Snow Chains for snow & ice -- what mistake is it most important to avoid?

[oosik]

The only problem - ordering on line. Can they be returned if not the correct size. How difficult would returning them be. I got my chains at Les Schwab - a local tire store chain here in the PNW. It was only a 12 mile drive. And no problems returning if the had not fit.

 

[nyone]

My tire chain expierence is fairly limited to a old ford 851 with double ring chains and a pair of Vbar chains for my 4x4 dump truck.

Double ring chains are almost useless in frozen gravel. Av bar or something of the same are more what you will want. I plowed in 2wd with my dump truck with highway tires and Vbar chains.

Im also looking for a set of tire chains for my tractor with turf tires. Im no so conserned about the snow/ice performance.

 

[Jchonline]

OK, you asked so here we go again myself and a few others have and use and believe in the ability of the "Euro"style chain.
There are posters that will say you don't need them, all I can say is that I have over the years used most every style of tire chain available.
From 4 link spaced street chains to 2 link space bar reinforced, including the so called duo-grip and even the big double ring chains.
On a frozen dirt/gravel driveway the OFA's, Aquiline Talons, TRYGG's studded chains can not be beat, you will have more traction then you do in the summer.
They are expensive but they will grip better then any thing else available, the traction for driving and stopping is excellent, also side hill traction including side grip is also excellent.
View attachment 623514View attachment 623515

The 2wd plowing was pushing around 16" of snow with that style of chain.

I have the diamond studded from tire chains.com on by RTV (front/rear). I should have some good feedback on my hills in about a month . However I would also recommend diamond studded if you are on gravel. No reason not to have the best traction possible.

In re side hills, diamond studded should not slip. However you will not find me on side hills....

 

[Egon]

If looking for tractor tire chains consider looking at Skidder type chains.

 

[LouNY]

I saw a video that one of the guys on this forum made. It was on putting chains on an LSXR4100 series tractor (same model I have), and it took him 3 hours to mount them on one side. IIRC, it went a lot faster on the other side when he took the air out of the tire...but then you need to jack up a 5000 lb tractor.

I HATE the things. It took me an hour of hard work to put chains on a Polaris UTV, but they work well once on. Likely the best option.

This will be my first year blowing snow with my new LS and hope I can get by without chains. I have little to no grade to deal with. I currently have an inquiry in at Kold Kutter for studs that screw into tires. I doubt they will be as good as chains but may be good enough for my needs...and much easier to install. My other thought is to put the studs on the rears and use chains on the front tires.

Like you, I see cost as secondary. My issue is wrestling with 100+ lbs of chain on each of those rear tires. Just to old to handle that. Even if the studs only last 3-4 years I will be OK with that. But I do not run my tractor on pavement and put less than 150 hrs a year on it.

I posted several pictures last year about how I install my tire chains, it is a method that removes most of the lifting and tugging.
I can mount a set of chains on 18.4-30 tires in less then half an hour for both.
Also the Euro style many manufactures want them to be installed a bit loose, enough to get a fist under the cross chains with NO tensioners.

Oosik, you wonder whether studded is sufficiently superior to V-bar to justify the price;
most definitely I have run both on hard packed snow, ice, gravel and paved roads.
There is no comparison the studded style Euro type chains will outperform and ride better then any style of traction chain available.
The last V-bar reinforced chains I ran were on two link spacing and the studded Aguiline were twice as effective.
I could stop on my steep driveway with a 2wd tractor and backup, with the v-bar it was iffy to stop without using the blade also and once stopped almost impossible to back up the tires would just spin and chew unless you went into high reverse and used tire speed.
I have switched completly to the studded Euro for my tractors and on the farm we have switched over half the tractors that get chained up over and the others as the ladder chains get beyond repairing. These tractors are used feed cows in outside feed lots all winter with heavy wagon loads with tractors from 60 hp to 125 hp.

To install;
1) lay the chains out traction side up
2) attach a rope to the chains and to the wheel/tire, I just tie the rope to the chain making a V to hang on the tread
3) drive forward pulling the chain up onto the tire
4) stop and arrange the chain evenly on the tire (a second person speeds this up considerably)
5) drive the chain on untill your fasteners are in a convenient location usually have way up the rear of the tire
6) fasten your fasteners and drive a bit if needed refasten
7) keep your fasteners the same distances on both sides, do not have one side tighter then the other

 

[SmallChange]

Actually there is one reason not to have the best traction possible. Tuppence is tuppence. I think I might be able to find chains for $3,000 for my little 25 hp tractor, if I keep looking. I know I'm going to have to spend some serious money here, but the question is HOW serious.

I think I should put chains on front and rear. The rear is pretty obvious, but the front also seems important because I may be carrying snow down my hill in the FEL, so I'd be going downhill with weight out there in front (why I'm using a FEL is another story but feel free to ask). I'm certainly going to stay in 4WD in a low gear, and also will need to brake at the bottom as the slope continues all the way to the public road. Sound reasonable?

Obviously, you can't necessarily pick from every type of chain and fit the two tire sizes I have, which are 43X16.00-20 and 25X8.50-14. I'm looking at specific sellers and have not yet found somebody that sells studded chains for both. So far the best I'm finding is tirechainsrus who sells Aquiline MPC for $598.18 and Aquiline Talon for $847.18 to fit my rears, and nothing more aggressive than 2-link ladder chains for $168 to fit my fronts (which actually are on the Garden Tractor list). So I'd be around $750 or $1000 depending on which rear chain I pick. I would go $1000 if it would really make a difference -- would it?

 

[CobyRupert]

My tire chain expierence is fairly limited to a old ford 851 with double ring chains and a pair of Vbar chains for my 4x4 dump truck.

Double ring chains are almost useless in frozen gravel. Av bar or something of the same are more what you will want. I plowed in 2wd with my dump truck with highway tires and Vbar chains.

Im also looking for a set of tire chains for my tractor with turf tires. Im no so conserned about the snow/ice performance.

IMHO, I don't think skidder, or "diamond" or "duo" type chains (i.e. chains that have links that connect the horizontal ladder "rungs") are as necessary on a turf tire, as there's no problem of the cross chains rungs falling between the tire lugs as they might on other tire types. Depends on how much you want to spend.
Yes, ladder type chains offer less sidehill stability, and maybe more bumpy ride; but the 2 link ladder type are smoother riding than the 4 link spaced ladder type.

Nobody has talked about snow chain tensioners: Needed or not needed?
Fancy spring type, bungee cords, baling twine?

I'm in the "I don't need them" camp...until I do.

 

[LouNY]

The Talons will grip much better and may also be a heavier chain,
for your fronts some people have used the good atv chains as they come in the smaller sizes.

 

[oosik]

I don't care HOW/WHEN you mount a set of chains. I don't think you will ever consider it as one of the most fun jobs. I've done it in the late fall - when it was still warm outside. I've done it with a foot of snow on the ground. It's still a PITA.

It's akin to removing barbed wire from your rototiller or brush hog.

 

[LouNY]

I don't care HOW/WHEN you mount a set of chains. I don't think you will ever consider it as one of the most fun jobs. I've done it in the late fall - when it was still warm outside. I've done it with a foot of snow on the ground. It's still a PITA.

Very true it's not fun, but neither is manual labor.
I've done both when it needed to be done and I would expect you have also. :drink:

 

[SmallChange]

I know ag tires make falling between lugs more of an issue, and turf makes it less of an issue. Since I use R4 tires, am I just halfway between these camps, or what?

 

[oosik]

Lou - it's just one of those things that YOU KNOW has to be done. And you will never find a friend that will do it for you - at least, correctly. When I have jobs that MUST be done, especially the tough, manual ones - I write them down on my dry-erase board. Otherwise, I miraculously manage to forget them.

 

[oosik]

SmallChange - if you have to use your tractor in situations where loss of traction will be dangerous - get a good set of chains and install them. On the other hand - if loss of traction may just be inconvenient - well, it's your call.

If you do get chains - get good ones. Chains that will not provide good added traction are simply FALSE HOPE.

 

[nyone]

Hours to put chains on one tire? Wow. I usualy drive over them and put them on loos. Then drive around a bit and tighten them up as needed. I use no other tightening device becids the cam over thing on the chains them self.

I have never tryed the driving them on method. You think that would work on turf tires?

 

[CobyRupert]

Hours to put chains on one tire? Wow. I usualy drive over them and put them on loos. Then drive around a bit and tighten them up as needed. I use no other tightening device becids the cam over thing on the chains them self.

I have never tryed the driving them on method. You think that would work on turf tires?

Yes. Might not be able to hang rope on lug. Might be able to tie chain through rim to pull it up. Depends on how heavy, big chains are.

(IMHO) If you have a way, jacking the (freewheeling) tire a few inches off the ground, then adapting Lou's method, is the easiest way "hang", adjust and connect the chains.

 

[oosik]

Yes - I've tried many methods. Screaming & loudly utter obscenities = no help. The easiest way I've found - what CobyRupert/LouNY suggest. Big 'ol hydraulic bottle jack. Be certain the tractor is WELL blocked. One side up - tractor out of gear so this UP wheel will free spin. Tie chains onto one point of the tire - spin the tire - connect up as tight as possible. Finish the other three the same way. Drive a short distance - check to see if chains may need adjusting or tightening.

Also - if you from the "chains must be tight group". And you have R-1 or R-4 tires. Once they are reasonably tight - go ahead and move any cross links into the tire groves. They will end up there anyhow. This will allow you to tighten up as much as possible.

 

[Jstpssng]

Hours to put chains on one tire? Wow. I usualy drive over them and put them on loos. Then drive around a bit and tighten them up as needed. I use no other tightening device becids the cam over thing on the chains them self.

I have never tryed the driving them on method. You think that would work on turf tires?

I use the same technique and never seem to have the problems which others appear to. On my last tractor all that I had was a set of ladder chains cobbled together from several sections of truck chains which my father had laying around. I used those for 15 years without a problem.
I get them as tight as I can, and never had a problem with the links lieing between the lugs on my R-1s. As I tightened the chains down I worked the cross links to where I wanted them, and never touched them again until spring.

I sometimes use the same method for chaining up my pickup. More often though I wait until I am good and stuck before putting them on, that way I get to shovel out all around the truck, then get snow and slush down my back while laying under the truck trying to get them in place. Oosik is right; no amount of cursing seems to help at that point. I have used tensioners exactly once; they are somewhere in the ditch by the road that I travelled that day.

 

[SmallChange]

I've placed an order at TireChainsRUs. For the rear tires, Aquiline MPC. For the much smaller front tires, 2 link ladder chains. These smaller ones were actually on the Garden Tractor list. I've hardly seen anything better than 2 link ladder chains for these smaller wheels, though I did not start calling folks. My total was $766, somewhat more than I planned to spend but not out of range. I found the advice here compelling. I think I'm shooting a little on the high side to be more confident they work well. Losing control on the hill would be disaster, and merely having to rebuy something better would be an expensive mistake. But I didn't buy the most expensive I could find -- I rarely do.

Thank you everybody for the great help. I will follow up when I have some experience with ice and hard packed snow. And no doubt other people will use this thread, as there is definitely stuff here I didn't see in the several other threads I dug up here!

Tips I wish I had figured out earlier: I wish I had learned the categories and descriptions first: 2 and 4 link, ladder, duo (or H), V-bar, double ring, and studded. Then I wish I had had the table at Tractor Tire Chains-Comparison-Application to aim me in the right direction. Finally, with my three number tire sizes, I wish I had known to try searching by the last number (rim size) first and then the others, as some web sites are organized that way and all sites seem to work OK with that approach.

Thanks everybody! Keep it coming, this is good stuff to have online!

 

[John_Mc]

I do not know where you are located Small Change. When I needed tractor chains - Les Schwab. I got heavy duty V-bar TRACTOR chains - all four wheels - around $500.

They provided superior traction on my R-1 tires. They rode somewhat cobbie and being REALLY heavy, they were a PITA to install.

There is one thing - the Euro style studded chain will be considerably more expensive than a good set of HD tractor V-bar chains. I wonder - do the Euro style provide an extra level of traction & safety equal to the increase in price over V-bar.

The simple answer is: "Yes, the Euro style chains do provide an extra level of traction & safety equal to the increase in price over V-Bar." This is especially true if you are running something other than turf tires, since R4 and Ag tires allow much of the ladder-style chains to fall down between the lugs of the tire, (and by the way, V-bar just refers to the type of studs on the chain. They are available on a variety of chain styles.)

I started with 4-link ladder style chains with V-bars on my R4 tires (rear tires only). They did fine getting my tractor up and down my driveway in most of the winter conditions we experienced. They did not do so well on side hills. I wanted better lateral traction for side hills and my work in the woods, so I got DuoGrip chains with V-bars. These helped the lateral traction significantly. The down side is that it made for an extremely rough ride at moderate to high speeds. Since I have a lot of ground to cover at home, and regularly drive my tractor over the road to another property several miles away, that rough ride was unacceptable: I thought I was going to shake myself or the tractor to pieces.

I finally switched to OFA EKO 8 chains (a larger tractor would use OFA EKO 9 chains). These are "Euro-style" chains with studs. It provides excellent forward traction, as well as very good lateral traction. They are the chains I should have started off with, but I thought I could save some money. Do yourself a favor, and start with top-notch chains. You don't want to have to buy your chains two or three tmes.

 

[oosik]

Thanks for your input John_Mc. One thing for sure - the V-bar chains I had rode like a COB. If I would have had to do a lot of "rode riding" it would have definitely been some other style. The mile long trips up/down my driveway were very convincing. However - there is no sidehill work or long rode trips here. And now with the significantly larger tractor - no need for chains.

This may be the winter that provides a challenge. Those who supposedly know say it's going to be a tough winter in these parts. Time will tell.