Decision Time: PT vs BX

marrt · May 9, 2002

Well, I finally got CFO approval for a new tractor. My tractor will now effectively cost twice as much, but that’s a another story. /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

Unless something drastic happens when I visit a couple of dealers this weekend, it’s down to a PT425 vs. a BX2200.

Here’s my analysis:

Background: I have just over 3 level acres divided as 1 acre of lawn and 2 acres of a fairly rough field that I intend to mow as a lawn. I need a FEL, post hole digger, and a few other attachments for landscaping. However, 80% of my use will be mowing after the landscaping is complete.

Ergonomics/Design: Both tractors fit me about the same. However, I really like having the implements out front where I can see them and the quick attach feature is absolutely great. However, with the BX, I can have 3 implements on the tractor at the same time (FEL, MMM, and 3 point implement). This is a tough call but I think the advantage goes to the PT.

Ride: The PT rides pretty rough at speed but I suspect the BX does as well (my crappy local dealer won’t let me test one at home). Overall, I think this would be a tie.

Price/Resale: The BX is about $1000 more expense with the implements I want (not including the PT’s “free” sunshade). However, I get a ready resale market for the BX. Also, I can get “cheap” 3 point implements if I don’t need the heavy duty stuff and any investment in implements can be carried over to another tractor if I don’t like the BX for some reason. PT implements are very heavy duty and fairly pricing versus 3 point HD implements. However, I need to use some implements only occasionally and can get by with a less HD unit purchased from Northern or TSC at a discount to the PT price (e.g., post hole digger, cement mixer, boom pole). Also, the PT implements are proprietary, which limits flexibility to upgrade to another tractor (unless I upgrade to another PT of course). Overall, I’d say the advantage has to go to the BX, primarily because of the easy resale if I don’t like the tractor. This is a tough call though because the PT is definitely less expensive on the front end.

Engine: I like the BX diesel much better than the PT Kohler. Advantage BX.

Exhaust Fumes: OK, this is a “pet peeve” of mine as I don’t care to breath exhaust fumes for 2 hours when mowing. While the diesel fumes are less aggravating the me, they do exit the front of the BX and some will undoubtedly blow back into my face. The PT exhaust exits the rear so the advantage goes to the PT.

Mowing: When using the PT mower at the factory, I didn’t particularly care for the design of the mower. I always felt like I would run over the mower if one of the front wheels fell into a small hole (which I have plenty of in my field). The PT basically pushes the mower along on the mower's own four wheels and the design just looks a little unstable. I do like the rear discharge feature of the PT mower and the fact that it's out front where I can see everything and can easily mow under bushes and trees. I have never used a BX mower but the folks on the Kubota thread rave about them. Without more experience with the PT mower, I have to give the advantage to the BX.

Traction: Both tractors are four wheel drive but the BX has differential lock, so I should be able to get at least three wheels pulling for using the FEL etc.... When I used the PT loader, I didn’t get the sense that all four wheels were really pulling because it was so easy to spin. I don’t doubt that some torque was being applied to all four wheels, but, if one wheel spins, I suspect the torque drops off to the other wheels. Again, without more experience, I would have to give the advantage to the BX.

Conclusion: I haven’t tried to rank order the items above but I think that ride, which affects the time I have to spend mowing, and diesel engine are big for me. The ride is a tie, but the ready resale market for the BX means I can easily move up to a larger tractor if I desire. I worry that I would have to take a significant loss on the PT and implements to “upgrade.” I really like the PT, but the “math” suggests the BX is a better choice for me. Moss, Hans, and others…am I missing anything?

Charlie_Iliff · May 9, 2002

Looks pretty even.
The only way to break the tie is to buy both, use them for a year, or so, and then tell everyone facing a similar decision if your current analysis is correct. (Then, of course, sell the BX because of its ready market, and keep the PT.)

PTRich · May 9, 2002

Resale value of the BX is better and you could probably sell it very quickly. There motors are excellent.
Having a floating mower like on the PT gives you a much better cut. The traction on my PT is exceptional, there is wheel spin at times but I never lose pulling power from the other wheels (I have very rocky, hilly and wet conditions). If you are going to use the post hole digger quit a bit I do not think you could even compare the Power Trac post hole digger with one behind you that can not be moved side to side.
I am happy with my tractor and most people are, that is why you do not see many for sale, but I do think you would take it on the chin a little if you had to sell it(though there was talk that Power Trac had a waiting list for people who want used machines).

P.S. Of course I think my tractor is the best!!!!

PTRich

MossRoad · May 9, 2002

This is the fun part. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

The mower is out front and is very easy to see and operate. I'd give the advantage to the PT.

The post hole auger on the PT has power down. On a 3pt unit for the BX, it does not. Advantage PT.

3 imlements on one tractor are OK. But how often are you going to be using the FEL, a MMM and a post hole digger at the same time? OK, an FEL and back blade are OK/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif. Since your main use will be mowing(same for me), you'd probably want as little weight on the machine when mowing as possible. The ease of changing implements on the PT wipes out all others in this competition, so the advantage in this category is definately to the PT.

Bumpy ground = bumpy ride for both these machines, tie.

Purchase price definately goes to the PT.

Resale price maybe(more than likely, OK probably) goes to the Kubota because of brand recognition and outstanding reliability, which Kubota justly deserves. Advantage Kubota.

The PT 400 series implements won't work on the bigger units, so if you upgrade to a bigger PT, it probably means new implements too. However, the BX recommends smaller implements as well, so if you upgrade to a bigger Kubota, I think you will want the larger implements that it could handle as well, so I call this one a tie.

I like gas engines better than diesels(I'm going against the grain on this one for sure), but I'll give the advantage to the Kubota here(Hey, I'm not stupid).

Having never used a mid mount mower, I can't compare them. All I can say is I really like the mower out front. My yard is flat and it really cruises along at top speed. I can get about 2 - 3 feet under bushes without scratching up the sides of the tractor. And the rear discharge eliminates windrowing. Advantage PT.

For you that bag your clippings(I don't) you have to purchase some pretty expensive bagging equipment for the BX to bag. However, the PT does not bag. You could probably tow a pickup device of some type if you insist on bagging, and you'd have to purchase that extra, just like the BX, so this is a tie.

What is the current loader height on the BX? I don't know, but think it is higher than the PT.

What is the lift capacity of the BX loader? I don't know, but think the PT is a little higher.

I found the steering wheel of the BX to be between my legs. The steering wheel on the PT is at my waist.

If you are mechanically inclined and like to maintain your own machine, advantage PT. If you want local dealer assistance, advantage Kubota.

Traction. I don't know. With equally equipped tractors, and turf tires I have no idea how the two would perform against each other. I'd like to see a back to back pull off, a front to front pull off and front to rear and rear to front pull offs as well. I don't have R4s, so can't begin to speculate.

And finally, although I will eventually buy a trailer to haul it around on, the PT backs right up into the back of my full sized pickup truck with an implement attached. The implement hangs out the back, but all four wheels are in there with about a foot to spare. Can you get a BX with the 60" MMM into the back of a full sized pickup? Advantage PT.

/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif

Of course I'm biased in my favor. This is just for fun. Kind of like Point - Counter Point used to be. I really think you might be happier and have better peace of mind with your purchase if you went with the BX. And no one here would fault you for it in the least.

In the end, as long as its a tractor, we'll be happy for you.

Keep us informed of your decisions.

/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

kcook · May 9, 2002

I will add a couple of other points that I found out, one, Price at least were I am from is a PT winner hands down.

As the others have said, when your mowing you will not want your loader on, you may still have to deal with ballast (if your tires are filled). Advantage PT!

As for power check to see what the Kohler has for PTO power compaired to the Kubota? As for longevity, well my Kohler power garden tractor is a 78 and now it needs to be replaced, not bad. Replacement cost 1800.00 out the door!

Heavy steel in costruction on the PT, no Sheet metal!

Quick attach, even your wife will be able to change attachments over!

KCook

kcook · May 9, 2002

I just thought of a few other points,

If you ever thought of a backhoe, you will need to go with a PT, or a trencher, how about a pallet forks, you might get them for your BX but at what cost?

The PT can take a 30" post hole auger, I don't think a BX will even take one larger than 9".

Also the Snow blade will be much cheaper on the PT see MossRoads web page to see how well it works:

www.godollei.net/pt425

KCook

Scott_F · May 9, 2002

marrt,
As I have been at about the same decision point recently, here's my analysis (for what it's worth) on the same points.

Background: I also have about three level acres. Mine is 2 plus a little lawn and 1 minus a little wooded. I need a mower, loader, and attachments for driveway maintenance and landscaping (read box scraper and blade).

Ergonomics/Design: The quick attach and implements out front were major plusses for me as well - also the articulation is supposedly easier on the lawn. <font color=red>with the BX, I can have 3 implements on the tractor at the same time</font color=red>. From what I gleaned from the BX brethren, you probably wouldn't want to do real dirt work with the MMM on anyway, so for dirt work, it's really only two attachments on the BX vs. one on the PT. Still, advantage BX, but the major BX advantage here is being able to have a tiller or rake behind you and not have to back up while using one of these. You're right, it's a tough call, but I'd say it's about even given the quick attach on the PT- you might have two implements on the BX and the same time but you'll only use one at a time. With the PT you can switch them pretty quickly.

Ride: All tractors ride rough. I'm going to look for a good seat.

Price/Resale: I didn't really consider resale, because I intend on keeping it for a loooong time. The initial acquisition cost was a big consideration for me (although I was looking at the PT-422 instead of the -425) I'll get a tractor, mower, one or two buckets (still haven't decided MossRoad), blade and box blade for around 10,500. The quote I got on a BX was 12,750 for tractor, mower and FEL (no blade or box scraper). I probably could have done a little better through Carver but probably not $2500 plus two more implements better.

Engine: Agree. I'd like to have a diesel for longevity, but I can live with gas.

Exhaust Fumes: Probably depends more on the wind than where the exhaust is located.

Mowing: I haven't actually seen or used the PT mower yet, but I like the idea of having in front of me. It also seems that a mower that rides independently of the tractor would give a better cut. I know the BX guys rave about the cut quality also. I'm becoming less particular about my grass now that there's so much of it, so either one is probably good enough for me. Also, remember my 1+ acre of wooded area - one of these days I'd like to clean out some of the underbrush. I think a brush mower on the front of the PT will be a lot better for this than a brush mower on the back of a BX.

Traction: Again, I haven't driven a PT yet, but as I understand the design, if one wheel starts to slip, it should have no effect whatsoever on the other wheels. BTW, I'm going for the bar tires on the PT.

Conclusion: Price was probably the big factor for me - more attachments for the money. Maybe not quite as much tractor, but certainly enough for my needs. I also like it just because it's different. I'm going down to Tazewell next Friday, and unless I find something I really don't like about the PT-422, I'll probably bring one home. The usual TBN bottom line is that you'll probably be quite happy with either. As Charlie says, the reasearch is half the fun. Good luck.

Scott

Carpenter · May 9, 2002

It sounds like you've given this alot of thought and I can't fault your logic. The only other thing I would consider is which tractor is easier to use. I haven't used a BX but I've owned 35hp Masseys and Kubotas in the past, and they were great tractors; but I find I am more likely to jump on my PT425 and do little jobs that were more trouble than they were worth on the other tractors. I think that's mostly due to the quick attach feature, but also the fact that's it's just plain fun to operate.

Good luck with whichever you decide on. They're both good machines.

bubenberg · May 9, 2002

don't leave me now .... i would only rehash what every one already so aptly said to you.

one thing i want you to remember the old guy from pa said to you : remember me when you try to make a three point hitch attachment to fit after you had to take it off because you got stuck some place, remember me when you are on your side or back in the snow hitching or unhitching a three point attachment.

i know this is a tough decision but look we have several different types of machines available to us. not one can deliver as many different things, at minimal cost, with a very high degree of satisfaction, as the little green machine does.