Buying Advice Diesel generator for home back up use

[GManBart]

That's why I own both.My generac 17 kw whole house gen.(LP gas)cost me $4,650 installed about 3 years ago.

Generac? You're doomed man, doomed!

 

[coobie]

Generac? You're doomed man, doomed!

I hope not,LOL.I change the oil(5w-30 full syn.)and filter once per year unless I get extended run time then I change ASAP.Had the valves adjusted last year and air filter changed.So far so GOOD.coobie

 

[Utopia Texas]

I guess I am the "odd man out" in this conversation as I have a 55KW unit to run my homestead, but that includes 4 water wells, 2 houses and 3 barns with a Pecan processing set up. We have gone as long as 8 days without electricity during the last Hurricane but were even capable of running my Dad's hemodialysis machine 5 hours a day. The generating unit is a ancient propane driven Kohler with a 6 cylinder White-Hercules engine. It is 35 years old now and parts are becoming almost impossible to find....

 

[buickanddeere]

I take great delight in having exactly what I need....

Not wasting thousands on something I don't, money down the drain. And wasting lots of precious, hard to replace during an outage, fuel for a generator 10 x the size I actually need.

I could go on a very nice european vacation, twice, for the cost of the generators some people are insisting one needs. When a long power outage comes up again, I'm spending the money I saved on a vacation.

My Honda 2000 will power every single appliance in my home except central AC...

Microwave
Furnace
Fridge
Deep freeze
Theater system
Lights
Fans
and even a cheap window AC I would put in the den or master bedroom if it is too hot

Of course not all at the same time, but who actually NEEDS to run any of that at the same time.

As well as being easily portable.... Lets take you 20Kw generator on a camping trip or loan it to your neighbor for awhile to help them. Your fuel for 1 day weighs more than my entire generator!

Freezer has several jugs of water frozen as block ice, will stay cold for days without any help from the gen.

If I had a well pump I would have an appropriately sized generator to run it, but no need for 20Kw.

Very low maintenance, and low cost. I'm delighted all the way to the bank!

I'm glad that your huge genset gives you so much personal sanctification.

I don't recall saying that I own and use a 20kW standby system.
There is enough capacity to run two freezers, two fridges, washing machine,microwave , furnace fan, all the lights instead of staggering around in the dark like a fool. The AC unit and a couple of block heaters. Any motor load can start when anything or everything else is running without tripping equipment off with a brownout.

 

[buickanddeere]

I suppose worse yet are the people during every power outage who go out and try to find any generator as they have none. Even though they have had or know of other extended power outages previously .

 

[daybreak1998]

Howdy,
This has come up many other times.
1. City dweller = town water = only needs fridge powered. Get a little tiny Honda.
2. suburb dweller = well = water heater = fridge = maybe heat. Get something strong enough to run water heater, then all the other stuff will work with ease. Of course not all at the same time. Of course you could shut down overnight.
3. Homestead dweller = control their environment, enough ___kw auto switched to run things without being hampered. AC/heat, lights, tv, pumps, wells, etc...
4. Farmer = generator capacity to run whatever is needed, whenever needed. Either auto switch or manual. Enough ___kw to do it.

Remember = A true electrical load survey for a simple standard house is way off base. The survey would included absolute power capabilities to cover a double electric oven, electric water heater, pump, lights.. more or less your entire amperage load of your panel.

A 10kw generator will let a homeowner live very nicely during a power outage. Smaller generators work, but many here can attest to they want a larger unit. Yes, If I was looking at a generator at this size, I would go with diesel.

GmanBart = relax, its all part of the process of forums.

Me I have a 30kw pto generator. Hooked into a central distribution for the farm. Powers all I need and more.

 

[GManBart]

GmanBart = relax, its all part of the process of forums.

I'm totally relaxed

 

[newbury]

I think we scared the OP off.

 

[dave1949]

I think we scared the OP off.

Maybe. If so, it's his own fault. If he would have answered the first question I asked, none of this would have happened. :laughing:

 

[daybreak1998]

Maybe this is the wrong section. I am new to Tractobynet so forgive me.
I live in the rural northeast. back in 2011 we had sever power outages. I want to get a home generator to address that potential problem. Power was out for 6 days so I need more than a small 2-3KW. I want a diesel since I have a Kubota tractor and have diesel around and also have oil heat and two 275 gal. tanks to pull from. . Plus diesel doesn't have the long term storage issues that gas does. In NY all fuel oil is now low sulfur so its exactly the same as diesel except for color. When power goes out , the one gas station in town cant pump and las t long term outage the roads were closed and we couldn't even get to a town with power.
so, the logical solution is a generator , running on diesel/fuel oil. Researching the market, all I see is up to 7KW and then its a 4x price jump to go to 10-12 KW.
Trying to find prices for Kubotas smaller diesel generators or anyone else's for that matter is difficult There are plenty of Chinese 7KW out there but they concern me with all the poor reviews.
based on my rough calculations I need 10 KW.
anyone have any suggestions, ideas, recommendations?

Howdy,
The smaller diesel generators are mostly open frame 3600rpm air cooled units. Once you get into the 10kw are larger diesel units, they are liquid cooled units with most spinning at 1800rpm. Since you have a liquid cooled engine, there is a lot more to it. As other members will also state, you could also put the tractor to use with a PTO driven generator. The same thing applies here too, the smaller PTO driven generators are usually 2 pole units which need to spin internally at 3600rpm to keep 60Hz. Because of the spinning speed, you do have some gear noise. Once you get to a certain size, they are 4 pole units which spin internally at 1800rpm. With that, the noise is less. But, they also cost more $$$. Of course, there is gearing between you are the alternator. The tractor itself needs to keep the PTO drive shaft spinning at 540rpm.

 

[lutt]

To the op, check into CK power in St. Louis Mo, they put gensets together from small to large. I took my John Deere generator training there for work. I seem where you were interested in a Kubota unit. They sell those also. They are good people to deal with and know there stuff. LUTT

 

[huntgrouse]

Okay, here is a little input based on the feedback so far.
I live in a rural area. Tight valleys, lots of trees down when the snow and or freezing rain drops crap on all the lines. Plus the outages have become more frequent and longer lasting. If it were just me, ****, candles, a fire pit and some canned food would be all I need. But let痴 be realistic. If you have a significant other, I don't care how much she is your best friend, soul mate, etc. ; take away their comforts for so long and they turn into ........!!!!...... so as far as rouging it with a minimal generator capacity that allows me to run the freezer and fridge and then rotate to cook on the electric stove and a few lights, that's not happening. Then throw an elderly mother who lives a couple of miles away who comes and stays with us when the power goes out, that compounds it more.
1. Based on what I gather from several KW calculator sites, my BX 25 is not really suited for a PTO generator of 10K size. On top of that, normally during winter, I need the Kubota for other things like snow removal and dicking around with a PTO generator, and then disconnecting to plow/blow and back to the other is not my idea of fun.
2. My power requirements are: Fridge, freezer, stove, lights, and oil fired furnace which includes tank less coil so all hot water comes from this, water well pump, computer, TV. Obviously, all of these things won稚 be operating at the same time and some can be disconnected to run others. I do not burn wood.
My son in law, who is a licensed commercial electrician went over all of my electrical demands etc. and came up with the 10KW requirement. Not pie in the sky hypothetical estimate.
3. This would not necessarily be 24 hour operation. It would have to depend on the situation but I don稚 foresee 24 hr. ops except maybe in the winter if my elderly parent is there (for heat)
4. Another option other than the 10KW Kubota Generator or similar is to get one from here: PRO-SERIES Diesel 7000-Watt Generator with Digital Control Panel and Remote Start-GENSD7D at The Home Depot . While this is a Chinese manufactured generator, At least with HO, there is somewhere to go through for parts and they have a warranty.
6500 Watts continuous. At this price I could buy two if needed!! LOL. With veterans discount, take off another 10% and it seems like a decent price considering what good quality gas jobs go for.
5. Availability of fuel. Diesel definitely gets the nod. With two 275 Gal. tanks on site and a third waiting to be installed, I have more than enough fuel capacity for a long term situation. The realities are that with at least one kid still at home (in school), plus the elderly mother issue, I need more than bare basic. But I also understand the laws of diminishing returns with regards to cost/ benefit of the 7KW vs. the 4X more expensive 10KW.
6 Anyone have any experience with the generator listed above that HD sells

 

[aczlan]

6 Anyone have any experience with the generator listed above that HD sells

I have the same generator in Aurora paint, picked it up for $300 from a construction company, has a battery draw when off that I need to find as it eats batteries (enough that I disconnected the battery), but it seems like a decent unit.

Aaron Z

 

[samjohnsonus]

Thanks everyone for sharing the answer.

 

[grsthegreat]

Nope. His was (over) sized to code and installed by an electrician. I believe its a "20":laughing: kW as well.

He's not the only one. Generacs have a very high failure rate.

actually, they dont. there the largest supplier of residental units, so a larger number of failures does not mean there the worst brand. Generac supplies units rebranded as Guardian, Siemens,etc. As a ratio to number of units installed, they are very reliable.

I have installed many different brands of gen sets over the years, and ive had Kohler units fail also. I have a small Honda unit that im thinking of using as a boat anchor. personally i think its the fact that people forget there installed and dont maintain them. never change the oil, etc

 

[doxford jim]

I have a 12kW Kubota system installed at my house. It sits in a shed and has a mechanical change over switch - all installed by an electrical company.
This was installed by the previous owners.
In the time the previous owners had it, it was never run on load or serviced. When I bought the place I replumbed the fuel system from the 250gall. storage tank and got the machine running properly. Changed out the oil at 4 hours due to it's age and replaced with new oil. The generator now has around 140 run hours and another oil and filter change etc. at 100 hours.
This machine has run without any problems and supplies all the power the house needs during a blackout. The 12kW is enough to run heat pump, electric stove etc and based on my calculations, uses about 1/2 gallon of fuel an hour at around 60% load.

I don't know what the previous owner paid for the setup - I am sure it wasn't cheap. However, I am more than happy with how it works.

Sorry I can't answer some of your questions but thought you might be interested in my setup.

 

[s219]

Nice setup Jim! What is that used for the exhaust piping -- a flex tube and through-wall thimble? Does it just poke out the other side?

 

[GManBart]

I don't know what the previous owner paid for the setup - I am sure it wasn't cheap. However, I am more than happy with how it works.

Definitely not cheap...nice setup!

 

[dave1949]

Okay, here is a little input based on the feedback so far.
I live in a rural area. Tight valleys, lots of trees down when the snow and or freezing rain drops crap on all the lines. Plus the outages have become more frequent and longer lasting. If it were just me, ****, candles, a fire pit and some canned food would be all I need. But letç—´ be realistic. If you have a significant other, I don't care how much she is your best friend, soul mate, etc. ; take away their comforts for so long and they turn into ........!!!!...... so as far as rouging it with a minimal generator capacity that allows me to run the freezer and fridge and then rotate to cook on the electric stove and a few lights, that's not happening. Then throw an elderly mother who lives a couple of miles away who comes and stays with us when the power goes out, that compounds it more.
1. Based on what I gather from several KW calculator sites, my BX 25 is not really suited for a PTO generator of 10K size. On top of that, normally during winter, I need the Kubota for other things like snow removal and dicking around with a PTO generator, and then disconnecting to plow/blow and back to the other is not my idea of fun.
2. My power requirements are: Fridge, freezer, stove, lights, and oil fired furnace which includes tank less coil so all hot water comes from this, water well pump, computer, TV. Obviously, all of these things won稚 be operating at the same time and some can be disconnected to run others. I do not burn wood.
My son in law, who is a licensed commercial electrician went over all of my electrical demands etc. and came up with the 10KW requirement. Not pie in the sky hypothetical estimate.
3. This would not necessarily be 24 hour operation. It would have to depend on the situation but I don稚 foresee 24 hr. ops except maybe in the winter if my elderly parent is there (for heat)
4. Another option other than the 10KW Kubota Generator or similar is to get one from here: PRO-SERIES Diesel 7000-Watt Generator with Digital Control Panel and Remote Start-GENSD7D at The Home Depot . While this is a Chinese manufactured generator, At least with HO, there is somewhere to go through for parts and they have a warranty.
6500 Watts continuous. At this price I could buy two if needed!! LOL. With veterans discount, take off another 10% and it seems like a decent price considering what good quality gas jobs go for.
5. Availability of fuel. Diesel definitely gets the nod. With two 275 Gal. tanks on site and a third waiting to be installed, I have more than enough fuel capacity for a long term situation. The realities are that with at least one kid still at home (in school), plus the elderly mother issue, I need more than bare basic. But I also understand the laws of diminishing returns with regards to cost/ benefit of the 7KW vs. the 4X more expensive 10KW.
6 Anyone have any experience with the generator listed above that HD sells

Glad you stuck with us HuntGrouse. It can get to be a bit like a family reunion after a few beers here.

I don't have any experience with the HD generator you linked. Some observations though.

1. I would put zero $ value on a 90 day, non-returnable warranty.
2. Big Box warranty service and parts can be very uneven or impractical. How many repair parts for that unit does HD have hanging on their wall that you could buy when you really need them, for example?
3. The continuous output rating of that unit needs to be verified. In one place it says 6300 W, lower down on the page it's 5500 W.
4. Either 5500W or 6300W is skimpy for your load IMO due to the electric range and no-swapping requirement, and well below your SIL's calculation.
5. You could save on the generator costs, and [probably] get along with the HD generator if you can safely, and are willing to, use an alternative cooking method during an outage. Something like a grill with a gas side burner, Coleman camp stove or the like.

 

[buickanddeere]

The BX25 will do an entirely respectable job on a 15KW generator loaded up to 12KW.
Sometimes the small 12.5KW or 15KW pto units come up for sale at very modest price . Something for use right now or to keep in the shed for backup.
Portable too if power was required at the MIL's to protect her property or contents.