building a earthen bridge

   / building a earthen bridge #1  

BenA

Member
Joined
Sep 30, 2004
Messages
42
Location
SW Virginia
Tractor
Kubota B7800, FEL, box blade
I presently have to ford a creek to get on my property. I can not pull my equipment trailer through the creek because it drags too badly. Does anyone know where I can find some info on building an earthen/rock bridge. I thought I would get some of the heavy gauge black plastic culvert about 24" diameter to lay in the bottom of the creek. However, I do not know the best materials to use from that point. I guess some fist size rock might be put inbetween and on top of the pipe, then some smaller gravel on that. I just want to get some info on it to be sure about what to use so it won't get washed away with the first rain. Thanks.
 
   / building a earthen bridge #2  
Make sure your tube has a smooth liner on the inside. Stops the skeeters and keeps sediment from being trapped in the grooves. Been there!
 
   / building a earthen bridge #3  
Do a search and look for culverts and the like. You will, I'm certain, get all the answers to your questions.
One bit of advice I have found to be true from the postings of the TBN Brother and Sisterhood is ,,,,,if you are thinking a 24 inch will do, then put in a 36 inch.
I wish I had had that advice that before I installed mine.
 
   / building a earthen bridge #4  
Creeks and culverts are a very tricky situation. You run into several problems. First, if determining how big it needs to be. This is determined by the worse case scenerio. Do not make the mistake of figureing what it will handle during a heavy rain, that's not nearly enough. Remember this, the experts, cities, highway departments have years and years of experience at this, and they are always replacing washed out culverts.

You don't need rock around our culvert. Clean dirt or sand works great. The idea is to get is compacted evenly on both sides. Compaction is what gives teh culvert it's strenghth. What you need to protect your fill material and keep your culvert in place is a headwall. That can be built up of lots of rock that't too big to wash away during a heavey storm, or sacks of concrete stacked on each other, or concrete poured into a solid wall. If water can get past the pipe, it will wash out your culvert. Since it never stops trying, 24/7, it will succeed unless you do it right.

The other option is a wet crossing, or a combination of a smaller culvert with a wet crossing on top of it. If you put in a small culvert that will handle the day to day water flow, then pour concrete along the sides and top so that water can flow over it when you have heavy rains, that wold also work. It's not as simple as it sounds because the water will eat out all the supporting material around the concrete over the years unless you dig down your footings really deep. I've never done this, but have seen it done on others ranches. Some have failed because they cut a corner, others are working just fine. You just have to realize that on heavy rains, you cannot cross the creek.

Buy the next larger culvert then you will ever need and pray that you are right. Whatever it costs, it's cheaper then having to redo it again.

Eddie
 
   / building a earthen bridge #5  
Eddie, You are actually building another gravity dam but with larger and lower overflow pipe(s).

When you worst case the flow be a tad lavish and give yourself more cross section in the drain pipes.

In a flood event if the bridge/dam temporarily holds back some water but does not have water flowing over the top AND your dirt is high enough above the height of the water to provide sufficient down force you will be OK.

An alternative is to split the difference. Design for expected flows (through the drain pipes) but prepare for overflow over the bridge by shotcrete or other anti-erosion coating on at least the downstream side. The downstream side generates destructive turbulence which causes rapid erosion.

The dam of one of my smaller ponds (in a chain of ponds) has a 30 inch culvert under my driveway which crosses that dam. Even in the wettest year on record I never saw the culvert much over 1/2 full. I have no overflow swale for this pond as the dam is the driveway. I had all the redi-crete trucks use the back side of the dam for their cleanout dump area so it ended up with considerable concrete coverage which will armor that backside against the erosion of an overflow event should we get one. The crete has been on the ground over 3 years and is lasting just fine so far even with my driving a tractor on it frequently.

Pat
 
   / building a earthen bridge
  • Thread Starter
#6  
Thanks for your suggestions, and you are likely right about going to larger culvert than what I think I need. The creek is probably about 12 feet wide with the road (more like a path) sloping down to it on both sides. I will have to put several pieces of culvert side to side to make the width. I may need to use some 3 foot diameter for the main body of the creek and some 2 foot diameter on the outer edges for when the water get higher. Thanks again for your ideas and I will likely post a picture before starting to see if anyone has thoughts to add.
 
   / building a earthen bridge #7  
a suggestion
Try the forest service website
out here they are always involved in maintaining roads thru the national forests and keeping them up for logging and general access.
it will take some wading thru their sites but the info is there
Don
 
   / building a earthen bridge #8  
I've never done this myself, but from what I hear, if you use multiple pipes, space them far enough apart that you can compact the fill between them, all around the pipe. I think one of our members did some multiple pipes laid side-by-side and the fill wasn't compacted between, underneath. That's right where the water wants to go!

Keep us posted, and of course, we love pics of projects like this!
 
   / building a earthen bridge #9  
Whatever you build, build it to withstand water flowing over it. Last summer we had horrific flooding around here and I saw first hand where 8' and 12' culverts were washed out and were actually moved 1/2mile down stream. I saw three of these and I'm sure there were more. Everyone will think your crazy while you're building it but some day you'll be happily driving home while they're staring at their driveway with a huge hole in it. Even a little water is an incredibly formidable force!
 
   / building a earthen bridge #10  
BenA said:
Thanks for your suggestions, and you are likely right about going to larger culvert than what I think I need. The creek is probably about 12 feet wide with the road (more like a path) sloping down to it on both sides. I will have to put several pieces of culvert side to side to make the width. I may need to use some 3 foot diameter for the main body of the creek and some 2 foot diameter on the outer edges for when the water get higher. Thanks again for your ideas and I will likely post a picture before starting to see if anyone has thoughts to add.

Before you start, I'd recommend you run your plan past the Water Resource Board...In Vermont, anything we do near a waterway has to to be blessed by the Staties...:eek:
 
   / building a earthen bridge #11  
For what it is worth, I would do this in your situation:

1- Make it only as high as is needed to clear the size pipes you use while at the same time making it a straight enough horizontal path so that you intended trailer etc won't hang up. The idea would be to make it usable while giving the moving water the ability to flow easily over the entire structure during heavy flooding

2- I would backfill the pipes with some sort of sharp stone (as opposed to smooth stone that won't bind on its neighbors)

3- I would cover the backfill (especially on the sides) with either geo matt or some sort of landscape fabric to hold things in place

4- Cover the sides with a significant amount of rip rap style rocks

5- Cover the top with your choice of gravel

What ever you decide, post some pics!
 
   / building a earthen bridge #12  
bx24 said:
For what it is worth, I would do this in your situation:

1- Make it only as high as is needed to clear the size pipes you use while at the same time making it a straight enough horizontal path so that you intended trailer etc won't hang up. The idea would be to make it usable while giving the moving water the ability to flow easily over the entire structure during heavy flooding

2- I would backfill the pipes with some sort of sharp stone (as opposed to smooth stone that won't bind on its neighbors)

3- I would cover the backfill (especially on the sides) with either geo matt or some sort of landscape fabric to hold things in place

4- Cover the sides with a significant amount of rip rap style rocks

5- Cover the top with your choice of gravel

What ever you decide, post some pics!

If the above method is selected then consideration of how to protect the downstream side of the bridge is needed. The turbulent flow on the back side is extremely eroding and it is unlikely that geotextile will be sufficient in a significant overflow event. Also there will be no gravel on the roadbed after a significant overflow event and the surface will be eroded. Blacktop or similar would survive better.

It would be nice if there were a budget for some concrete work.

Pat
 
   / building a earthen bridge #13  
Do you have any idea of the rate of maximum water flow as this is the place to start from.

You may be better off by eliminating the culvert and going with a wet crossing that allows your equipment to clear under normal conditions. The actual crossing should have some piles with concrete facing and top with a well designed backside incorporating a hydraulic jump to eliminate washing out the backside. The upstream side could be protected by some of the numerous Vermont boulders.

Making a stream crossing should be simple but trust me, we can complicate it imensley!:D :D :D
 
   / building a earthen bridge #14  
GordonR said:
a suggestion
Try the forest service website
out here they are always involved in maintaining roads thru the national forests and keeping them up for logging and general access.
it will take some wading thru their sites but the info is there
Don

I don't know the requirements for Virginia but there's been a big push out here in Oregon to revise the way culverts are being installed. They've found that a lot of culverts were blocking salmon, steelhead and resident fish from using the spawning beds in small streams. There's a replacement program going on and it's pretty cool to see the fish moving through the suburban, urban and neighborhood streams.

The Oregon Road/Stream Crossing Restoration Guide has some pretty handy but government-ese information. The whole guide is here and an appendix -- with more human language -- with guidlines and laws for things like how high above waterline the exit should be is at http://www.4sos.org/wssupport/ws_rest/OregonRestGuide/AppendixA.pdf
 
   / building a earthen bridge #17  
Why not use concrete pipe with 36" opening? Than the dirt does not have to be so high.

That's one of the differences, in Europe they use concrete pipes all the time.
 
   / building a earthen bridge #18  
I've had my share of washed out culvert pipes. We've had at least three "100-year" rain events in the past 20 years. The amount of runoff was incredible. Trash and debris will obstruct culvert pipes every time and then they overflow and wash out the fill, and that's if the beavers don't obstruct it first.

I have a feeling there is no economical amount of culvert pipe that will withstand a flood in your situation.

You might have to just dump a bunch of rock in the creek bed and ford it.
 
   / building a earthen bridge #19  
the biggest question will be are trees going down that creek during a flood? even smaller trees will plug any culvert you got in a jiffy. where I used to live there was a creek that started ankle deep it had 2 20'? square openings and a 4 lane road over the top. I have seen a mess of trees left behind on the upstreem side and the watter roaring over the top of that road. that creek often dries up in summer.
 

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