Barn Renovation Project

[TAB]

Steve do you know of any groups or organizations in or close to So. Michigan that lists barns that need salvaged. I would like to move a barn to my place, but around here many are just pulled down and burned.

 

[rancar]

Tom...

<font color=blue>"...do you know of any groups or organizations in or close to So. Michigan that lists barns that need salvaged. I would like to move a barn to my place, but around here many are just pulled down and burned"</font color=blue>

Do a search on google for 'old barn salvage' There are a ton of links that pop up. You may find something there that will give you some good direction.

Bob

 

[TAB]

Thanks Bob. Moving or taking down and relocating a barn would be a great project for next summer. Maybe I could find and make the deal by then. Tom

 

[gmason]

Bob, some beautiful work you've done here. Both in the barn and the before/after pictures.
One thing missing that you brefly mentioned in one of your first post there, was the inscriptions on the copula. Some pictures would be a good way to document these writings.

My father would allways write something on the furniture he restored, usually the history of the piece, when and where he got it, and usually the price he paid(if anything) for it.

These are really as interesting to read as the furniture itself.

thanks for keeping these pieces of history alive and well.
gary

 

[rancar]

Thanks for the suggestions Gary. I too have been initialling and dating inside the cupola every time I have painted the barn....so far three times. But you've given me now further thoughts to preserve the memories this barn holds. Thanks again.

Bob

 

[AndyR]

Nice job! From what I could see of your beams it looks like a canted queenpost frame. Do you have any good dates for the original erection of the frame? Also, have you seen any "marriage marks" near the joinery where 2 pieces come together? I just returned from 2 weeks on the road - the first week being a member of the repair and raising crew of <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.tfguild.org/rendezvous/cuvilly702.html>this barn in Ipswich, Ma.</A> I have a 40x80 barn built in 1852 that I am working on as time permits and I may end up taking it down in order to fully repair it. I'd be interested in hearing about what repairs you made to the post feet and sills in your barn.

 

[rancar]

Hi Andy....

These were great pics of the barn raising in Ipswich, Mass. My wife was born in Ipswich and she was most intrigued when I showed her these pics.

To answer your first two queries...no and no. I'm not saying they're not there. I just haven't found them. It's just been very difficult finding dates as most of the framework has been white washed on the ground level. This, plus accumulated decades of cobwebs and dirt hide an aweful lot. That's why I've had such a difficult time dating this building. Where did builders typically put these marks?

Apart from the front end of the barn that was razed because it was too far gone, the rear of the barn was where I had much of the water and dry rot damage. About half of the post feet were repaired or entire posts replaced. Barn was jacked up and new posts were installed or post feet spliced in where appropriate. Sill plates were also replaced with pressure treated 2"x8" or 8"x8". I would have preferred to go with something more original that matched the original framework of the barn but the fellow doing this work recommended the pressure treated due to rain and moisture problems that were impacting the sills. I was fortunate in that my foundation was still in relatively good shape.

What can you tell me about a 'canted queenpost frame'? I'm not that well read up on the different building techniques from the 1800s. Is this a typical or atypical frame builders used during this time?

Bob

 

[RobS]

Beautiful restoration work Bob and splendid barns you have to work with! Add that nice setting and you've got quite the place there. I'm truly impressed. One of these years we hope to build a barn on our place. It will be in the style of your main barn, but won't be anywhere near the construction methods.

How big an operation was your farm in it's heyday? Any vintage photos?

Thanks for sharing your work /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

 

[hazmat]

Bob,

thanks for the Barn Encouragement.

Andy,

Great pics on the Ipswich project. I'm not far from Ipswich and read about the raising in the Newburyport Daily News. I was sad that I read about it after it was already done, I would have loved to go see it. I guess I'll have to periodically check in on the Timber Guild web page to see if any more barns / houses are being raised in my area.

 

[rancar]

Hi Rob....

Thanks for the kind words. The post and beam barn is truly worth the money if you decide to build. I've always thought this type of construction is superior to regular stick builts or pole barns that are commonly built today. One way to economize, especially if the barn isn't all that big and you're handy with the hammer is to have a professional barn builder install the foundation and erect the post and beam framework. Then, you do the rest....roofing, siding, windows, and the rest. I've always thought this latter was the fun part of building anyway.

The farm in years gone by was not a very big operation. The main barn's old milking parlor could only accommodate approximately 30 milkers and a half dozen heifers/calfs. There was also an old hog barn on the property until the middle 1980s. This fell down one day as the roof was shot and rainwater rotted out some of the support posts. I was sorry to see this go as this was a real nice barn. I did salvage the old hog scalding pot. This is in nice condition, no cracks. Will be painting it up and bringing it out for flower planting one day. Sorry, I have no photos earlier than the 1950s. And these look not much better than the 'before' shots that I've posted. This barn was in real sorry shape as I don't think anyone maintained it for a good 75 years or so.

For what's it's worth, if I was building from scratch and looking to erect a barn, I would spend the extra amount and build post and beam. The barn could be combined with an attached workshop, small apartment, etc. It has character, it's stronger and more durable, and it's more versatile than stick builts.

Bob

 

[AndyR]

Re: Canted Queenpost timber frame. From what I could see in your picutres, you have common rafters supported by a canted purlin plate (that being the long plate, holding up the rafters mid-span,held by short angled beams. Take a look at <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.tfguild.org/workshops/gouldfarm/barnjuly29e.html>pictures of the Gould Farm barn raising</A> to see one of those plates being placed and how it sits in a completed frame. To the best of my (still learning) knowledge, this type of construction was not uncommon. Hope this helps.

 

[rancar]

Thanks Andy for the pics. I'd say you're right. My barn's framework is just like this new one being erected. Thanks for improving my knowledge base a bit more on what I have.

Bob

 

[RichZ]

Bob, I don't know how I missed this thread until now. What a great job! I'm proud that you're a Cambridge neighbor, and you saved all those buildings. I'm proud to have just my two old barns, but yours are spectacular!!!

 

[rancar]

Thanks Rich. I know what you mean about missing threads...miss a few days at TBN and it's tough catching up with everything. /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif You've got a couple of treasures there yourself. They just don't make them the way they used to and they're well worth saving. I look upon them also as an investment...sort of like antiques. The older they are....the more valuable they become.

Enjoy Empire Farm Days!!!! Wish I could have joined you, but I'm taking this week off from work to...guess what....painting my barn. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif Maybe, next year.

Bob

 

[RichZ]

Bob, I agree with you about old buildings. I'm sure glad you saved yours, it makes our town that much richer!

Take a day off from painting and meet us at Empire Farm Days!! I'm sure we'll all have a great time!

 

[bmabe]

Bob,
I wanted to add my congratulations on the fine restoration work and a few comments of my own. When I bought my property about 4 or 5 miles north of you, one of the major selling features was a 30'x40' bank barn of roughly the same vintage and construction as yours. The house was long gone (bulldozed to reduce the taxes, I heard) and the barn was in questionable condition.

I had plans and hoped to convert it to a house as my freind had done a mile away. But several contractors told me it was too far gone and not safe enough to even jack up. The sills were totally rotted away, the up hill side had a field stone wall that was bowed in 2 feet and collapsing. But the worst and best part of it was the slate roof. As you know, there are quite a few barns and utility buildings in our area with slate roofs. They look great but, literally, weigh a ton (or about 600 lbs per square).

That and gravity won the the race to rebuild my barn. Got a call from my neighbor - "Good news / Bad news - Your taxes are going down because your barn came down in a storm last night." Most of the beams and posts fractured under the weight of the slate and everything salvageable was buried under the roof except for some of the vertical pine boards.

Anyway, mine was very similar in design to yours, but not as fancy and never painted. I thank you for sharing the photos and can say with certainty that no one can imagine how much work it must have taken to bring your structures to the stage they're at today. A beautiful story.

Barry Mabery
Colfax Mountain
Cambridge, NY

 

[rancar]

Thanks for your kind remarks Barry. I'm sorry to hear that you lost your barn. It's possible that some of the timbers may be salvageable and worth saving if you're thinking of re-building a smaller building. I too lost a hog barn up my way in 1985 in the same similar way that you lost yours. The roof was rusting out and too much rain water had seaped in and rotted many of the posts and beams. I came home one day and half the barn had fallen over. I had hoped to save this barn as it had many unique features to it, but there was also an incredible amount of time needed to necessitate repairs, time I really didn't have.

I trust you're enjoying the lovely summer we've been having in the Cambridge Valley. Look forward to meeting you sometime. Stop by if and when you have extra time during one of your trips up here.

Bob

 

[Fireman_dcb]

rancar,


congratulations! Outstanding job on the renovation! My wife and I are looking at renovating a small 20'x40' 2 story barn with a lean-to attached, all built in the early 1800's. Siding, flooring and roof all have to be replaced - the hand cut beams and pegs are all in great shape. What did you use for siding? did you have any problems with the main beams near the exterior of the building being rotted out? How long did your project take to complete? Did you do all/most/ some of the work? Thanks in advance... Doug

 

[rancar]

Hi Doug....

Thanks for your kind remarks. To answer your queries......

<font color=blue>What did you use for siding?</font color=blue>

Some of the siding is the original...primarily that which is on the north side, away from the sun and driven rain. That siding which I did replace I did so with used clapboard that I had or new 1"x8" clapboard that I purchased from the local lumber yard.

<font color=blue>Did you have any problems with the main beams near the exterior of the building being rotted out?</font color=blue>

No real problems with the beams except for the front of the barn that was razed due to fact most of the posts were leaning precariously. This part of the barn was replaced by the new 2-car garage. In the back of the barn some of the posts and sill plates had to be replaced due to rot.

<font color=blue>How long did your project take to complete?</font color=blue>

The renovation work was done in 1984-85. Continuing repair and maintenance is on-going whenever I need to replace a clapboard here and there or when I need to rebuild a window or two. Some of this is done everytime I paint the barn....every 7-8 years.

<font color=blue>Did you do all/most/ some of the work?</font color=blue>

The post and sill work was done in 1984-85 and contracted out to a specialist in old barn renovation. Much of the roof I replaced myself except for the main barn where I hired a roofer to do this work since I lacked the equipment and skills working at this height. The cupola roof was replaced in 2001, again by a roofer that had the equipment and skills working at this height. The remainder of the roofs I replaced myself. All the on-going maintenance I do myself whenever conditions warrant it. All the barn buildings are on a 7-8 year paint cycle. I normally can't get it done in a single season and spread it out over two summers. I just started painting again. Many of the AFTER pictures you see were just taken after I painted these smaller buildings during the summer of 2001. I'm now finishing up the main barn and should be finished with the entire job by the end of next month.

Hope this helps.

Bob

 

[rancar]

From an older USA Today story....here's a call to save those old barn structures..... /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

American Landscape Losing It's Old Barns