Eco Boost vs V8

[s219]

There's nothing remarkable about the engine by itself, if you look around and see engines other manufacturers have put into cars for years (and I should note, they have done it without the intercooler issues that Ford has run into -- so that's a rookie mistake by Ford).

What's remarkable about the engine is that it was put into a large-scale-production truck, which is a first as far as I know. It has been well tuned and spec'd for truck uses. So I give Ford full credit for that.

 

[RedNeckRacin]

Long term reliability in an engine can only be proven by long term use in the application. Time will tell how the engine holds up regardless of how the die hard fans support or deny it. I'm very curious to see how well it withstands some abuse, but the real test will be when (IF) they put it in a heavier duty truck platform.

Half-ton trucks are toys/daily commute/part runner vehicles in my book. I have never owned less than a one ton truck. (i have had a couple cars but thats a different category)

On the positive side; however, I can't imagine a better test platform to see if the higher performance engines can handle truck duty over the long run. I would think that half ton trucks are pushed to their design specs and farther more often than any other class of trucks. Who knows, maybe we are standing on the door step of multi-turbo gas engines being a standard alternative to the much higher priced diesels? opcorntub:

 

[ruffdog]

It's not only turbo but directly injected like a diesel.

What makes it so special is 3.5L, mor usable power than any current V8 twice it's size while getting 20 or better economy.

Chris

Why so many ecoboost owners on the ford sites upset about the mileage?

 

[aczlan]

On the positive side; however, I can't imagine a better test platform to see if the higher performance engines can handle truck duty over the long run. I would think that half ton trucks are pushed to their design specs and farther more often than any other class of trucks. Who knows, maybe we are standing on the door step of multi-turbo gas engines being a standard alternative to the much higher priced diesels? opcorntub:

It would be interesting to see a smallish (4-5L?) V8 version of the EcoBoost in a 1 ton instead of a V10 or a big block V8.

Aaron Z

 

[ruffdog]

Modern engines outlast the vehicles they are put in with just normal maintenance. I would not worry one bit about it.

Chris

Tell that to this guy that had his ecoboost replaced THREE times because they kept blowing up on him. http://www.f150forum.com/f70/first-time-my-eco-blew-up-208912/

 

[aczlan]

Why so many ecoboost owners on the ford sites upset about the mileage?

Because they get V8 like gas mileage while using V8 like power and they want to have V6 like gas mileage while getting V8 like power.
If you are running unloaded or with a light load on the engine AND you keep it out of heavy boost, you will get good mileage. If you always have the turbos spooled up and making a lot of boost, your gas mileage will go down.

Aaron Z

 

[ruffdog]

Because they get V8 like gas mileage while using V8 like power and they want to have V6 like gas mileage while getting V8 like power.
If you are running unloaded or with a light load on the engine AND you keep it out of heavy boost, you will get good mileage. If you always have the turbos spooled up and making a lot of boost, your gas mileage will go down.

Aaron Z

So, just like the GM trucks with their AFM running on 4 cylinders until you stick your foot into it?

 

[aczlan]

So, just like the GM trucks with their AFM running on 4 cylinders until you stick your foot into it?

Only without the excessive oil consumption and with more power :stirthepot:

Aaron Z

 

[ironnut]

There's nothing remarkable about the engine by itself, if you look around and see engines other manufacturers have put into cars for years (and I should note, they have done it without the intercooler issues that Ford has run into -- so that's a rookie mistake by Ford).

What's remarkable about the engine is that it was put into a large-scale-production truck, which is a first as far as I know. It has been well tuned and spec'd for truck uses. So I give Ford full credit for that.

Actually there is quite a bag of tricks in these engines. The two turbo chargers supply significant amounts of boost even at low throttle settings. The use of electronically controlled valve timing allows most of the this boost to flow through the engine at low throttle settings. When you stick your foot into it, the valve timing changes and the exhaust valves close earlier stopping the flow through and increasing the pressure in the cylinder. The direct gas injection system then adds the appropriate amount of fuel for the increased volume and you get an immediate response, i.e. no turbo lag. The direct gas injection system allows for this bit of magic while maintaining some measure of fuel economy. I don't know if the direct gas injection system does a staged injection sequence similar to what current diesels use or not, if it does, then there is probably a commensurate ignition sequence.

All of this adds considerably to the stresses on the engine components. Whether Ford has done due diligence in this arena is yet to be known. I am rather amazed at the pressures that the direct gas injection system uses and astonished at what current diesels run at. Given that gasoline has essentially no lubricity making a gas injection pump reliable must be quite an exercise in metallurgy, materials science, and engineering. The latter is what gave me pause in considering a new vehicle purchase containing one of these engines.

gordon

 

[The Fred]

EVERY ECO F-150 owner I have talked to including friends who work at the local Ford establishment tell me the gas mileage is actually worse than the V8 model. Most of these folks don't tow anything. They do however like the extra power. I have never driven one but a local farmer here tows loaded forage wagons with his 2 and likes the new powerband, in fact he can't say enough good about it.

Maybe they could do a F-250 with same engine it's gotta be better than the old 5.4 boat anchor.


Fred

 

[ruffdog]

The neighbor brags about his ecoboost mileage but his on dash average is the same as my GMC 5.3L and he does more highway driving.

 

[psj12]

I own an 2011 ECO Boost and like it. It gets near advertised mileage on the highway and has plenty of power. I did have the moisture issue in the intercooler and it was promptly fixed by the local dealer after I told him I was aware of the problem. No issues since.
I believe very few people will achieve the advertised mileage on any vehicle simply because of the way the manufactures are allowed to calculate it. I don't drive like a computer. Do you?

 

[tcartwri]

Why so many ecoboost owners on the ford sites upset about the mileage?

The ecoboost produces about 12-14 psi of boost, which effectively turns the motor into a 7 Litre motor.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Why so many ecoboost owners on the ford sites upset about the mileage?

We're not. 18.3mpg in my father's 2011 since new. It will do 24 mpg at 60 mph with 1000# of men in it.

Pulling identical tandem axle enclosed trailers my father's Eco Boost averaged just under 13 mpg while my Nissan Titan got just over 9. This was a 250 mile trip one way. To me thats impressive.


Chris

 

[Diamondpilot]

The neighbor brags about his ecoboost mileage but his on dash average is the same as my GMC 5.3L and he does more highway driving.

Easy to do with a gutless 5.3 GM.

Chris

 

[DeereMann]

It will be interesting to see price for new smaller diesels (half tons) vs. eco-boost S.I. engines. It seems to me the amount of whizzy bells & whistles is getting close to the same?

Yes, yes, - I know you need a DEF tank & meter with the diesel. But not dual turbos etc.

 

[TomSeller]

I believe it is a new design from the ground up.

This says it is built on the Duratec 35 block. If I understand the Duratec 37, it is bored out 35. Maybe Ford wanted to keep the effectively sturdier 35 block for the Eco application.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_EcoBoost_engine

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duratec_35

 

[ruffdog]

Like you, the neighbor talks so much about the mileage in the 20s but his average is still at 16mpg.

 

[ruffdog]

It would be interesting to see a smallish (4-5L?) V8 version of the EcoBoost in a 1 ton instead of a V10 or a big block V8.

Aaron Z

I don't know how many new engines Ford will be able to come out with being that they are paying the government back $5.9 Billion. The first payment was $577 Million and the total will be paid by 2022.Automakers' Report Card: Who Still Owes Taxpayers Money? The Answer Might Surprise You - Forbes

 

[RedNeckRacin]

It would be interesting to see a smallish (4-5L?) V8 version of the EcoBoost in a 1 ton instead of a V10 or a big block V8.

Aaron Z

I agree. I don't have any idea if it's in the pipeline though.

I just heard on the radio today that the gas tax just went up Jan 1st in pa and is scheduled to go up two more times to pay for the lack of upkeep on the infrastructure in the state. Would be nice to switch to $.70/gallon cheaper fuel if it was comparable to a diesel but got better mileage when empty?