Comparison Drag implements on John Deere Hydrostatics vs. Kubota Hydrostatics.

[CADplans]

Look at the PTO rating of any tractor with the same engine availabe in both gear and HST.
The HST will always have a significantly lower PTO rating of HP compared to the gear drive.

That is because the HST is converting a significant percentage of HP to heat.

Pulling a ground engaging attachment will cause the most heating with a HST.
Luckily, very few users of HST tractors ever use a ground engaging attachment any more,,,
that is old fashoned farming,, plows and discs have been replaced by chemicals.

That said, you need a pretty big attachment to use the HP of a 50HP tractor.
A 6 row cultivator,, at a pretty fast ground speed,, something like that.

Pulling a 2 row cultivator at 0.60MPH with a 50HP HST would never be an issue,,,
JD or Kubota,, or any other brand.

 

[TripleR]

Oftentimes when this is brought up, "conventional wisdom" will be to to go gear for ground engaging tasks and HST for lighter stuff. I grew up farming with geared tractors and still like them for really heavy pulling, but I routinely use my L5740HSTC to pull my 1100 pound HR3584 with rippers down and have never had problems nor do I expect any. If any HST on a tractor won't pull well, I have no use for it.

Now if I went back to 8-10 hours, 6 days a week pulling a breaking plow etc., I wouldn't be using an HST or CUT, but that's just my preference.

I am more than willing to change my mind given proof to the contrary.

 

[motownbrowne]

Oftentimes when this is brought up, "conventional wisdom" will be to to go gear for ground engaging tasks and HST for lighter stuff. I grew up farming with geared tractors and still like them for really heavy pulling, but I routinely use my L5740HSTC to pull my 1100 pound HR3584 with rippers down and have never had problems nor do I expect any. If any HST on a tractor won't pull well, I have no use for it.

Now if I went back to 8-10 hours, 6 days a week pulling a breaking plow etc., I wouldn't be using an HST or CUT, but that's just my preference.

I am more than willing to change my mind given proof to the contrary.

This.

For pulling a heavy draft implement all day (especially in an ag setting), a bigger geared tractor makes more sense, for several reasons. Gears are more efficient, gears may be cheaper to fix, geared tractors are cheaper, etc.

Like you say, though, if you've got I've tractor and you need to pull something, you use what you've got.

 

[TripleR]

This.

For pulling a heavy draft implement all day (especially in an ag setting), a bigger geared tractor makes more sense, for several reasons. Gears are more efficient, gears may be cheaper to fix, geared tractors are cheaper, etc.

Like you say, though, if you've got I've tractor and you need to pull something, you use what you've got.

No argument there: "Now if I went back to 8-10 hours, 6 days a week pulling a breaking plow etc., I wouldn't be using an HST or CUT, but that's just my preference."

All of our tractors except the L5740 and 3 SCUTS are geared, seven I think.

 

[motownbrowne]

No argument there: "Now if I went back to 8-10 hours, 6 days a week pulling a breaking plow etc., I wouldn't be using an HST or CUT, but that's just my preference."

All of our tractors except the L5740 and 3 SCUTS are geared, seven I think.

Yes sir, I quoted your post to agree with you. I thought you were making good sense.

 

[art]

Been around hydro's since the 70's and they do tillage work! They do burn more fuel then a gear would and you do feel the horsepower loss of the hydro but the speeds are infinite and they do work!!! In our area it used to be the old IH for the potato harvesters and transplanters. Dairy farms did the mowing with them do to the ground speeds they could mow at vs gear tractors, some were used for forage crop harvesting. Hydro's will work, will burn more fuel then a gear drive but you will never hear a gear grind or replace a clutch!

 

[plesciad]

Yep, 13.6x28s. We grow vegetables in 40" raised beds. I have the tires spaced as 53" on center.

Are you shaping/listing beds into 40" bed tops, or just planting on the flat?

I busted out the tape measure and, with 13.6 rears, I came out with, like you say, 39" bed tops. Subtracting a couple inches for slope/soil erosion/because I can't drive straight, I get 37" bed tops.

Good to hear you're liking it this size. The full story is, my friend nearby farms veggies with an MX, likes it, but is often annoyed by his bed top size (awkward spacings / 7 more inches and he could fit another row of lettuce, etc.).... hence my obsession right now with 60" centers. We'll see...

Thanks for your thoughts, everyone, very helpful

 

[midwesternhayfarmer]

Let me know what you read, if you find anything out. Drawbar horsepower isn't listed in the sales literature, I'd be curious to know what the manual says about it. Thanks!

Read through my owners manual and could not find anything limiting implements to be pulled. The only restriction is weight maximum of wagons being pulled in relation to stopping ability. Didnt find any drawbar horsepower mentioned in either the owners manual or on tractordata.com.

Commenting on several other posts about long term plowing or ripping, I would have to agree having grown up using a gear drive tractor. The 4052R is available with cruise control, load match and speed match.

I believe you can use load match with either cruise control ar speed match. Load match will slow tractor movement to prevent engine stall.

Cruise is engaged when desired ground speed is achieved and can be adjusted up or down like an automotive cruise.

Speed match is set when maximum desired ground speed is achieved and will limit maximum ground speed no matter how far the forward pedal is pushed.

It sounds like either cruise or speed match could be used for long term plowing just like runnig a geared tractor. Don't know the limits of the load match if it will reduce ground speed to a crawl if the pull is severe enough or wheels spin out.

Cruise would allow you to have your foot completely off foot pedals while plowing and disengage it to move quicker on the ends where speed match requires you to keep your foot on the pedal while plowing, limiting your speed on the ends but allowing you to slow down or stop whenever you want.

 

[BrokeFarmerJohn]

Read through my owners manual and could not find anything limiting implements to be pulled. The only restriction is weight maximum of wagons being pulled in relation to stopping ability. Didnt find any drawbar horsepower mentioned in either the owners manual or on tractordata.com.

Commenting on several other posts about long term plowing or ripping, I would have to agree having grown up using a gear drive tractor. The 4052R is available with cruise control, load match and speed match.

I believe you can use load match with either cruise control ar speed match. Load match will slow tractor movement to prevent engine stall.

Cruise is engaged when desired ground speed is achieved and can be adjusted up or down like an automotive cruise.

Speed match is set when maximum desired ground speed is achieved and will limit maximum ground speed no matter how far the forward pedal is pushed.

It sounds like either cruise or speed match could be used for long term plowing just like runnig a geared tractor. Don't know the limits of the load match if it will reduce ground speed to a crawl if the pull is severe enough or wheels spin out.

Cruise would allow you to have your foot completely off foot pedals while plowing and disengage it to move quicker on the ends where speed match requires you to keep your foot on the pedal while plowing, limiting your speed on the ends but allowing you to slow down or stop whenever you want.

I have a JD 4320 HST, I love the size for my needs but like midwestern said in very good detail the cruise and load match is something you need for ground work, geared tractors are just that, each gear has a certain speed and you may find I more desired gear for ground work, with HST unless your watching your spedo which running a plough or something like that is not likely to happen so finding a good speed and setting a cruise would be the way to go on HST so things are more consistent.

Kubota and many other tractors have a dry clutch where JD has a wet clutch. Very few also have 3 range HST. I can't remember exactly, mine does but I was thinking the JD E series and non grand L have 2 stage but don't quote me on that, just pointing out more things to compare.

The brands of tractors are endless, best thing todo is find what dealers in you area have the largest network and ones you like the best because only buy something you can easily find parts for. In my area NH, JD, Mahindra and Kubota has the best network of dealers close by, I was most impressed with the JD dealer but found there E series had a cheaper feel to the tractor. I love my 4320 but it's no E series.

I would not hesitate to work ground with a HST, if you set the wheels way out wide that puts a lot of stress on the machine where it normally wouldn't have would be my concern, but that would be pulling the tractor hard for long hours at faster speeds, I'm no expert but I don't think it would be much of a prob under 1 mph.

 

[jenkinsph]

Oftentimes when this is brought up, "conventional wisdom" will be to to go gear for ground engaging tasks and HST for lighter stuff. I grew up farming with geared tractors and still like them for really heavy pulling, but I routinely use my L5740HSTC to pull my 1100 pound HR3584 with rippers down and have never had problems nor do I expect any. If any HST on a tractor won't pull well, I have no use for it.

Now if I went back to 8-10 hours, 6 days a week pulling a breaking plow etc., I wouldn't be using an HST or CUT, but that's just my preference.

I am more than willing to change my mind given proof to the contrary.

Larry I know what you mean but I suspect the "conventional wisdom" is in some cases hampered by a lack of scope. Lots of conclusions made without enough actual use of each type of transmission in real life scenarios.