housing were sealed to keep water out when using them in the rice paddy. The bad thing here because they were sealed condensation would rust everything inside. I may have missed this but did the clutch housing ever get checked to see if it had oil in it. Most of "our" tractors will have a weep hole for fluids to run out and some with a cotter pin in it so as not to get plugged up. It is possible to fill the bell housing and go through the input shaft into the transmission because most input seals never are renewed. Some have a drain plug on the bottom. Remove the plug and check for oil..... Better have a drain pan!

Right a lot of the rice paddy tractors were sealed The Shanghai tractors were in fact used for paddy use as well as everything else.

Speaking of paddy use here is an old video of a old Shanghai 500 (2 wheel drive) workin in a paddy field.

Will check and see If my tractors bell housing has a drain and pin.

Edit
yes the 554 has a drain with pin under the steering column which is part of the bell housing

 

[buickanddeere]

Hydraulic

 

[sd455dan]

OP

I just had a crazy thought.

Is it possible the previous owner messed with the oil pressure gauge line?...

The factory brazed a hard line from a fitting just behind and above the engine oil filter housing (Right side of engine block). which leads only to the engine oil pressure gauge.
Is your gauge still in the dash connected and working?

 

[Horseshoe#2]

The small gear on the left drives the hydraulic pump via the big idler above it. It rotates at engine speed on a sleeve bearing. It has a stub shaft with a seal that connects to the pump shaft, so engine oil will not migrate to the hydraulics. Virtually impossible. Yeah, I know we're discussing the transmission.

View attachment 701693

Sorry haven’t had a chance to mess with it until today. Clutch is dry . I know
The tractor had been sitting for a few years befor I bought it. Could it have drank that much oil? I do not see anyway oil could get to trans. But trans is way over full. So idk. Can hydro get into the trans in the rear of the tractor somehow. I unplugged all the hydra lines going to fill the oil and run it again when I can and see what happens.

 

[Horseshoe#2]

OP

I just had a crazy thought.

Is it possible the previous owner messed with the oil pressure gauge line?...

The factory brazed a hard line from a fitting just behind and above the engine oil filter housing (Right side of engine block). which leads only to the engine oil pressure gauge.
Is your gauge still in the dash connected and working?

Looks like that has been disconnected.

 

[Horseshoe#2]

Would this be it?

 

[sd455dan]

YEP that is it. That is the engine oil pressure gauge connection point.

You absolutely do not want to run the tractor engine with hydraulic lines disconnected when they have quick connects.

If there is no relief valve on the pump output line it will dead head the pump and something will have to give like fracturing the pump housing.

In pic two of four the forward pump is the one that on my tractor runs the FEL and power beyond for my rear remotes and grapple. The top of that pump is the inlet and pulls oil from the main transmission rear axle sump. the bottom of that pump is the hi pressure output, and like mine in your picture No relief is in that circuit.

The rear pump that is mounted right behind the front housing on the same axis as the pump mentioned above is a constant pressure pump for your power steering. The first pic with the small round tank on the left side of the tractor just under the fuel tank behind the engine starter is the Power steering fluid reservoir. It does not power anything else. from the pictures your tractor has one of the other power steering systems it is different from what mine looks like.
There is also a 3rd pump in the transmission sump on my tractor and probably yours- It powers the 3 point.

Hope this is helpful.

 

[Horseshoe#2]

Yes thank you. I will reconnect the quick connects. Thanks again. Always ran old 8 and 9 n fords this stuff is all new to me . But learning fast thanks to all of you.

 

[Bob Rooks]

How's it going, Horseshoe#2?

 

[Horseshoe#2]

Well I drained the the transmission down to where it should be. And filled the oil but haven’t had a chance to run it for a long period yet to see what happens. The clutch is dry. No oil in there at all. So I still don’t know what happened. Will hopefully get a chance this weekend and we will see what happens. I don’t think the front hydra pumps is working doesn’t seem to be any pressure at all so idk.

 

[sd455dan]

Well I drained the the transmission down to where it should be. And filled the oil but haven’t had a chance to run it for a long period yet to see what happens. The clutch is dry. No oil in there at all. So I still don’t know what happened. Will hopefully get a chance this weekend and we will see what happens. I don’t think the front hydra pumps is working doesn’t seem to be any pressure at all so idk.

Couple more questions does this tractor have an FEL? I can see the return hydraulic line for the transmission/axle sump is connected.
That is the large line next to the transmission dipstick. Where is the return line going?

It "should be connected to the FEL valve block or the remote block if it has remotes- either way it is the return to the sump for the hydraulics and it is returning the Open Center system oil from the most forward pump that almost touches the engine radiator.

Just want to make sure someone did not find a way to connect the return line into the engines oil system somehow.

 

[Horseshoe#2]

Bottom line on front pump hooks to remote block. Top line on pump hooks to bottom of transmission