Electric over hydraulic remote setup?

[aczlan]

I'll take pictures of it all tommorow so you'll see what I have to work with. Im driving myself nuts thinking about what I want to do with it. I dont understand the 5th hose though. I thought the hydraulics were all in series and out of one would be the pressure into another valve. All the othe hydraulic lines are hard lines and its hard to distinguish what does what you know.

The problem is that if you have the 3 point set to go up while the grapple is closing, the grapple might not close until it is pushing out with enough force to lift the 3 point. See Hydraulic valve power beyond or high pressure carry over for some diagrams on how it works. If you look at your loader valve, it should have 7 ports (4 work ports and 3 other ports).

Aaron Z

 

[MtnViewRanch]

Take some good pictures of the back above the 3pt so we can see where we might be able to install the other valves and or the QD ends if you go that way. Are you against making a mount off of the ROPS to place some manual valves and maybe a plate in back to mount the QD outlets? The EX3200 is a clean little tractor and we should be able to come up with a very nice setup for it.

 

[puckgrinder85]

The problem is that if you have the 3 point set to go up while the grapple is closing, the grapple might not close until it is pushing out with enough force to lift the 3 point. See Hydraulic valve power beyond or high pressure carry over for some diagrams on how it works. If you look at your loader valve, it should have 7 ports (4 work ports and 3 other ports).

Aaron Z

I dont use both at the same time, grapple and 3pt. However if I try to lift the 3pt with the grapple installed it doesnt lift any real weight untill the grapple either opens or closes (depending on which way I have my hoses connected) OR if I hold the handle of the grapple in the center to allow pressure to the 3pt. Anytime I raise the 3pt the grapple lever will move and stays in position untill the 3pt hits the height my control lever wants it at. Pictures will be here today as soon as I get to the shop.

 

[puckgrinder85]

Take some good pictures of the back above the 3pt so we can see where we might be able to install the other valves and or the QD ends if you go that way. Are you against making a mount off of the ROPS to place some manual valves and maybe a plate in back to mount the QD outlets? The EX3200 is a clean little tractor and we should be able to come up with a very nice setup for it.

Well, no but I got excited when I saw your picture thinking there may a more suitable way to save space and hydraulic hose. If anything a two spool valve would likely be just fine, I probably will never need the extra remote for anything. And to be honest the grapple remote will be open to use when the grapple bucket isnt on, so two would be just fine actually now that I really think about it.

 

[puckgrinder85]

Ok, here are a few pics of the valve. Dont know if you can make it all out but from the "out" from the tractor goes to the valve, the opposing orifice on the valve loops back up the rear of the tractor and goes to "return". The other two lines just go to the front of the tractor as work outlets.

 

[puckgrinder85]

Here is some pics of the right fender area. The fender is decently stable, probably enough to mount a valve body to.

 

[J_J]

The log splitter valve is probably not a good choice for the grapple, if it does not have a PB port and connected correctly.

The action of one valve should not affect the log splitter valve if the log splitter valve is connected correctly.

If your log splitter valve only has 4 hoses, then it is not a PB type valve, and you run the risk of damage.

You should probably remove the log splitter valve and install a three spool valve for the remotes., and use one of the spools for the grapple, or add a diverter valve to the front curl circuit, and us the joystick curl circuit for the grapple. .

 

[puckgrinder85]

I guess im trying to wrap my head around the 5th hose thats suppose to be coming out of the valve, I understand its to go back to the tank but thats about it. I've tried reading a few things about the subject buts its just not clicking in my head. Cub makes a rear remote kit for this tractor, part kit number RR300.

Here is the parts breakdown:
Parts and Diagrams for Cub Cadet RR300 Rear Remote


It doesnt look all that extensive really. I wish I could get an instruction sheet PDF to see how and where to install this "5th line" to go back to the tank. Everything is so jambed packed under the tractor I dont really know what i'm looking at.

 

[J_J]

That link does not work for me.

On most single spool valve, you would have an

IN port -from pump
OUT port- cyl expended fluid to tank
work port A - to cyl
Work port B - to cyl
Maybe a PB port - to down stream valve

All return lines should go to tank.

Return hoses can be teed together.

Can also run it into the fill cap.

 

[MtnViewRanch]

I guess im trying to wrap my head around the 5th hose thats suppose to be coming out of the valve, I understand its to go back to the tank but thats about it. I've tried reading a few things about the subject buts its just not clicking in my head. Cub makes a rear remote kit for this tractor, part kit number RR300.

Here is the parts breakdown:
Parts and Diagrams for Cub Cadet RR300 Rear Remote


It doesnt look all that extensive really. I wish I could get an instruction sheet PDF to see how and where to install this "5th line" to go back to the tank. Everything is so jambed packed under the tractor I dont really know what i'm looking at.

I might be wrong, but looking at how the line runs, I don't think that you need a valve with power beyond. I think that you can just run the pressure line from the left side of your loop to the pressure port on a valve and then have the tank line off of the valve go back to the right side of the loop. I'm thinking that the side marked return just dumps into the tank and does not go any place else. If this is the case, then you do not need the 3rd power beyond line that has been talked about.

 

[J_J]

The valve might not have a PB port.

It could have one or two IN or OUT ports

Show some up close pictures.

 

[puckgrinder85]

Its only in and out, no other ports on it.


If you read the rear plate on my tractor in the first pic is say "use only open center remote valves". I think i may just get a service manual and see if there is a hydraulic diagram in there. I dont know how much closer of a picture you need, I was right there and thats all you can see of the valve. Again the valve is getting replaced anyway so im not too concern with it, mainly concerned if I can hook up and open center valve block and be fine. I'll try calling a few dealers maybe they've ran into it before as well.

 

[J_J]

No idea what the fifth hose from the log splitter valve is. Only you can figure that out.

Just remove the log splitter valve, as it is not the proper valve anyway.

Obtain a 3 spool valve with PB and put it where the log splitter valve was or close by. The PB from the loader would connect to the IN port of the 3 spool valve, the PB from the 3 spool valve would to to the return port on the tractor as it probably feeds the 3pt. Run another hose from the OUT port of the 3 spool valve to a return line from the loader valve or dump it into the filler cap.

Use one of the spools for the grapple, and the other two for the T-N-T.

That's it, done.

 

[puckgrinder85]

I might be wrong, but looking at how the line runs, I don't think that you need a valve with power beyond. I think that you can just run the pressure line from the left side of your loop to the pressure port on a valve and then have the tank line off of the valve go back to the right side of the loop. I'm thinking that the side marked return just dumps into the tank and does not go any place else. If this is the case, then you do not need the 3rd power beyond line that has been talked about.

I think you're right. My tractor is identical to a JD 790 and I've seen pictures of thise hose plumbed directly to a valve on the fender and right back to the open port on a john deere 790. I dotn know why these tractors are so similar but looking at them is eerie, same **** tractor! I think it will work just as it is. Thinking the valve I have now is just not the right one for the function.

 

[MtnViewRanch]

I think you're right. My tractor is identical to a JD 790 and I've seen pictures of thise hose plumbed directly to a valve on the fender and right back to the open port on a john deere 790. I dotn know why these tractors are so similar but looking at them is eerie, same **** tractor! I think it will work just as it is. Thinking the valve I have now is just not the right one for the function.

Remove the return line at the case and look inside. If there is a tube, then it most likely goes on to something else. If it just dumps into the case, well, it just dumps back into the case and for sure no power beyond is needed. Pretty simple actually.

 

[J_J]

Only the OUT port on the remote valve would dumps to tank.

There may be two ports on the side of the tractor, one for the PB, and the other one for the OUT/return.

All the valves should be in series, so the PB output from the remote should go to the 3pt port on the side of the tractor, and the OUT line would go to tank port.

 

[puckgrinder85]

Ok, so I finally got word from the factory and got the "factory" rear remote kit instructions and took a look at them. All this kit does is take pressure from the pump BEFORE any valves and routes it through a normal looking valve (does not appear to have PB as there only 4 hoses) and then this fluid pressure goes into the loader valve which is suppose to be the first valve inline. Mind you this is the factory kit instructions. That seems sort of odd its not a PB valve.

I plan on doing the same thing just downstream between the loader valve and the 3pt valving. \


I have the instructions if anyone wants to see how its "suppose" to be done, this would be for a JD790 as well.

 

[J_J]

Are you talking about the hyd block on the side of the tractor? If so, that block is capable of high pressure.

 

[puckgrinder85]

No, this is the factory add on remote valve they locate on the fender, just like most guys here are doing. Instead they plumb it between the pump and loader valve, before the loader valve to be exact. Looking at how the lines are run in the system pressure comes from the pump up to the top of the transmission case into a series of pressure relief valves(which i see on the diagram). From there it goes out of this into a high pressure line which then connects to the loader valve (Loader has a "P" on this port so I know its the inlet to the loader valve.

All they do is take this high pressre line out and put the applicable fittings in and run that pressure through their 'rear remote" valve. 4 lines total, pressure, return and two work lines. Thats it! From the remote valve it goes straight into the loader valve. The loader valve is obviously a PB valve as it has the other two ports, tank and PB clearly marked.

Its wierd a factory would do this as there would be obvious backpressure on the valve when operating the loader. If you PM me your email I can send the file over to you so you can examine it, its a .PDF file.

Like I said Im doing the same thing, except my lines come out downstream of the loader valve itself.


Btw- this is an 800$ option and is maybe 200$ in actual parts.




Ps- I just asked the factory for the instructions to see how they did it and this is what I came up with, with their instructions. Its clear as day what they are doing, i just dont understand the no PB valve.

 

[MtnViewRanch]

I imagine that the OEM valve has a high pressure rating on all 4 ports where as the $200 valve that you have mentioned most likely does not. Stuff use to be plumbed like this all the time.