RegL
Platinum Member
One thing not mentioned yet. Before you start digging, you should call in a utility locating servece to mark any that might be there. Big fines for digging up phone cables, electric,ect. Not to mention it could light you up.
Backhoe Backhoe trenching
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LBrown59
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you should call in a utility locating service to mark any that might be there.
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Just because you call it don't mean all utilities will mark their lines because not all the companies are signed up with the call before you dig utility locating service outfits.
I ran into this last Monday when I called call before you dig.
I had to call and notify the TV cable company the water company and a sewer out fit I didn't even know was around because none of them were signed up with call before you dig so the utility locating service would not notify these three utilities.
So I had to do that on my own.
Disclaimer:
This was just relating my experience but since experience don't count naturally someone without this experience would know more about it.
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Just because you call it don't mean all utilities will mark their lines because not all the companies are signed up with the call before you dig utility locating service outfits.
I ran into this last Monday when I called call before you dig.
I had to call and notify the TV cable company the water company and a sewer out fit I didn't even know was around because none of them were signed up with call before you dig so the utility locating service would not notify these three utilities.
So I had to do that on my own.
Disclaimer:
This was just relating my experience but since experience don't count naturally someone without this experience would know more about it.
Good points about the utility locator service. I have taken care of that one already. And Lbrown59, while reading your post, I began to think that you were finally getting it. But Nope, you had to throw the disclaimer in there just to incite someone. Just Grow up Man, were here to talk tractors. Not see who we can flame.
PineRidge
Super Member
I do agree with calling the local utilities before you start your dig.
One one particular project the gas company marked their line on the opposite side of the drive where it was actually located so they aren't infallible guys. You would have at least thought that the gas meter on the correct side of the house might have tipped their mistake but hey it was a Monday...... /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif
When I use the BH I always expect the unexpected that way I'm never surprised when I find it.
One one particular project the gas company marked their line on the opposite side of the drive where it was actually located so they aren't infallible guys. You would have at least thought that the gas meter on the correct side of the house might have tipped their mistake but hey it was a Monday...... /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif
When I use the BH I always expect the unexpected that way I'm never surprised when I find it.
marks
Silver Member
Rent a ride-on-trencher, i.e. a Ditch Witch I trenched one-half mile in three hours. The soil is clay with some rocks, you can expect some bouncing. Trenching shovels work well for cleaning out the bottom of the trench. As already mentioned contacting the local Underground Service Alert company is a must, yet look for culverts other indicators of sprinkler systems and so forth.
rswyan
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</font><font color="blue" class="small">( One one particular project the gas company marked their line on the opposite side of the drive where it was actually located so they aren't infallible guys. You would have at least thought that the gas meter on the correct side of the house might have tipped their mistake but hey it was a Monday...... )</font>
When I was trenching for my french drain and had them out I found out something interesting - the guy who showed up was only there to mark the large high-pressure transmission line that runs across our property. Said a different Dominion East Ohio business unit handles marking the lines that feed premises and he only did the transmission lines. (The premise line and the transmission line are within a couple of feet of each other but are not connected)
Oh yeah - the guys that handle the premise lines either never showed up - or saw the flags that the transmission line guy had put out and figured someone else already tagged them. Didn't bother to stop by or call. Gotta love it.
When I was trenching for my french drain and had them out I found out something interesting - the guy who showed up was only there to mark the large high-pressure transmission line that runs across our property. Said a different Dominion East Ohio business unit handles marking the lines that feed premises and he only did the transmission lines. (The premise line and the transmission line are within a couple of feet of each other but are not connected)
Oh yeah - the guys that handle the premise lines either never showed up - or saw the flags that the transmission line guy had put out and figured someone else already tagged them. Didn't bother to stop by or call. Gotta love it.
PineRidge
Super Member
Rswyan I'll just bet if someone hit their gas line as a result of improperly marking or in your case not marking it at all they would scramble for excuses.
Since they run a tracer wire with the non-metallic gas line I really don't know how one could ever be marked incorrectly in the first place.
Since they run a tracer wire with the non-metallic gas line I really don't know how one could ever be marked incorrectly in the first place.
LBrown59
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I had to dig a ditch that I had to start at both ends and work toward the middle.
I got it all done but about 15 feet in the middle.
How do I dig this 15' out between the ends of the 2 trenches to link them together?
I got it all done but about 15 feet in the middle.
How do I dig this 15' out between the ends of the 2 trenches to link them together?
kn6md
Member
I have handled the trench meeting in the middle problem two ways. The easiest was for a trench that did not need inspection—I dug about 75% one way, put the PVC water pipe in, and back filled enough to be able to drive over. Turn the backhoe around, start at the other end, and you are able to just back off and over the trench when you reach the backfilled area.
The second method I used was to fill the trench with sections of rail road ties to ground level, cover with three quarter plywood, and drive off. This trench had to stay open for an electrical inspection.
My backhoe will lift the tractor up off of the extended backhoe feet so I can move the machine right or left with the hoe controls to stay centered on the painted dig stripe but only if the FEL is off the ground so that the unit can rotate on the front wheels. Accordingly, I don’t think I could “walk” the backhoe off of the trench like the big Case (and other) machines can. I also don’t know how anyway—I need to see it done--but would probably be afraid to try it.
Another solution mentioned somewhere in TBN was to did a perpendicular trench (in your case 15 feet wide) to connect the two trenches. This has always involved tearing up too much ground for me, although it would work just fine.
Good luck,
Bill Vorhies
The second method I used was to fill the trench with sections of rail road ties to ground level, cover with three quarter plywood, and drive off. This trench had to stay open for an electrical inspection.
My backhoe will lift the tractor up off of the extended backhoe feet so I can move the machine right or left with the hoe controls to stay centered on the painted dig stripe but only if the FEL is off the ground so that the unit can rotate on the front wheels. Accordingly, I don’t think I could “walk” the backhoe off of the trench like the big Case (and other) machines can. I also don’t know how anyway—I need to see it done--but would probably be afraid to try it.
Another solution mentioned somewhere in TBN was to did a perpendicular trench (in your case 15 feet wide) to connect the two trenches. This has always involved tearing up too much ground for me, although it would work just fine.
Good luck,
Bill Vorhies
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chatcher
Silver Member
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I had to dig a ditch that I had to start at both ends and work toward the middle.
I got it all done but about 15 feet in the middle.
How do I dig this 15' out between the ends of the 2 trenches to link them together? )</font>
I can back mine up to the trench until the BH boom pivot is centered over it, and rotate the boom until it is aligned with it. If I happen to get the tractor exactly perpendicular to the trench I can even dig in both directions. The only annoyance is snagging the bucket teeth on the stabilizer pads if I try to dig too close to the tractor. Just be sure to be on the "exit" side of the trench so you don't have to cross it when you're finished. Although with a 12" bucket I can usually cross an open trench without causing too much damage to it.
I got it all done but about 15 feet in the middle.
How do I dig this 15' out between the ends of the 2 trenches to link them together? )</font>
I can back mine up to the trench until the BH boom pivot is centered over it, and rotate the boom until it is aligned with it. If I happen to get the tractor exactly perpendicular to the trench I can even dig in both directions. The only annoyance is snagging the bucket teeth on the stabilizer pads if I try to dig too close to the tractor. Just be sure to be on the "exit" side of the trench so you don't have to cross it when you're finished. Although with a 12" bucket I can usually cross an open trench without causing too much damage to it.
bandit67
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The BX hoe doesn't have a wide enough swing arc to do what you can do with your machine. At the angle you have to get while trying to get as close to perpendicular to the trench, one of the stabilizers ends up right in the trench. The only way I was able to connect the two ends was to dig a big hole at the center - kind of messy and a bit of overkill, but still better than hand digging. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
chatcher
Silver Member
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( The BX hoe doesn't have a wide enough swing arc to do what you can do with your machine. At the angle you have to get while trying to get as close to perpendicular to the trench, one of the stabilizers ends up right in the trench. The only way I was able to connect the two ends was to dig a big hole at the center - kind of messy and a bit of overkill, but still better than hand digging. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif )</font>
Then I'd probably either use a stout piece of wood across the trench under the stabilizer while digging at an angle, or finish the whole trench straddling it and then use boards to escape.
Then I'd probably either use a stout piece of wood across the trench under the stabilizer while digging at an angle, or finish the whole trench straddling it and then use boards to escape.
Varmintmist
Platinum Member
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Rswyan I'll just bet if someone hit their gas line as a result of improperly marking or in your case not marking it at all they would scramble for excuses.
Since they run a tracer wire with the non-metallic gas line I really don't know how one could ever be marked incorrectly in the first place. )</font>
They would make excuses, but if you called before you dug, they wouldnt be making bills. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
As to underground locating. It is as much witchery as it is tech. It isnt as simple as plopping a box down and painting grass. You do need to know what you are doing. The way the marks get way off is if they use a locator set up to run the tone by induction or if the wire gets grounded. When you do this, if the tone wants to follow more than one underground whatever (it will chase tel, pwr, tracer wire, old pipe) it will give you a nice strong signal IN THE MIDDLE of all of the ug utilities. It is operator error.
BUT, if you called and you did not machine dig 18in to either side of their mark, you are covered. (18 in PA, I have heard 24 in other places)
Since they run a tracer wire with the non-metallic gas line I really don't know how one could ever be marked incorrectly in the first place. )</font>
They would make excuses, but if you called before you dug, they wouldnt be making bills. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
As to underground locating. It is as much witchery as it is tech. It isnt as simple as plopping a box down and painting grass. You do need to know what you are doing. The way the marks get way off is if they use a locator set up to run the tone by induction or if the wire gets grounded. When you do this, if the tone wants to follow more than one underground whatever (it will chase tel, pwr, tracer wire, old pipe) it will give you a nice strong signal IN THE MIDDLE of all of the ug utilities. It is operator error.
BUT, if you called and you did not machine dig 18in to either side of their mark, you are covered. (18 in PA, I have heard 24 in other places)
bandit67
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I must've had good locators (had it done a few times for verification). When I dug the holes for my pole barn, I drilled 6-18" dia holes with the centers just under 24" away from the marking for the phone line, and a 7th hole 3'-2" apart center-to-center from one of the end holes, with the phone line running between those 2, and never hit the line. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
LBrown59
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When I called the gas and phone companies came out.
Electric company never showed up.
Electric company never showed up.
LBrown59
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I was able to narrow the 15 feet down to about 12'
by placing the nose of the tractor about even with the end of the lower ditch and digging the upper ditch another 3 feet longer the normal way.
To take out the other 12 feet I angled the tractor to where the rear wheels would be just to the left side of the ditch.
After getting another 3 feet out by digging from this angle I placed the tractor at the same angle but 3 feet up from where I had it and dug another 3 feet of ditch.
Now for the last 6 feet I placed the tractor perpendicular to the trench and about 3 feet further up. By swinging the boom left and right I got another 3 feet of the ditch dug. Parked the tractor perpendicular again centered near the middle of the last 3 feet remaining and dug it out also by swinging the boom left and right.
When i finished i was on the left side of the ditch in the front yard where i wanted to be when i got done,
Surprisingly doing it this way this 12 foot of trenching doesn't appear much different from the rest of the ditch.
It wasn't much wider than the rest of the ditch and there wasn't an excessive amount of dirt taken out for this 12 feet of trenching.
by placing the nose of the tractor about even with the end of the lower ditch and digging the upper ditch another 3 feet longer the normal way.
To take out the other 12 feet I angled the tractor to where the rear wheels would be just to the left side of the ditch.
After getting another 3 feet out by digging from this angle I placed the tractor at the same angle but 3 feet up from where I had it and dug another 3 feet of ditch.
Now for the last 6 feet I placed the tractor perpendicular to the trench and about 3 feet further up. By swinging the boom left and right I got another 3 feet of the ditch dug. Parked the tractor perpendicular again centered near the middle of the last 3 feet remaining and dug it out also by swinging the boom left and right.
When i finished i was on the left side of the ditch in the front yard where i wanted to be when i got done,
Surprisingly doing it this way this 12 foot of trenching doesn't appear much different from the rest of the ditch.
It wasn't much wider than the rest of the ditch and there wasn't an excessive amount of dirt taken out for this 12 feet of trenching.
