Diesel Pickups

[wushaw]

I don't understand why some of y'all think a diesel pickup cannot be serviced at a big truck shop, I see it all the time. My neighbor uses an independent truck shop for all his work on his F350/7.3.
I have talked to several independent truck shops and every one of em tell me if it's got a diesel motor in it then they will work on it.
Now if you need trim work then that is different but as far as the motor/tranny then there is no reason not to take your truck to any shop.
For all the Cummins owners y'all have all the Cummins shops in every big city to get any engine work done...it's their motor

Going back to the dealer Ford, GM, Dodge after the warranty is not necessary and good luck if they have a decent diesel mechanic on hand.

 

[Lynkage]

I guess one thing I forgot to mention was warranty service. I certainly can take my truck to the International shop and they can do it as well, but I have a good dealer 5 blocks from my house and a 7year 120,000 mile warranty.

Most people are not willing to pay for something that is free at the dealer.
Again just my 2c

 

[Joe1]

CP 1969

What you're suggesting is not too far from some of the purpose built RV haulers in the medium duty line of several of the truck manufactureres including International. You do see them hauling the LARGE 5th wheel RV's on the road. You can also see them for sale used without a lot of miles on them in the RV magazines.

They look pretty plush inside and have around 300 - 350 hp Cummins or Cat's if my memory serves me correctly. There is already a limited market for this. They don't usually have pickup bodies but are available with other style bodies.

As daily drivers they are pretty big and only get 11 - 12 mpg unloaded. I think that since most Pickups are used for other things beside pure towing of trailers that there would be a limited market for the vehicle you described.

Maintenance on gasoline engines has gotten relatively cheap since it's so infrequent and is usually an oil filter and 6 qts of oil. Diesel maintenance is still relatively expensive if only because of the larger crankcases and because of fuel filter replacement. Driving a diesel when fuel costs, maintenance and initial cost is concerned would probably make keeping it for 150,000 miles a break even point. Just my opinion.

 

[indianaEPH]

+1

And it works great!

I don't know what the new Cummins 6.7L (tuned for 2007 emissions) weighs, but I wouldn't be surprised if it's another 100-200lbs.

Dodge announced the new 6.7L engine is compliant with 2010 emissions level. The 2010 emissions level is much more stringent than the 2007 level so this was a big announcement.

As for the original question: No I would not consider a Paccar built pickup truck. Not for what they are likely to be charging for it. Besides, it would not be real fun to park at the office

 

[workinallthetime]

hey dont get me wrong i love the independent shops, I make alot of money off of what they "tried" to fix. Thats just gm though since so many fords and dodges break all the time im sure alot of independents love to see them coming, lol and j/k
I will say that ford shops stay way more busy than gm shops around here and from what i see the percentage of market share looks about the same for all 3.
here is some irony if i can remember all the steps
gm sold detroit to penski
penski sold it to dalmler benz
they are now dalmer crysler aka dodge
so when do we see a ram with a v8 detroit or benz engine?
i might have missed a sale somewhere in there but i still think its funny

 

[QRTRHRS]

Turbo Diesel Register: Dodge diesel owners, you have found the number one resource for Dodge Cummins turbo diesel trucks!"
Dodge 4500 and 5500 on the way. JC

JC, thanks for posting that info. I never thought I would see Dodge get back into the heavier series.

Now, if they put a tilt hood on so you could get at the engine....

 

[RobertN]

You said a mouthful in your last paragraph...the part about the 'what about the looks going down the road in a Dodge with Cat powered on the side.' That is why I think KW or Pete would probably sell a ton of these things. There are gobs of people who buy things for the 'style' of it, not for any practical reason. KW, Pete, and Cat are at the very top of name recognition in the trucking business and I think there are bunches of people who would buy one just for that reason alone.

I would ask why? My expierience is within our local fire dept. All of our new Engines have Cummins. There are a few old Detroits still around in a couple Water Tenders, and a couple CAT3208's in old Ford 7/8000 series Engines. I can not see a reason to go back to a "V" engine; those inline Cummins are excellent.

 

[RobertN]

so when do we see a ram with a v8 detroit or benz engine?
i might have missed a sale somewhere in there but i still think its funny

Why? The CTD makes it's torque low, and keeps it flat.

The V8's like the Powerstroke and Duramx are good engines and make good power, but they seem more like an attempt at the power curve of a bigblock gas engine. Easier to get folks to buy, feels familiar.

 

[cp1969]

I would ask why? My expierience is within our local fire dept. All of our new Engines have Cummins. There are a few old Detroits still around in a couple Water Tenders, and a couple CAT3208's in old Ford 7/8000 series Engines. I can not see a reason to go back to a "V" engine; those inline Cummins are excellent.

The Cat engine I suggested is an inline 6.

 

[RobertN]

The Cat engine I suggested is an inline 6.

Interesting... An inline 7.2L(~432ci). What kind of specs does it have?

The "other" cummins I have driven in E28 is a 350hp 8.9L. I think it might break my front axle if that was shoveled into my Ram

I know I am not impressed with the old CAT 3208. But, that is an old engine series... E228 is an awesome engine, but it is a slug on the hills(CAT3208 in a Ford 8000 series cab chassis buildup). I don't know that it is so much the engine, as it is the overall weight of the fire apparatus loaded. From what I can gather though, my Ram with CTD makes more torque and HP... The 3208 is about as big as you can fit in the 7-8000 Fords.

 

[RobertN]

The Cat engine I suggested is an inline 6.

I see it. Looks interesting...

Caterpillar On-Highway Engines: Truck>On-Highway Truck Engines>C7

 

[KICK]

I've had both gas and Diesel powered 1 tons, and I tend to think most people are better off buying the gasser. easier to get fuel, fuel is a little cheaper even though you are going to burn more of it, it is easier to find a place to repair it if you are mechanically challenged.

New Diesel technology with VNT's and EGR is raising the cost of ownership thru more expensive repairs and complexity. VNt's don't last as long as a regular turbo and the EGr systems contribute to sludge problems in the engines which cut back on life of engine.

I'm sure Paccar could build a smaller truck and somebody would buy it, but I suspect it would be a high end vehicle for people with money to burn, aka.. people buying Hummers.

 

[KICK]

here is some irony if i can remember all the steps
gm sold detroit to penski
penski sold it to dalmler benz
they are now dalmer crysler aka dodge
so when do we see a ram with a v8 detroit or benz engine?
i might have missed a sale somewhere in there but i still think its funny

I suspect that at some time in the future you are going to see a Benz engine in the Dodge, if any other engine was to be offered.

Daimler also owns Freightliner, which explains the preponderance of Detroit Series 60's in those trucks.

daimler bought Freightliner with the intention of getting a dealer service networ so they could gradually wedge their Benz trucks and motors into the american market.

anybody seen those high roofed vans Dodge is selling, those are rebadged Benzes

detroit ( courtesy of Benz) was going to stop production of the Series 60, but they soon realized that american Truck owners operators weren't going to buy a Benz, they wanted that S60. so its still in production.

Detroit Diesel, MTU, Vm motori and Benz are all one big company now, making a line of engines from something like 70 hp to 4000 hp.

while Caterpillar offers some pretty good products, not all of them are as good as their reputation. plus they cost more... so it is a consideration when producing a vehicle that you also have to market it against the competition and if your diesle engine costs too much more than the other guys, you may lose sales.

 

[workinallthetime]

I suspect that at some time in the future you are going to see a Benz engine in the Dodge, if any other engine was to be offered.

Daimler also owns Freightliner, which explains the preponderance of Detroit Series 60's in those trucks.

daimler bought Freightliner with the intention of getting a dealer service networ so they could gradually wedge their Benz trucks and motors into the american market.

anybody seen those high roofed vans Dodge is selling, those are rebadged Benzes

detroit ( courtesy of Benz) was going to stop production of the Series 60, but they soon realized that american Truck owners operators weren't going to buy a Benz, they wanted that S60. so its still in production.

Detroit Diesel, MTU, Vm motori and Benz are all one big company now, making a line of engines from something like 70 hp to 4000 hp.

while Caterpillar offers some pretty good products, not all of them are as good as their reputation. plus they cost more... so it is a consideration when producing a vehicle that you also have to market it against the competition and if your diesle engine costs too much more than the other guys, you may lose sales.

see i knew someone would see and think along the same lines as me. benz has been building diesels along time and i bet they are pretty good at it, i still see those old d class smoking up the on ramps all the time. Also i think i read somewhere that they were the only manufaturer who would have a diesel car on the market for 07 due to the epa. that might be a good thing for dodge to offer a option of a benz diesel in some of their stuff like the durango or even a 1500 series truck. they could have skeeter on their commercials saying "that thing got a benz in it" lol

 

[Lucky1]

I owned a 6.5 chevy diesel 2500, the truck had 250,000 miles on it when I sold it. The 6.5 used no oil and never had any problems,( sold it to the garage that does our maintaince). Next bought chevy duramax, owned one year, towed terrible,warped alu. heads.and other problems. Bought ford 6.0 100,000 miles later still running great, tows 14 ft. dump trailer full of stone like a dream. Iguess this is why ford out sells all other diesel pick-ups.

 

[radman1]

I owned a 6.5 chevy diesel 2500, the truck had 250,000 miles on it when I sold it. The 6.5 used no oil and never had any problems,( sold it to the garage that does our maintaince). Next bought chevy duramax, owned one year, towed terrible,warped alu. heads.and other problems. Bought ford 6.0 100,000 miles later still running great, tows 14 ft. dump trailer full of stone like a dream. Iguess this is why ford out sells all other diesel pick-ups.

I am a ford guy with a 1999 F250 V10, but the ford 6.0 had many problems. Hopefully, the new 6.4 ford diesel will be better and they say had much more testing. Unfortunately, Navistar (International) stopped sending any more 6.4 engines this week to ford and production of ford's new '08 model has stopped. The trouble is over all the warranty repairs on the 6.0 engine. Ford says they owe money for part of the warranty repairs and Navistar says it doesn't. Ford was therefore paying less for the new engines to recoup the money they felt is owed to them. Navistar said no new engines. 75% of heavy duty pickup sales for ford are diesels. Both companies need each other and now ford's very profitable truck line and a newly launched product is out of production.

The new EPA requirements are also killing diesel fuel economy and driving up costs for everyone and becomes more strict in 2010. Price of diesel is now higher than gas at all times. It is difficult to justify the rational for diesel unless you are doing lots of pulling. Price of new ford diesel is over $6000 more than V10.

 

[em14]

I may have missed this in the news reports, but, just how much money was involved in the warranty payments ... seems that there would not be much. Or ... is there that big of a problem with these engines?
Leo

 

[radman1]

I may have missed this in the news reports, but, just how much money was involved in the warranty payments ... seems that there would not be much. Or ... is there that big of a problem with these engines?
Leo

Well the latest news is that a court now has given a temporary restraining order that Navistar has to resume shipping engines again. The facts are often distorted, but warranty costs were over 500 million. I believe the 6.0 started being used in 2002.

 

[em14]

Well the latest news is that a court now has given a temporary restraining order that Navistar has to resume shipping engines again. The facts are often distorted, but warranty costs were over 500 million. I believe the 6.0 started being used in 2002.

"warranty costs were over 500 million" .... WOW! no wonder all the fuss!

 

[rback33]

"warranty costs were over 500 million" .... WOW! no wonder all the fuss!

yeah.... that would do it.