Do's and Don'ts and recommendation for buying a PTO driven electricity generator?

[52wej]

Ive got a 17kw propane backup with auto switch, been out of power since Saturday morning. Propane tank ran empty last night with delivery scheduled yesterday but not showing up. PTO generator is much easier to refill and stockpile fuel for. I will be getting a generator plug added to run a smaller generator in the coming weeks once the local electricians get caught up. In central VA supplied by Southside Electric Co-Op, they have gotten about 1/3 of their customer restored to power since Saturday.....

I also am on SEC. My daughter is one of those still out. I think someone from the SEC coop told her they still had 43% of customers out as of yesterday afternoon. The amount of ice damage in this region has been significant. My dad told me that back in the depression the large power companies, Dominion and AEP which both are within two miles of me, would not extend the lines across country to all of the little farms. It took the coops like SEC through the REA to get people the power. THE reality is that SEC has a lot more line to maintain per customer than some of the bigger for profit utilities. So a significant ice storm really hammers them. W. Jones

 

[Diggin It]

^^ Some counties along teh KY/WV line are still over 60% out:

PowerOutage.US

 

[zzvyb6]

For what you pay for the Generac generators, you could buy a second tractor used and dedicate it to just having electricity, running water, heat, A/C, clean clothes, dinner, garage door openers, internet service and no frozen pipes.

Heck, I can run my Winpower off of my 23 H.P. diesel lawn mower if I need the tractor to run down to the Stop N' Go for some pretzels. I'm pretty certain the propeller heads will try to inform me that 23 h.p. won't run a 25 kW pto generator, but I have black & white pictures to prove that it works just fine.

 

[Diggin It]

For what you pay for the Generac generators, you could buy a second tractor used and dedicate it to just having electricity, running water, heat, A/C, clean clothes, dinner, garage door openers, internet service and no frozen pipes.

I'll end up around $4500 or so once my generator is installed and operational. Other than something old and nearly worn out, I doubt I could get a tractor and PTO head for that. Then I'd still have the issue of getting it in place, connected and running during a storm, or over icy/snow covered hills in sub freezing weather. And then I'd still have to fuel it every few hours.

 

[07wingnut]

We debated using a pto generator for backup but decided that the option of an independent generator was the way to go, freeing up the tractor for dealing with the crap that is usually causing the outage. Deciding what type of generator normally depends on the most convenient type of fuel available, and here that does not include propane or NG. Most of those whole house screamers that are sold these days are not very durable, Generac comes to mind, and now Champion. Good luck trying to get service on those when mechanical problems develop. Diesel was the most logical for us, as we need diesel for the tractor as well. What we have now is an eight kw light tower that is powered by a D1105 kubota engine with over 10000hrs on the meter. It runs at 1800 rpm and can reasonably be expected to last another 5000hrs which means it will outlast us by many years. Bonus, the light tower has its own 50 gallon fuel tank, which is also the fuel tank used to fill the tractor.

It was clean when picked up, but got a little contaminated on the way home.

 

[JethroB]

We debated using a pto generator for backup but decided that the option of and independent generator was the way to go, freeing up the tractor for dealing with the crap that is usually causing the outage. Deciding what type of generator normally depends on the most convenient type of fuel available, and here that does not include propane or NG. Most of those whole house screamers that are sold these days are not very durable, Generac comes to mind, and now Champion. Good luck trying to get service on those when mechanical problems develop. Diesel was the most logical for us, as we need diesel for the tractor as well. What we have now is an eight kw light tower that is powered by a D1105 kubota engine with over 10000hrs on the meter. It runs at 1800 rpm and can reasonably be expected to last another 5000hrs which means it will outlast us by many years. Bonus, the light tower has its own 50 gallon fuel tank, which is not also the fuel tank used to fill the tractor.View attachment 687153View attachment 687152

It was clean when picked up, but got a little contaminated on the way home.

That's a nice rig and a great way to repurpose equipment. :thumbsup:

 

[52wej]

ZZ you are correct that a smaller tractor will pull a larger generator........ as long as the total load does not exceed the HP requirements. My 30 hp ran a 25 kw winco unit for 168 hours straight since last Saturday but we made sure the load never exceeded 15 kw, especially with starting larger motors. I have seen tractors jump up and down trying to start a heavy load. But diesel motors do love to run on a constant load like that. And FWIW my daughter got her power back almost 1 week to the minute after going out last Saturday. So our generator has been lovingly tucked back into its shed!! w.jones

 

[Sid Post]

I wonder how the natural gas supply for home generators is holding up in Texas. Anybody have direct experience down there ?
That's why I stuck with a diesel tractor powered Winpower 25 kW job. Plus I can get my neighbors well, furnace and battery chargers going at any time. Once my house is warm, It will stay that way for 4 hours. So I can use the tractor for a 4H parade or whatever your 'critical tractor needs' are that everybody talks about. You can pull trees out of the road, plow snow or teach driver's ed with a truck. No tractor really needed.

BTW: I was told that a log cabin would stop a .50 cal. Ain't so. My Barrett will penetrate a 12" dried oak log at 150 yards and still have enough momentum left to dent a (full) beer can.

Many wellheads froze solid and stopped NG flow. Pumping stations to keep the pressure up failed and stopped NG flow as well.

 

[LittleBill21]

ZZ you are correct that a smaller tractor will pull a larger generator........ as long as the total load does not exceed the HP requirements. My 30 hp ran a 25 kw winco unit for 168 hours straight since last Saturday but we made sure the load never exceeded 15 kw, especially with starting larger motors. I have seen tractors jump up and down trying to start a heavy load. But diesel motors do love to run on a constant load like that. And FWIW my daughter got her power back almost 1 week to the minute after going out last Saturday. So our generator has been lovingly tucked back into its shed!! w.jones

any idea on the fuel burn per hour? and average load?

 

[Sawyer Rob]

I'll end up around $4500 or so once my generator is installed and operational. Other than something old and nearly worn out, I doubt I could get a tractor and PTO head for that. Then I'd still have the issue of getting it in place, connected and running during a storm, or over icy/snow covered hills in sub freezing weather. And then I'd still have to fuel it every few hours.

Once again, you are not accurate in your post...

Are you going to put your whole house generator in the back shed? Maybe in the back of the barn?? A tractor and pto generator can be placed in an enclosure near a house just like the generator you bought.

How much fuel do you think a tractor will use running a generator? Mine uses less than a gallon an hour, so if I have to fuel the tractor every few hours, I guess you think a tractor only has a three gallon tank! lol

SR

 

[Diggin It]

Mine has a 6 gallon tank. If I were burning a gallon an hour, I'd be refueling every 6 hours or less. In normal operation I burn about 1/2 gallon an hour, sometimes more, so I'd still be refueling every 8-10 hours.

My whole house will be connected to a 500 gallon tank, so hopefully it would be able to run several days. More if I ration on/off time. I'm supposed to do that anyways so I can check oil level. Since it's right next to the house, but under cover, I can do that unless the weather is extreme.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

Mine has a 6 gallon tank. If I were burning a gallon an hour, I'd be refueling every 6 hours or less. In normal operation I burn about 1/2 gallon an hour, sometimes more, so I'd still be refueling every 8-10 hours.

My whole house will be connected to a 500 gallon tank, so hopefully it would be able to run several days. More if I ration on/off time. I'm supposed to do that anyways so I can check oil level. Since it's right next to the house, but under cover, I can do that unless the weather is extreme.

Well mine has an 18 gallon tank, and having an enclosure near the house is no big deal, so REALLY it's all about making good choices when buying a tractor in the first place and where you keep it!

SR

 

[Rustyiron]

That makes the thoughts about a larger PTO-powered electric generator seem a lot more practical and it will not be a uni-tasked since I can power stuff remotely like my welder to fix my pipe fence and other things like spinning a concrete mixer away from the house.

As a starting point, I think the diesel tractor-powered generator is my best option but, I'm probably overlooking some factors in my choice. Also, where should I start looking for a PTO-driven electric generator?

TIA,
Sid

As you can see here, everyone has their own needs, you'll figure it out what direction to go. I imagine that a used PTO genny will be hard to find in your area right now for obvious reasons, but your tractor dealers and farmers co op's should be able to find one for your if they don't have one in stock. In normal times you would be able to find one used that if for some reason you find that you would like some type of permanent installation (or anything else) you'd probably be able to sell it at or very near your purchase cost. In my mind there are 2 needs to consider, your need to run a welder and other portable electrical "stuff" around the farm for shorter periods of operation. Then there's the several day duration outages. The PTO will do both, but you need to carefully select a "small" standby generator (and study the fuel usage and duty cycles) for prolonged, several days use. It's hard to beat the "entry cost" of a PTO generator.

 

[LouNY]

They turn up on craigs list fairly often and many farm auctions will have one or two.
You can save a search on Craigs list and it will email you every time one shows up.
Many of the dealers will have few used ones also.

 

[Sid Post]

First, I lived on a farm in Huntsville, AL with well water when the F4 and F5 tornadoes rolled through and took power down for a 100-mile radius for ~2 weeks. Where I live in rural Texas now, I get a lot of short-term power outages.

This has previously taken me down the path to investigate a whole house powered Generac unit power on Natural Gas and Kohler whole house units on diesel or NG. The diesel Onan's used in the trucking industry was the most practical to me. Why?

With a tornado or unusually low temperatures, Natural Gas is often turned off for safety at the supplier by the state. Gasoline is expensive and runs out quickly when the roads close due to cold weather or tornadoes. During a tornado with downed power lines, electrical generation is also cut so the "walking wounded" don't get electrocuted.

For me, this leaves Propane or Diesel are the only viable fuel sources for weather-related electrical power generation.

I also have e lot of Solar power experience but, the batteries alone for a whole house system start at ~$8K and realistically is more in the area of ~$18K. Then there is the issue of where to put that many solar panels and the solar trackers. There is thousands of dollars of wire, power controllers, etc. as well that drive up the cost. And of course, there is ZERO portability and the risk of storm damage due to wind to the panels and electronics.

While I did not consider a light tower for electrical supply (awesome out of the box thinking btw!), a diesel powered welder was one option I did consider. However, it really doesn't have whole-house power capability.

Nate at Messick's is a good source to talk to about Winco PTO-powered options. A 15Kw trailer-mounted unit is $2300 drop-shipped to my front door. 15Kw won't run my whole house but, with a wood-burning stove and some space heaters, it will carry the house well enough to take a warm shower OR do laundry OR use the oven OR ...

The 15Kw trailer-mounted unit is sized well for my Kubota B2601. Do I really want to use it up as the motor as a Generac or similar replacement? Not really but, the likelihood of needing more than 4 days of continuous power generation is pretty low. Once every ~10 years is nothing in the life of Kubota motor of this class. If I use it up, a replacement is relatively cheap in comparison to the use I got.

I should also note, during the recent Texas ice storm, diesel was the one thing that DID NOT run out at the local "gas'n'go" places. Add normal fuel in the tractors and a 500-gallon storage tank, I should be good for a couple of weeks at least.

The light tower and similar options like the Onan truck power units are worth further investigation though.

For what it is worth for those thinking about solar, pallet quantity (25) panels are running about $0.30/watt. While that looks attractive, that only scratches the surface for off-grid power solutions. If you are just charging back into the grid, you can skip the battery expense but it still is a pretty expensive option to consider.